10-04-2004 04:58									#301
	Increase Your PM Length

The only place I can find a notion of authors natural rights was Diderot who argued along the same grounds as you do. However, others used the same principles to argue for complete freedom of information - in other words it is not a well worked out position.

Modern copyright law does not recognize these arguments, it is all utilitarian (hence the debates over "fair use").

	10-04-2004 04:59									#302
	Tired of ads?

Artists didn't use to make money buy selling a mass-produced product. They made money by commission, or by performing.

	10-04-2004 05:03									#303
	Got spare money?

Yep. And the vast majority of the world's greatest artworks were produced without the protection of any copyright law.

	10-04-2004 05:08									#304
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Ming! I know you are online. Come hither and defend your false views!!

edit: I guess you are watching Arnold.

Last edited by Agathon on 10-04-2004 at 05:19

	10-04-2004 06:43									#305
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by General Ludd Artists didn't use to make money buy selling a mass-produced product. They made money by commission, or by performing.

We all know that shareware makes its developers money hand over fist.

	10-04-2004 06:46									#306
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc We all know that shareware makes its developers money hand over fist.

For that to be even remotely relevant to the post you quoted shareware would 1) have to be comissioned, in which case it would make money. (Counter-strike, anyone?) or 2) Written from scratch on each computer it's installed on. Which is silly.

	10-04-2004 06:47									#307
	Got spare money?

Piracy occurs in more areas than music.

	10-04-2004 06:48									#308
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by asleepathewheel you quoted Aeson, not me, he is far more eloquent than I.

Oops. My hat's off to you both, then. Yours has been among the most intelligent discussion on this thread too.

	10-04-2004 06:52									#309
	Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Piracy occurs in more areas than music.

Do you have a point, or are you just typing out random sentences?

	10-04-2004 06:53									#310
	Put an end to popups!

Only that your point is hardly applicable to artists today.

	10-04-2004 06:56									#311
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Only that your point is hardly applicable to artists today.

Are you forgeting to read the posts that you're trolling again, or did you just conveniently 'miss' my example of commisioned shareware that made it's developers alot money (and fame)?

	10-04-2004 07:00									#312
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

quote: Originally posted by General Ludd Are you forgeting to read the posts that you're trolling again, or did you just conveniently 'miss' my example of commisioned shareware that made it's developers alot money (and fame)?

Counterstrike wasn't commissioned. Valve only caught on to the popularity of the mod that already existed. I fail to see how you can extrapolate this into something that looks like a general trend.

	10-04-2004 07:06									#313
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Counterstrike wasn't commissioned. Valve only caught on to the popularity of the mod that already existed. I fail to see how you can extrapolate this into something that looks like a general trend.

Valve gave Counter-Strike, and other in-development mods (Fire Arms and Day of Defeat, maybe others) support and money to continue developing their mods for free distribution. Sounds like a comision to me.

And I'm not 'extrapolating it into a general trend' I'm doing the exact opposite: I'm offering it as an alternative to the norm.

	10-04-2004 07:42									#314
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Valve gave Counter-Strike, and other in-development mods (Fire Arms and Day of Defeat, maybe others) support and money to continue developing their mods for free distribution. Sounds like a comision to me.

It's not. A commission is when you pay someone to make something in the first place.

	10-04-2004 07:52									#315
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Kucinich It's not. A commission is when you pay someone to make something in the first place.

And that's what they did. They said "hey, here's some money. Finish that beta you've got and don't stop - keep working on it and expanding it"

	10-04-2004 07:59									#316
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Nope, because the money wasn't to start the project in the first place, it was to continue it.

	10-04-2004 08:02									#317
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

You're like a living dictionary. If you want to be overly pedantic, go ahead. But it's the same in principal.