22-01-2004 21:37									#271
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quote: Originally posted by PLATO Yes, by the sons and daughters of those who witnessed the actual events. Where did you get you education on the matter?

From historians such as:

Eric Foner
McPherson
David Blight and several other professional historians who know their stuff.


And their work, in turn, are based on primary sources from the South, and from the North at the time of the Civil War and Reconstruction.

I can see if I can locate quotes from Confederate leaders who vehemently argued that slavery had to be preserved at all costs.

	23-01-2004 04:38									#272
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Good -- I got the last word.

	23-01-2004 04:38									#273
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No you didn't.

	23-01-2004 04:40									#274
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damn you

	23-01-2004 04:55									#275
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*cg points at MrFun an does a Nelson laugh.

"HA ha!"

	23-01-2004 06:33									#276
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara From the mouths of the people who actually engaged in those events. So, I use primary sources, you play the telephone game. Which one is more likely to be accurate?

Didn't realize you were so old...

	23-01-2004 06:50									#277
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quote: Originally posted by PLATO Didn't realize you were so old...

He doesn't have to be to read transcripts of the debates of the Southern governments- for instance in Charles P. Roland's 'The Confederacy' in the Chicago History of American Civilization or John Hope Franklin's 'Reconstruction: After the Civil War' in the same series.

The Civil War documentary series also had actors reading out the letters and speeches of people such as Mary Chestnut. The tirades of politicians such as Louis T. Wigfall and Robert M. T. Hunter in the Southern House opposing even the arming of Southern slaves and eventually emancipating them on the South's possibly winning the war, show how against ignorance, the gods themselves contend in vain....

	23-01-2004 07:48									#278
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun I can see if I can locate quotes from Confederate leaders who vehemently argued that slavery had to be preserved at all costs.

Try: http://members.aol.com/jfepperson/causes.html

If it suits you please bookmark it. I get tire of continually gredging it back up for these endless debates over the obvious.

	23-01-2004 07:58									#279
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quote: Originally posted by Spiffor This is the problem with most wars. And this is one of the reasons why I oppose American wars in general: most Americans seem to believe "oh this will only last for a short time and be done with it".

Sounds very much like the majority sentiment in Europe in 1914 and 1939! Weren't your boys supposed to be home by Christmas? You're not very differnent are you?

quote: I strongly think the long-term dispositions of the Arab world toward the US are deeply wonded, just like there is a wound of the Civil War in the US.

No, the emotional rift between North and South began when the first Northern state abolished slavery. Southerners hated abolition, even in someone else's satate. The felt personally insulted because deep down they knew that the prohibition of slavery in other states represented a moral judgement against them.

	23-01-2004 08:20									#280
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Strangelove One of those preachers is still nationally prominent.

Ooh, name names! Please!

	23-01-2004 08:50									#281
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Strangelove Try: http://members.aol.com/jfepperson/causes.html If it suits you please bookmark it. I get tire of continually gredging it back up for these endless debates over the obvious.

Oooooh . . . . . I'm salivating now.


Thanks -- consider it bookmark.


** makes note to note specific pages from his own library of such quotes **

	23-01-2004 08:57									#282
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov Ooh, name names! Please!

I'm betting Graham or Falwell.

Or both!

	23-01-2004 09:27									#283
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quote: Originally posted by Guynemer I'm betting Graham or Falwell. Or both!

I ain't sayin' nuthin'. I've already got a reputation down home, and if'n it gets out that I'm a squealin' my life won't be worth pig stuff.

In the 1950s and 1960s Billy Graham became a master at fence straddling whenever the subject of civil rights came up. He meticulously avoided making statements that might have implied sympathy for segregationists, but on the other hand he deplored the disorderliness of the protests of the era and skillfully used them as examples to his advantage.

	23-01-2004 11:31									#284
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Strangelove Sounds very much like the majority sentiment in Europe in 1914 and 1939! Weren't your boys supposed to be home by Christmas? You're not very differnent are you?

The main difference being that we learned of our mistakes

	23-01-2004 15:37									#285
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C'mon, Doc. We both know you're the only one within a 50 mile radius who comes to Poly. Spill it; it probably won't be a shocking answer, anyway.