-
(
jebers,
12-05-2004)
As a longtime fan of the MOO series I can wrap up my feelings for MOO3 as follows:
The hour I spent reading reviews was more enjoyable than all the time I spent playing the game.
-
(
boolybooly,
02-16-2004)
MoO3 is a barely playable disaster of a game. Post patch it has been left in a pre-beta state. Infogrames aka Atari have presided over another upset in Galactic 4x namely Imperium Galactica 2 as another reviewer observed and it is uncertain whether this is coincidence, but IG2's difficulties are as nothing compared to MoO3's. How they had the audacity to release MoO3 and then abandon it in its current state I will never know, but I will not take anything Atari or QS on trust again.
Apart from the fact that MoO3 looks and plays like an adapted spreadsheet programme, the design is woolly headed and filled with impractical realisations of irrelevant game mechanics. The interface is poorly conceived and has been left simply unfinished as have certain crucial game elements such as sending X discovery fleets, where place holder code has apparently been left in the released game. QS are much better at making excuses than they are at making games, even so the people responsible for the initial design of MoO3 should not work in games design in future, for everyone's sake.
Apart from the point defence issues, the battles play out without any other showstopper bugs and would have been impressive if MoO3 had been released in about 1997, but it wasnt. The world moved on from Voxel Graphics for reasons which become obvious if you look at all closely at the rendering, but left MoO3 behind in the process.
The gameplay is a mixture of tedium and irritation beyond expression, all of which must be endured to discover an occasional glimmer of the 4X's we want in a Galactic 4X namely eXploration, eXpansion, eXploitation, eXtermination. The much hyped fifth X is of course the eXcruciation of trying to use the interface to play the game it displays for you.
MoO3 can only really be appreciated as a piece of surreality and in that context it is comical, like a piece of modernist art designed to confuse and obstruct it reflects the difficulties of governmental obfuscation at least as frighteningly as "1984" or "Brazil". Whether this was the intention remains debatable but the outcome is a nightmare among games.
-
(
Greg1,
02-08-2004)
The game is full of brilliant ideas, but the implementation is awful. The game throws waves of useless information at you while hiding the interesting information (like what each tech does). The game plays itself for you in places where you want to be making the decisions, but also forces you perform mechanical functions that the game should be doing for you. Not enough has been said about this last problem, so let me give a couple of examples.
1. Diplomacy. If I want maximum economic trade with another empire, I shouldn't have to open up the diplomacy screen every turn and keep clicking on a button that asks "more trade, Mr. Jellyfish?". I should just be able to give an order to some flunky to keep asking the jellfish for more trade and the flunky can send me a report when things go well or badly.
3. Design upgrades. It is great that the game has an auto-design function for ships, but if I develop a better forcefield (or whatever), I shouldn't have to go back and redesign all my ships so that they use it. When a technological development renders old technology obsolete, it should automatically replace it on all new builds.
-
(
neree,
10-15-2003)
I remember the day when I bought this game, It was the realese date and I went down to my local gameshop to get me a brand neww copy of the game I had been waiting for during the last years.
I spent two full days trying to have fun with this creation but that is just not possible. The game is complex, witch can be a good thing as long as the game does not get tedious.
Unfortunatly MOOIII is teadious, extremely tedious.
After playing the game for two days I uninstalled it and spent some days playing Space Empires III, a 5 meg windows based 4x game. I hade so much more fun with that old game.
And concerning Master of Orion: It has only been installed once again on my computer, to see what was changed by the patch.....needless to say the game was uninstaled again within a few hours.
How could a sequel to the best 4x games ever come to this? How could they screw up MOO?!?
-
(
BenRipped,
07-24-2003)
MoO3 was a great concept. The game falls far short of the goal.
The best use of the manual is in the bathroom... when you run out of TP.
Post 1.2.5 Patch: The game's economic structure is critically broken both pre and post patch.
The patch fixed a few problems and created more problems. The remaining programmers at QSI haven't a clue as to the structure of the program code. And they refuse to address any problems with it.
There are so many trivial things wrong with the game that they ad up to a total rip-off of the consumer.
Atari Is not interested in supporting the game and have made it clear that what you see now is what you get.
I want my money back and the only way to get it is through a class action suit!
-
(
Boban,
05-21-2003)
This is an autistic game. ;(
And should I mention it: this is not the first, nor is the last time, the Infogrames did it! You expect this game to be patched and imporoved? Forget it. Like Imperium Galactica, like Civ III - this game is full of unnecessary good graphics (like animated aliens) and short with good ship and combat graphics, which this game wass supposed to be about.
Task forces, ground forces - creation of those is so intuitive, that it resets to default every time you want to make a little change! This is unforgivable, since the times of C64 and Spectrum. I lost lots of nerves creating rookie divisions instead of veterans, just because of this. Or ships with stupid names like LRCVER5!!!! Make one change on the design - it resets the name. Or worse, the whole thing resets to default stupid starbase... so you have to click, and click, and click until you get what you want...
A nice ship graphics are missing, put this there, that over there, make it interesting. As it is - you have to fight through those tiny menues to get numerical info on weapons and other stuff. Totally irritating, more than boring.
Getting into systems to see planets - several clicks instead of one click.
The biggest disappointment was combat screen. There is a fight to be initiated... Where? What? What ship I have there? A recon ship. Yeah, what weapons it has? I have no idea. Which model it is? No idea. Who is the enemy? KVRHM-567... Really? Don't say... Where are their ships? What? That tiny dot over there, which appears and dissapears all the time. That's a ship? How do I control this ship of mine, of which the only info I get is "25" strength of beam weapons...
it seems that the authors really lost it. Nice package, but no essence. No spirit. No humor. Events? Someone already described them... I'd really like to see these events in a form of sub-quests. make some of them like a joke.
Exploring in the game is all about whether you will find splinters or some advanced tech - boring, unimaginative.
Magnate civilizations - what about them? You land an outpost there, you get absolutely no info on that planet. What buildings are there, how many people you have there - they all mix with this magnate race and that's it. A number - 5678...
I will rate this game as less than average, because a whole chunk is missing. The most important chunk. Complex economy, and working (I suppose at least it works) that is good. But everything else is underdeveloped, and many things are build upon a wrong idea, a terrorizing idea, like armies in CIV III. You can put a unit into the army, but you can't take it out. Really?
And ... where are Elerians? Another bit of "reality" to terrorize players...
bobi
-
(
Kahn,
05-14-2003)
The previous reviews have left out one VERY improtant point you should consider before wasting your money on this lesson in how not to program a game. About 50% of the folks who have bought it suffer very frequent "DirectX Surface not Available" error. Frequent enough to make the game completely unplayable. The programmers have even managed to screw up the Bink video API (which is extreamly stable under normal circumstances). Not once have I been able to even watch the intro (the first sign of a bad game since it's over 8 minutes long, if you got to pad a game that much, it's a sure sign of trouble) all the way through without it crashing to what is now commonly refered to as the DXSNA error.
I might have even liked the game if I could play it. With the 3 month anniversary rapidly approching and no patch addressing the problem in sight, this is one developer I will avoid in the future. No wonder Infogrames changed it's name to Atari.
-
(
Nyghtfyr,
05-13-2003)
Say what you want about MOO3, but two things are undeniable. First, the level of complexity is remarkable. Second, the tools by which that complexity is managed seriously leech much of the 'fun' factor out of Master of Orion.
MOO3 is an ambitious game. It scales back a massive economic model into the 'Viceroy' tool, which a player can control through creating management schemes called 'Devplans.' I do not argue that this model does not work (although plenty of people have made pretty good arguements that it's badly flawed), I simply feel it is not enjoyable. The combat graphics, while '3-D', do not feel as crisp as MOO2's, which is unexcusable. Also, diplomacy speech needs to be fixed, as races currently declare war and then make peace with no real motivation, and often some of the speech is confused in a way that was clearly not intended.
One thing that MOO3 excels in is its transformation of what was a wafer-thin backstory into a compelling opening cinematic and interesting chronicle which sets the stage for the game. The backstory is so well done that when I first started the game, my expectations soared. I thought, if Quicksilver did something this peripheral so well, then the game itself must be amazing. Alas, it was not to be. While I admire the game's developers for taking a new path in recent TBS gaming by adapting 'macromanagement' instead of 'micromanagement' (which MOO2 was an undeniable exercise in) I feel they sacrificed too much of what made it absolutley impossible for me to stop clicking 'Turn' in MOO2. Gone are the Mrrshans, the Darlok, the Bulrathi, the Alkari - arguably some of the more interesting, if unrealistic, races. While the new races are actually more credible and allow for the conceivable habitation of all sorts of worlds, including gas giants, they simply aren't as compelling. At some point, Quicksilver chose realism over anthropomorphism, and I understand why. Unfortunately, it just didn't come together.
With a major code patch, MOO3 will be a playable game with at least some enjoyment factor. It deserves to be recognized for what it is: a complex economic model and ambitious simulation. But it also deserves to be criticized for divorcing itself too far from its own market and for lacking completeness upon release. 2 of 5...I probably won't play it again until the patch, and even then, I don't foresee much of a future for it on my hard drive. I will pray for MOO4.
-
(
LandBuilder,
04-03-2003)
I would agree with GameSpot completely- MOO3 is a wate of money and time- Galaytic Civilizaions is a much better game. Sometimes, the long wait does not equate to a good game!
-
(
Master Marcus,
03-31-2003)
retail version: 58% ( yes, retail, because it can be adequate to judge again the game if the devs patch it seriously within a year ). Well, I'm a bit late and we're all pretty excited by GalCiv, but for the mass of gamers it's important to say: MoO3 may be not a great game in its actual form, but a GOOD ECONOMIC TUTORIAL. The 4 diff levels are all tutorial. Consider this as THE learning curve for the most serious TBS addict whose patient enough to wait for the patches and fixes. The game is complex, yet "boring" ( very timid AI , how unfortunate but easily fixable - but for military prowess only I guess: I don't think they can really upgrade intelligently the diplo system - too broken ). After a month and 75-80 hours of gameplay, I still.......like it in a way. I recognize some great concepts here: Elder civ, magnate civs, Orion Senate layout, DEA zoning, the budgeting and the economics in general, espionage ,......but all these compounds suffer from an unpolished integration. The integration is NOT as bad as some said, but not great: the more recent reviewers giving MoO3 a "3/5 stars" average have cornered the game quite well I think. 2 quotes :
" The developers and testers got so used to this game's ponderous interface and extrem complexity that they lost sight of the average gamer, whose primary goal is to have fun" --Colin,GameRevolution
"This almost brilliant game demands too much and provides too little to win the hearts or minds of any but the most patient gamer" --ComputerGamingWorld
Well, I've recently played Civ3 ( which I gave around 87% for the release version ), Civ2 ( 90%), SMAC ( 95%- curiously, that masterpiece shares its only flaw with one of MoO3's: a timid military AI opponent ), MoO2 ( 91%), MoO1 ( 86%), MoM ( 72%), and sadly MoO3 ( release version ) falls in the second group but not the weakest: CTP2 60%, CTP1 55%, Space Empires IV 54%, Star Control3 50% just to name the TBS I've played enough.
It's possible though, that without digging all it's hidden features if it takes too much hundred of hours of gameplay AND support for fixing, MoO3 should remain a hidden masterpiece. My favorite feature, which most despise: the combat graphics!!!! I like watching those beams&missles&fighters, pretty well rendered.
Guess what if you wanted MoO2.5? It's GalCiv time.....
-
(
Hendrik,
03-26-2003)
I have put a lot of time into MoO3... and every turn I hope something exciting or different will happen. It is always just more of the same... menus, menus, and more menus. The only parts of the game that the player has to control are diplomacy, ship design, offensive actions and maybe a few dev plans.
There is a lot of complexity in the game. Somehow my mineral production is effected by my racial mineral harvesting trait, the mineral richness of the planet, the unrest level of your population and various governmental types. This is further modified by the type of region it is built in, any specials in that region or on that planet, the terrain of the region it is built in, and any modifications which expand your mineral efficiency and capacity. This is all somehow modified by tthe number of people employed in each dea on each planet in each system in your entire empire...
I can say without a doubt this is the most complex economic model I have ever seen in any game, and that only describes one of the simpler facets in the game, mineral production!
It feels like you are some accountant employed by the viceroy... you can sometimes pretend to change things but the AI usually knows better, silly for a human to try to actually RUN the empire when an AI can do it much better. Trying to actually figure out what effect your actions have had on your empire is nearly impossible... there are so many tiny factors effecting everything, there is very little cause and effect.
I didn't play MoO2, I played SMAC, Civ3, I dabbled in some space empires 4. This doesn't make me terribly well qualified as an objective reviewer in comparing MoO3 to SMAC, but I think that SMAC really succeeds in immersing you in the game. The player can have a real grasp on the economy and make strategic decisions and see how they effect his empire.
I think MoO3 fails because it trys to have a lot of very complex models for everything, without having a meaningful way for them to interact with themselves or the player.
I can't believe that the MoO3 dev team invested so much time in this...
But right now it is just too much work... you have to slug through too many interfaces to have to little effect on your empire which you don't really feel connected to or care about. It is all huge numbers.... in the late game you are handling thousands of ships, so many that you get bored handling military operations when so much of it is ultra repetitive, like making task forces, sending fleets at enemies, and bombarding their 34 planet with your 134134 missle ships
I will try it again if a patch comes out, but this game has failed to pull me at all in the 30-50 hours I have played. There hasn't been a single moment that made me go "ooh" or "ahh", it felt stale and lacking the creative spark that goes into a game like SMAC.
I rate this 2 stars for 90% of gamers... the remaining 10% often really like it, even it its current state. Those who want to simulate being an accountant perhaps. Until the AI is unneutered, PD fixed, and the interface smoothed I think it will remain thorougly mediocre for almost everyone, eventually multiplay may make it more interesting.
Long post... I have been thinking about this a lot because I really disappointed so much in a game, I have never seen a game that could go so well and had so much work put into fail so horribly.
-
(
Nirvana_CN,
03-16-2003)
To be blunt, M003 Rocks :)
The main drawbacks, are the 2 main bugs, AI and Point defence. However QS have stated the patch is on the way and these are included! The diplomacy is complicated, and sometimes hard to fathom, however you have to look at what you did the turn before you recieve a war declaration or threat, i did this and realised i got the threats when i attacked a Civ i realised was his ally, or intruded on his space, or was blockading an ally's planet.
Ship construction is fun for me, with a MASSIVE tech tree, over 300 items to research! the only drawback here is lack of an Upgrade existing ship option, that said some will prolly mod it :D
combat is fun, especially when using the large model ships, instead of the tiny default ones, but you Really need a strong PC for this, My 2.6Ghz 1Gb Laptop runs fine, but my 1Ghz 256Mb desktop cannot handle it. Graphics are average, but not really that important to me in this kinda game.
Navigating around can be a pain, until you discover hotkeys, and what took 3 double clocks before, now takes one press of a button. So no complaints from me here.
overall i find it exciting, and challenging, albeit im using an agression mod until the main game is realeased.
This game could be a true classic one day with the right patches and development :d
-
(
Raion,
03-14-2003)
Well, only after playing a while in this game of Master of Orion version 3, it has become harder to 'rule' the Galaxy. The player is presented with a story, and that story and the species will take some time and understanding how to relate to them to play this game.
This game is massive with around a Galaxy of 250 Star Systems and 1000 Planets.
I have found that by looking at the game, and not being confused by the amount of information, that most people, who are playing the game, may have wanted a simpler game to play.
Master of Orion has never been simple. For example:
In MOO II, one did not actually win the highest point total for being elected to the Orion Senate, or overpowering all the species in the game, which resulted in a long game, but with only 72 Star Systems on a huge map, there was a mystery to solve.
Having solved that mystery did not make it any easier to win, since species like some others (meaning they are neutral about the species) while they 'hate' others and will War with them more in the beginning, as old rivals.
The same Galaxy is presented in MOO III, but the Antarans (who exterminate any species in the game and scattered the old species - or most of them and are put as magnate species in the new game) have taken over the Orion Senate, and now control the Galaxy.
To win at MOO III, requires one to gain the final victory of being the only superpower left in the Galaxy, and take back control of the Galaxy from the Antarans, and all that oppose.
As being humans, and maybe direct descendents of the original Orions, which other species think is arrogant, the player is left again with some species who are easier to play, then others.
The biological agent in the game from the Antarans, who may have even wiped out the Antarans (another mystery in this well-defined Galaxy) are in the game.
They attack by taking over your race, and making it unto themselves, in as becoming a sentient specie in the Galaxy, giving themselves the Right to Exist!
In this game, the player has no Right to Exist in this Galaxy, and diplomatic channels will prove that at first, the Galaxy is ran by the Antarans.
You start out small, and build up an empire who has to prove that you have a Right to Exist in this Galaxy, and taking over the Galaxy and being a superpower, who gets the most points will not be easy. It is the only victory condition that can not be turned off, as sort of a difficulty level in the game.
The game has always thrown out the player, so the player can start over, until the ultimate victory is pursued.
Would it be any different in multi-player in this game?
This game is an Iron Person Game.
The UI Interface, took about an hour for me to learn.
There are rules in this game, that you just can not give a Task Force orders, and expect to change it the next turn. It takes a few turns to put the Task Force back in Reserves before the player can make a new Task Force.
Neither can the player, give a ship a command to go to a Star System, that is not with a Star Lane, and expect to call the ship back once it starts on its journey of anywhere from 50 to 200 turns.
You simply do not have the technology at first to rule the Galaxy. The New Orions have Level 29 Technology to begin with, there are Specials at Planets who will give your species a boost depending on which species you are playing and the boost that may help your Empire.
Control is hard to obtain in this game, because there is the Universal Law that species do not have to like you, at all.
The optimal state that exists in this Galaxy, is that you are at War, unless, proven otherwise.
Now between the Diplomacy Screen, and Victory Screen, one can see how another Species is doing in the game, what ranking that species has, and who it is at War with, and who it is Trading with.
Most of the people are being given a tsumani of information that as a Empire Leader, you will have to know.
For me, that is easier, since I played the other versions of this game.
For those who think this game is dull, it will take 150 turns to even have enough of an Empire to finally make a dent in this massive game, and only through controlling some of it, will that happen.
The game can play its self, and you can win, but every game is a random game, and that will not happen every time, nor will a player acheive the highest score, and that is control of the Galaxy by being a superpower.
This game, is massive, but the UI Interface, and finding the information, means to 'LOOK' at the screen you are on, remember what screen you had up before.
For those who like to micromanage, that can be done, after you know how the Planets affect your Empire.
After learning the game, which actually does not have to take that long -- give it a couple days rest so your brain can absorb and work on the information presented about knowing about the game, and the certain rules that apply like with Task Force Building or Ground Force building will get better.
To those who wanted a simple game, or think that they have become "Master of Orion", I simply say that they will have to prove that they have a 'Right to Exist' in this game.
As of that, I give it at least 80% being somewhat reminded that such a massive game, can not be play tested first, and there are just a few quirks in the game, and a patch is needed, but that is normal in such a huge massive Galaxy.
There is information that can be found, on the various Tabs, and the game, is not hard to navigate, usually having two ways to get there to do it.
I know that it presents a Galaxy of Information, but some people are not looking at the screen or the game they are playing.
As the original developer put it, you are not there to micromanage everything in this game, although, that can be done, and if done, it may not be to your liking, which in that case, the player can intercede and change it, but the overall scope of this game is massive Empire Building to take over the Galaxy, and Emperors can not triffle with some of the mundane tasks that once are known, can be dealt with by the computer game.
Running and Controlling the Galaxy, is what this game is about, and as always, in "Master of Orion", that will take intelligence, willpower, and postures in Diplomacy, that one knows the Galaxy in which one lives, in their own little corner and speck of the Universe.
May hit 90% when a patch comes out.
-
(
Doomed,
03-14-2003)
It is a different game to MoO2 - good! I would of been annoyed to spend so much money on a limited update.
There are problems with it - it is fiddly to navigate, especially to edit construction queues, and I also had to tweak some of the database code to slow down tech advances to suit my style of play.
If the patch addresses some of the game play issues posted here (and not the whining about it not being more likr MoO2) this will be a classic game, especially multiplayer.
-
(
moomaster,
03-12-2003)
As a hardcore gamer and a fan of moo2, I give MOO3
1.5 out of 5. This game does not live up to its expectations. All this years of waiting and for what???
.....................Hopes down the drain....................
-
(
Grumbold,
03-12-2003)
This game is not for people who wanted MoO2 with 21st century graphics. It is a serious attempt to move the genre onward or at least to step out of the well worn rut other space TBS have trodden.
You are destined to lead an empire that will span dozens then hundreds of worlds. Thousands of space ships will be at your command later in the game. This comes at a price. In order to prevent micromanagement hell in manipulating all these pieces individually the game has viceroys to manage much of the day to day running of the empire. Whether you love or hate this concept will define your relationship with the game.
Personally I love the feeling of actually being in control of this size of empire. That its a more hands-off control which means I don't always specify what must be built in what order on every world is a blessing. I can open my ship queue and find hundreds of vessels waiting to be deployed. Not everyone welcomes this and complains bitterly if there are too many transports to suit their style of play or too few long range battleships.
The learning curve is steep and there are issues with a too-timid AI (ironically because it was deemed too strong and cut back too hard) that currently dampen the pleasure of playing. None of these are impossible to fix and the easy moddability has many players eagerly stepping into the breach while QS quietly prepare their official fixes. Destined to be a post-patch classic imo.
-
(
vmxa1,
03-10-2003)
My perspective on Moo3 after more than a week of playing more or less all day. I found many issues to be annoying, but in the main I did enjoy the experience.
I would put it in the same boat as Space Empire IV and Stars. By that I mean that it is very slow to start and is often dull, but I find myself enjoy the game.
I had all three games the first week they came out. I am now running through Moo3 to see more of the features and races, but I would guess that I will be visiting it in the future rather infrequently as I do those games.
I find it hard to start a new game for them, but once I get going I start having things I want to get accomplished, which is a sort of one more turn facet. All three games are some what complex to learn. All three have or will have mods to make it better.
I am glad to have them around to play from time to time. I will be playing Moo1 and Moo2 more than these three games combined.
I did not address the short comings as they are plastered all over the board.
-
(
hoffken,
03-10-2003)
This is the first ever "no player" computer game. All the human player need do is hit the turn button and you win. The computer colonizes, researchs and builds ships for you -- all without human interference. Amazing! -- I lasted about 100 turns then got so bored I removed it from my hard drive and would have returned it but my dog chewed up the box it came in. Obviously it recognized a competing dog.
-
(
Petep,
03-10-2003)
I've been waiting for MOO3 for years and my worst fears came true.
IMHO they destroyed Moo franchise.
I'm afraid that after THIS we wont see Moo4.
That's my biggest complaint.
But let me summarize my (still big) complaints:
1. No ship uprading! Moo is about FLEETS! This is a must.
2. Interface - horrible (Moo - Windows?)
3. Art. Some say that Steve Barcia turned down a lot of work on graphics and it could be seen in Moo2. Seems to me that QS nothing turned down. I dont need another windows game.
4. Space battle - still too fast to me... What about possibillity to see other ship creations? Without it -creation of your ships is without sense..
5. New tech are meaningless.
6. Vice-roy must not change your decisions.
7. Micromanagement. It a must in human vs human play. At least in the beginning.
8. Thats why there is no soul in Moo3.
8. Game in general looks unfinished
Still looking forward to Moo4...
-
(
dicemanrick,
03-07-2003)
My personal observations (YMMV!!) Sorry...it's a little long....
I'll start by saying I'm a gamer. Been one for a lotta years. Adored Microprose as near-Godlike
When a game is delayed from it's initial release date several times (and by months) it can mean two things...hey, this is great. All the bugs are gone. Or it can mean there are a lot of problems to fix. Since the MOO series is one of my favorites (still have MOO2 on the 'puter and just finished a game two weeks before MOO3), I hoped for the former. Unfortunately...perhaps they should re-name this one B.O.W.W.O.W. 3 or even T.U.R.K.E.Y. 3.
I've played the game for a week now, re-starting as I learned new features of the game. Believe me, I tried to like the game. I went to the boards and read up on what other people had experienced, and followed through with a lot of posted hints and advice. I'm on turn 268 of a game right now that I won politically around turn 125, but started back from a prior save to avoid the win to see how the game develops. I just can't find any FUN here!
Let's start with the overall game design. When will game designers figure out that Windows (TM) has WINDOWS!!!
Leave the galaxy map out all the time. Spawn windows when you go to a system. Spawn more windows for each planet. Instead, we get a series of colorless spreadsheets making you feel like you are accounting your way through the galaxy. Click on a planet from the "Planets" screeen. Try to figure out how many other planets are in the same system. Do I make a system colony ship...don't know. I have to go to another screen, see if there are planets, then go back to another screen to make a ship. Once I create a ship and send it to a prospective landing site, I have to tell the computer not to send any more colony ships there...duh!!
Graphics. I'm an old gamer, as in over 50 (yeah, see what you guys can turn into). The fonts suck...my old eyes have problems here. Zoom the map out for a peek...hey, where are all the starnames? I miss my guy in the scientist coat! I want him back! What does my ship look like? Are all ships the same? Is this a graphic game or a speadsheet game? The panets and galaxy are pretty and would look real nice in the old MOO games, but I have a 19" monitor with a card that easily displays 1024X 768...USE IT!!! Most gamers have the guts in their toys to power a good game.
The encyclopedia is a joke. What are the relative merits of each tech? What do they do? Give me numbers so I can make a decision. The slider bars for areas of research don't lock...why is there a lock symbol?
This is a space game. Space is big. Why is it that a ship built on the far reaches of the galaxy can magically appear at ANY mobilization center? But once I assemble a fleet, it moves from that point at normal rates.
Spys. If I want to play an espionage game, it would'nt be this one. My spies die routinely, but my enemies keep destroyng the SAME government center on the SAME planet. It blows up, I re-build it, it falls down again. My security forces must be rent-a-cops or Moe, Larry and Curly, Inc.
Re-load a saved game....hey, re-set all your filters on the sitrep, 'cause the program forgot that you don't want to see all the messages. I'm in a galactic war now. Why isn't there say "Blue" events that are military in nature, so I can look only at that instead of reading a list of 50-60 lines of "Planet Hoopiejoober built a brand-new hothouse". I want to build warships, not hothouses. That's what filters are for!
Space combat. Looks pretty the first time. Where's the button to see what the other guy has. Do I have scanners? What is he shooting at me? Am I more advanced than he is? Gee, his ships look like mine...we all drive Space Fords with the monotone non-glossy paint job. The explosions are well done, though!The interface here sucks,too. I learned how to have the camera follow a group on about turn 130 of the game. Shouldn't there be a button for this?
Not everyone's mouse has a scroll-wheel...surprize! Can I refigure my mouse controls in this game?
I would have been happy with a bigger, better MOO2, with graphics updated to current status. Throw in internet head-to-head, and you got a winner. This is not...
Back to MOO2, and this MOO3 goes back off the harddrive. Maybe if it's patched (heavily) I'll try again, but right now I feel like the computer is playing the game against itself....there's no fun in this game.
-
(
CenturionV,
03-06-2003)
Mediocre at best, i really could'nt care less if my population is growing by 0.157% or i have an infestation of 3.2 cm bugs eating exacly 9.8 pound of food per day (which if i look in the sub-farming planetary food store sub-menu in the current food store dropdown you'l see will make 4.2 of your colonies be dead in 12.1 turns!!! What ever happened to games being simple? MOO2 was a great game you barely needed to leave the main menu, sure 3d space combat more, complex ground battles and a galactic senate are cool and all, but basicly everything else aint, ai won't attack you if you punched it in the nose, there's literally Gazzilions of uselsss menu's that have very little or no impact on gameplay or strategy even sending a ship or making a building is difficult! I realized how MOO3 really was when i tried to explain to my little brother (who played MOO2 a *LOT* ) how to play and after 15 minutes all he said was "i can't remember all this stuff i'm going to play age of empires" within an hour or 2 i was starting to feel that way to.
-
(
CharlesBHoff,
03-06-2003)
Than great games in the Master of Orion sercies. It only needed to be patch to solve some problens which every new game have exspecial games that break new ground.
-
(
Ianpolaris,
03-05-2003)
Pros: Some of the Basic Concepts
Cons: Just about everything else but esp the enemy AI
Sims in Space
I eagerly awaited the sucessor to Moo2 along with the rest of you. Because of that, I desperately....desperately wanted to love this game. The only result was that I played it for much longer than I really should have before giving it away.
Now to be fair, some of the ideas were really good. Micromanagement was always a pain in prior 4X games, and the developers tried to make sure that the late game did not turn into management tedium. Likewise the basic story behind the game was interesting and the initial race and race-customization screens were rather well done. Furthermore, this is (or rather was until I gave it away) one of the most stable games I have ever played.
Unfortunately, that's where the good points leave off. The game has really *lousy* graphics and is locked into a 800x600 mode. That is almost 10 years behind state-of-the-art for crying out loud and the rest of the graphical interface matches...including a truly horrid graphical representation of ship combat. Now some would argue that graphics don't mean as much in a 4X game and I would tend to agree, but first impressions *do* matter.
Then we get to a really, *really* lousy interface. I have seen complete amatures do a better job with interface design after only a few months of developement. Indeed when combined with the aweful graphics, the game *looks* (and frankly plays) like it was made by amatures in less than a year rather than the 4+ years the project actually took. You need to go through *four* clicks just to see and change your military build que (to name the most egregious and most common example) and the rest of the interface is not much better.
Furthermore the documentation on this game *sucks*. I realize that I am not suppose to swear in reviews, but there is simply no kinder way to phrase it. Not only is the manual less approachable than a graduate level physics text, but there is no documentation ANYWHERE as to what "mineral rich" means in hard numbers the stategy gamer can evaluate. The same applies for explaining developement plans, tax income rates, "heavy foot of government" all of which occupy central roles in the game.
I could go on with all the other sub-standard aspects of the game (such as the total lack of control in involvement in research), but there is one flaw that turns this from a bad but playable game into a travesty:
The enemy AI. Basically once you have mastered the interface (expect it to take 15+ hours), you find that all the apparent complexity was a lie. As the game stands now, unless you are completely brain dead in your military construction, you can NOT LOSE! All you have to do is move the ships your AI builds (be sure to update them frequently because there is no refit option...yet another flaw) to the appropriate spaces and let the AI play the game for you.
That isn't Moo. That is Sims in Space that has *stolen* the title of Moo III from a more deserving game.
I can not recommend this game, period because it *isn't* a true game. At the very least it isn't a strategy game as it stands now. Given that QS publically stated that they made a final three month delay (missing the X-Mas season) to be sure this game was done right, releasing the game in this state was inexusable.
Greatest Gaming Moment:
None
Time Played:
20-100 hours
-
(
Jack_www,
03-04-2003)
This is the first time I have played a Master of Orion game, thus I cannot compare it to the older versions of Master of Orion. I agree with most people that the AI takes controll of too much, if you wanted to you could let the game run it self. Allthough you can take over what ever you want, and let the AI handle the rest for you. Which might be a good thing once I figure this game out. It can be really confusing, and it took me a long time just to find the place were you build ships and ground troops.
I have mixed feelings about this game. Right now I dont know really what I am doing, so It will take a long time to figure everthing out. I would say if you have lots of time to learn this game, then get it. Cause it has a large learning curve. Once I figure out this game then I will be able to take over controll of it from the AI. But for now I will try and learn as much as i can about the game before I do that.
I would give it 3.75 stars.
-
(
GhengisFarb,
03-04-2003)
Great idea with the Magnate civs, but a poor choice in turning MoO into a SimCity game. The human player is reduced to simply making suggestions and the game plays the game. All the player does is observe what the empire does.
If you like The Sim games then this is definitely the space game for you.
-
(
hariseldon,
03-03-2003)
After playing the game for just a few hours, I really could not understand the complexity of the game. However, there are many things that I noticed.
I have been an avid MOO gamer since I was in grade school (I am 22 now) and remember the day when I would mosey over to my neighbor's place and waste countless afternoons on the original MOO. Then I graduated to MOO2 and things only got better. The only complaint I had about either game is that for very large battles between similarly powerful empires, sometimes I would just walk away and an hour later it would be done. That and the micromanagement. Now that Moo3 is released, I feel like I have been thrown from the common, intuitive environment of the other games into a confusing mess of menus and numbers. As for the destruction of the micromanagement, all I can say is that they did it too well. I love math guys, but only when the numbers make sense, dammit.
First, for the time and energy spent on the game, I really would have liked to see better graphics on the galaxy screen and other aspects of the game to give it more life. When everything is given to you in large boxes, things seem very boring and sterile. The saving grace is the way the diplomatic scene is handled. The galaxy screen is a confusing mess. Really, they should have allowed dynamic rotation through the mouse instead of a confusing keyboard arrangement.
The music for the game series has never been good, and this time is no different. I remember downloading the previews from teh moo3 website and getting all excited about the game's music and saying "this might actually rock!" However, they must have muted it to such an extent, or played it through a tin can so much that it lacks life. I have a decent sound system so I know it is not the speakers.
I unfortunately have to agree with some of the reviewers and say that the AI takes care of too much for you. I would like to have seen more interaction on the player's part in managing the building of the individual planets. OK, maybe the AI takes care of the industry buildup, but you say what specials to build. I dunno. All I am saying is that the AI takes care of too much. Battles are OK, but still the poor graphics.
In short, if you just like to sit back and watch things run themselves, then you will have a blast at Moo3. Unfortunately, instead of finding the happy medium between micromanagement and complete AI control, Quicksilver and IG have overshot it towards the complete AI control side. Graphics are poor (MOO2's were better!). I would give this game three stars, and that's generous because there is no two and a half.
-
(
art_vandelai,
03-03-2003)
After the first couple of hours playing MOO3, I was beginning to feel a lot of the same things as many - the interface is confusing, everything in this game is deeper and more complex than MOO2, The AI though, takes a lot of the decision-making away from you with it's viceroys, etc.
A funny thing happened as I learned how to use the interface, how the task force thing works, how to load troops on a troop ship, how to design and arrange fleets of the most massive variety of spaceships. (approx. 11 different sizes and 9 missions possible!) Just to make it easier on yourseld, use the Auto-Build options for armies and new ships - it makes it much easier to manage. The addictiveness of the game just sort of crept up on me. A couple of days ago, it seemed like a never-ending jumble of menus. After 13 hours of marathon MOOing yesterday, I just can't wait to get back home from work and start blasting those silicoids once again.
There are a few notable flaws - the AI continues to build system colony ships, even when all the planets in the system have already been colonized, planets that are able to build superdreadnoughts still build tiny little ships, and useless defenses and troop ships are continually built by the AI. A deeper and more customizable military building AI would serve this game well.
Graphics and sound leave a little bit to be desired, but the game's not at all about those things.
-
(
NeOmega,
03-02-2003)
I wasted $50 on this, and extremely upset. Yeah it's complex.... I should've known [b]13 of 17 of the pictures on the box are from cutscenes[/b] and not gameplay. I have tried playing this for 8 hours now, and it still hasn't been the least shred fun.
This game has a very frustrating GUI, I'd like to be able to click on things and be directed, not close this window, open that one.... I shoulda kazaad this one, then I would've known better.
Task forces = micromanagement where I didn't want it.
I played Master Of Orion for years... this is an insult.
Your rewards for researching techs, designing ships, everything, is tiny icons, words, and numbers.
Plus the map leaves no feeling of Empire.... I could go on for hours. I want my money back, this is the first game I have ever bought where I felt this way.
-
(
xmad,
03-01-2003)
My Conclusion after 2 days
I will not go into detail of Graphics and Sound ect, others have done this already here.
After using the MOO3 program i am still somewhat surprised over the amount of energy i was able to spend using this Program. An investment that can only explained for my love of Moo2 one of my all time favorites games.
Moo3 is an galaxy simulators but IMHO not an 4X or 5X game.
Every time i played moo3 it failed completely to involve me as an leader of an galactic empire. It fails to build tension, anticipation for new better techs or force you to make hard decision's between upgrading a planets infrastructure and creating a new doom star to crush your enemy.
Finally ,as more i learned about the mechanics of Moo3 less i cared about the outcome and events that flooded my Sitrep.
Moo3 defined an new type of computer games for me :
The one less Turn Games, God thanks its over !.
(sorry for my bad English and spelling)
-
(
Flesh Reaver,
03-01-2003)
I will admit, when I first read the manual, I was like "Oh my God this is complex!"
Playing it for the first time made me realize it was actually more complex than the manual made it seem. However, I consider this to be a good thing. I like complex. If I wanted out of the box entertainment, I would have bought an X-Box. If someone is not into indepth stratagy games, MOO3 is defiantly a no no. I have only had three sessions with it so far, but already I seem to be getting the hang of it. In a weeks time I imagine the initial "frustration" will be forgotten, and I will enbrace the complexity as one of the strong points of the game. One thing I feel veterans of the other MOOs are resisting is the use of the AI to micromanage your planets. The arguement that this takes control out of the hands of the player is not true for MOO3. You can set guidelines (pretty indepth) for your vicroys to follow. This is key. Bottom line: Fans of stratagy will love it (if they can get over the initial "too complex" scare.) People looking for a "load and play" game are sure to be disapointed.
-
(
EdCase,
03-01-2003)
Add a militay ai to "click" the autodesign button in the design ship screen, have it then assemble the TFs and attack the nearest neighbor.Get it to repeat ad infinitum.
Combine that with setting a length of game turn option.Et voila a "game" that plays itself.
Synopsis. Souless,characterless. Something for people who wish they were dead.(Warning for those who don't.Many hours of this and you will wish you were)
-
(
britvojnik,
02-28-2003)
i think i cover it quite nicely with:
Phantom Menace
a good film... worth watching.
but....
you had all that time... all that money.... and all the talent you could ask for.
and you delivered mediocre graphics and an obtuse interface.
a host of minor yet annoying imperfections:
no ship upgrade
no fleet reconfigure
no planet/system naming
missing information that should be accessible with a click
no varied time on fleet combat
difficult or buggy counter offer in dipolmacy.
.....
there is more but thats enough for now.
That being said. it is a fun game. it is interesting and i see tremendous potential... look forward to version 1.5
becasue unlike the TPM this can be patched.
currently a 3/5
edited to add
3/5 for die hard strategy gamers ... a do not ever purchase for the casual sort dont even play it if given as a gift
-
(
maeric,
02-28-2003)
Do not get this game! At least find a friend that has been fool enough to buy it and play it there first. I am very disappointed right now and don't have a whole lot to say except that I was expecting a whole lot more. The graphics are worse than MOO2 for crying out loud. What's the sense of having a 3D star map when the ships placed on them are all 2D? This had the potential of being a whole lot more. On paper it works but in a game it definetly falls short!
-
(
QuackQululu,
02-28-2003)
This is not a game...
My review that is. Come to think of it, nor could I recommend MOO3 to fit into a category of any game I have ever played.
I would like the opportunity to qualify that before you turn away in a huff of intelllectual didain. I do not bear any ill will towards the makers, they seem to be earnest enough, intensely devoted to the MOO universe, and I was taken with their enthusiasm as I read each post and update since I first heard that they were going to remake MOO.
You are not going to find an in depth review of all the features and short comings I have experienced since I picked up my reserved copy on the release date, as I am sure that will be done by far better than myself. What I would like to say as a devoted player of MOO2 is that I cannot accept this release of MOO3 as being in any way associated with the reason that I so enjoyed MOO2.
Besides the fact that they bought the license to the name and they have written a new story line with the inhabitants of the MOO universe they have failed miserably in delivering any sense of what it means to want to get involved in a "game".
Correct me if I am wrong, but generally the idea of a game is that people observing it note the experience and say something akin to, " Hey, that looks like a lot of fun, I think I would like to try that". It does not require great depths of analysis or training. Much like throwing a baseball back and forth with a good friend, or perhaps snowboarding, or smashing game of frisbee.
I have been playing computer games for so long I can hardly remember when it all began but I have to say MOO2 was probaly one of my all time favorites. I love strategy in particular and thought I was dreaming when I heard they would be making MOO3. I so highly anticipated it and pined away the hours waiting that I even flew my brother out to visit to coincide with the release date knowing how much we both enjoyed MOO2. While I was the one to discover MOO he was the one who plumbed the depths of it. I admittedly do not have his patience, which explains why I am the one writing this review while he is playing MOO3.
I did not want to be the hammer on this, so I have waited respectfully to hear the observations of others and am amazed at the courtesy being extended to the developers in the forum. I havent decided if it is just because so few have received it and played it or because they have not come up for air with the anticipation that "something interesting must be going happen at some point in the game if I just keep clicking the turn button". "How Could it be that this much time and development went into the game with so many insightful people and it be such bore? "This is immposible! "I know if I just keep playing somewhere, at some point, it just has got to get good!"
I am sorry to say that unless you belive in "The Kings New Clothes" this is as good as it gets, YOU ARE PLAYING THE "GAME".
Once again, the respect of the forum only states the intelligence of those who would be interested in this game. Something I am very appreciative of. Who knows perhaps this IS what some of you have been waiting for. My tax consultant loves her job at H&R Block. When I look at her software I am somehow reminded of MOO3. And who am I to down play others enjoyment of this game? I can only stand on the axiom that if you have to explain the joke to someone it defeats the purpose. Judging from the amount of explaining going on regarding MOO3 one must admit that it just didnt work. The sooner you realize this the sooner you can get back to reality. Come to think of it , games help to remove one from reality to enjoy doing what we may never do but for the gaming experince, at least they used to. Maybe that was it, MOO3 is just to real for this reviewer.
MOO2.5 anyone? =D
-
(
MarkG,
02-28-2003)
It's cool :)
-
(
Romanus,
02-28-2003)
This wont be an in depth review, just a few observations after 2 days of play:
Understand now, if you havent bought the game yet, the initial "Holy Crap" factor is high when you see how complex the game is. Once you play for a while, things do start to make sense.
>GRAPHICS-Its a turn based space game. I wasnt expecting Homeworld, or even Conquest Frontier Wars. And its not. The basic look of the game is fine, the video sequences in Diplomacy are cool, the races actually speak in a native tongue. While it doesnt seem to vary from contact to contact, its still better than just watching the leader grimace or smirk, as in Civ3.
The space combat graphics are pretty weak, even zoomed in units are tiny, but it does the job and is better than just getting an after action report.
The text fonts in the game menus are fuzzy, a well known issue, and various fixes have been discussed.
>SOUND-Music is ok, I hardly notice it anyway. Various menu blips and bleeps are appropriately scifi, and the space combat sounds are ok. I havent engaged in ground combat yet, so I am not familiar with sounds in that area.
>MANUAL-Its laid out in a unique way, with the back story interlaced with game info. Its definately enjoyable bathroom reading, and is somewhat helpful, but most people will probably learn more about gameplay from the forums...and trial and error.
>THE GAME-MOO3 is menu hell, which for someone like me is a good thing. I enjoy complexity. The main reason why I made the jump from RTS to the turn based genre. I just feel like playing a TB game is making me use my gray matter, as opposed to my reflexes. MOO3 will make you use the gray matter. It can and will be argued that things could have been made a bit less complex, and it could. But in time, the game starts to make sense, and things arent as complex as you think. Every menu has a purpose and function, once you get a grip on which ones you need, its fairly straight forward. The different areas of the game, from income/taxation to research, are quite different than we are used to. You have planetary finances, Empire wide finances, research is a neverending, constant flow of discoveries. You can assign Viceroys to oversee individual planets, like Governors in Civ3. They do a fair job, and will keep things moving along, but really, arent necessary until you are really spread out. Micromanaging your planets in the early game may lead to defeat, but you will learn how things work. Once you colonize a planet, you zone its various regions for different things, like Farming, Research, Mining, etc. I kinda look at this like working tiles in Civ. Its an area I am still learning.
I like the combat, not all that attractive, but still fun. I sent two scouts to a nearby system and held off locals for several turns, then started colonizing. Of course I was later admonished in the senate....bad human.
Speaking of the Senate, this whole area of the game is brilliant. I cant wait to hit the endturn button to see what new bills are proposed, or who is proposing to declare war on who.
As I stated earlier, this was not a review as much as my observations. The more I play it, the more I like it. Below are my Pros, Cons and unknowns
Pros:Deep, complex, yet scalable via viceroys. Dive in or take a hands off approach.
The universe around you may seem empty at first, but the more you play, the more alive it becomes.
Ever wanted to truly run a galactic empire? This is it.
Cons:Diplomacy at times is a mystery, im not always sure what a race is referring to when they talk to me. A lot is going on, exactly what pissed them off.
There needs to be more info on Senate Bills/proposals. Why would I vote to punish this or that empire?
My final thought is that I like it, so far. As long as the AI can provide a solid challenge, its a keeper for me. The complexity and anal attention to detail that is needed I can deal with. It will take some time to determine how good the AI is or isnt, but thats my main concern.
|
Apolyton Directory
Master of Orion 3
Review it
____
Rate it
____
