27-02-2004 03:09									#61
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When will people realize that the US constitution does not really protect free speech.

What does is a general level of tolerance for others expressing their opinions.

In no other country I can think of would people habitually boycott someone and threaten their livelihood for expressing their political views. In a society where expressing your opinion is greeted with such boycotts, people are less likely to say what they really think.

	27-02-2004 03:13									#62
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quote: Originally posted by Whoha so the fcc held a gun to clear channel's head? how come Stern still has other stations if thats the case?

Um, because there are only two companies in the radio business now. Clearchannel and Infiniti. Thank you market consolidation. You just have presented the government the gift it can't refuse...the ability to control a mass media medium via the twisting of only TWO arms.

	27-02-2004 03:14									#63
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quote: Originally posted by Ned Shogun, COSY????!!!!!!! Clearchannel is under assault from all sides to censor what it does.

What's "COSY"???

	27-02-2004 03:20									#64
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I agree with Sava. Republicans aren't really republicans anymore. Let the market decide what's appropriate for broadcast. It seems that this very vocal minority, against certain types of content, failed to drum up enough business to enforce boycotts, so they have attempted to obtain government intervention and censorship to get their way. Thank you religious right.

Mohammed Falwell and Seikh Gary Bauer win again. There's your terrorism watch list, folks.

	27-02-2004 03:23									#65
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I mean, no one fined Falwell for saying that homosexuals were responsible for 9/11 and that's far worse than anything Stern has ever said.

	27-02-2004 03:26									#66
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quote: Originally posted by Ned The people who are attacking Clearchannel are socialists.

quote: SAVA, note that Rush Limbaugh and I agree with you that pressuring Clearchannel to censor its content is WRONG.

so you and Rush are socialists?

	27-02-2004 03:44									#67
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..When Howard Sterns was up at WWDC101 in the early '80's Sterns overstepped the line and thus led to his being removed when Air Florida Crashed into the 14th street bridege, killing all those poor souls.

So how does Howard show his humanity?

How does he show he can be mature?

He calls up the National Airport desk of Air Florida and asks how much a one way ticket from DC National (Now Regan airport) to the 14th street bridege would be?



Ok..so DC 101 hires Greaseman..another shock jock.

what does HE do..

It is coming up on Martin Luther Kings Birthday..so he get on the air and makes a statement..."Martin Luther King Holiday?..we get a day off? We should shoot 6 more and get the whole week off!!"



They didnt fire him but he had to be on vacation during each year while the nation celebrated the Civil Rights Birthday..

Both Cases the FCC fined the station...

I am all for entertainment and yes Greaseman has some very funny monolgues..BUT...sometimes humor hurts and is inappropriate..PERIOD.

I personally dont feel Howard Stern should be able to broadcast via airways where many can hear his filth and obscenities...BUT..I simply avoid listenting to this trash....


I do however understand BIG BUSINESS concepts of Sales & Profit versus content and responsibility.


My humore goes along the lines of Roy D. Mercer....funny stuff..


Peace

Grandpa "Just adding his UNWARRANTED $0.02" Troll

Attachment: censored free speech.gif
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Last edited by Grandpa Troll on 27-02-2004 at 03:49

	27-02-2004 04:11									#68
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quote: Originally posted by Grandpa Troll My humore goes along the lines of Roy D. Mercer....funny stuff..

Lord, I apologize.

	27-02-2004 04:35									#69
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Lord, I apologize.

Yeah Roy's tough to swallow some times

	27-02-2004 04:57									#70
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Today it's the radio, tomorrow it's the newspapers, next week it will be YOUR ****ING BRAIN.

Stop censorship now before it's too late.

	27-02-2004 05:07									#71
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quote: Originally posted by mrmitchell Today it's the radio, tomorrow it's the newspapers, next week it will be YOUR ****ING BRAIN. Stop censorship now before it's too late.

......... and were off to see .......




BIG BROTHER THE WIZARD

	27-02-2004 05:35									#72
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quote: Drake, thanks for the compliment. But, who is Bubba the Love Sponge?

Sorry Ned, but I was talking about a different Ned, Bubba's redneck, Vietnam-vet, completely insane sidekick. What is he going to do for work, now?

	27-02-2004 06:37									#73
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon In a society where expressing your opinion is greeted with such boycotts, people are less likely to say what they really think.

Yeah. I agree that it is such a shame that people have opinions about other people's opinions. How utterly crass of them.

	27-02-2004 07:50									#74
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quote: Originally posted by Sava so you and Rush are socialists?

I said the people who were attacking Clearchannel were socialists.

Rush and I are defending Clearchannel against government pressure.

	27-02-2004 08:21									#75
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Stern's show was never that entertaining anyway. He was a one trick pony and very uncreative. It's like watching the kid throw paperwads when the teacher turns her back. Fun the first couple of times but lame afterwards.

"Show your boobs!"

"Let's talk about blojobs!"

Repeat for the next 10 years straight.

	27-02-2004 12:05									#76
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon You gotta love the US!!!! In the US people are free, everyone else live like slaves!!!! In the US people have freedom of speech, everyone else suffers under draconian censorship!!!! And you can have your own field howitzer or attack helicopter!!! Scum. How dare they censor him.

I knew this post would crop up.

If Canadians support free speech Why does the Tom Leykis show get taken off the radio station in Vancouver? And don't tell me it is because of low ratings. He is the top rated talk show in nearly every market he is on.

It is because feminists in Vancouver protested and the station owners caved and took the show off the air.

	27-02-2004 12:18									#77
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I'm getting sick and tired of people slamming the U.S. on this.

If the U.S. is so "conservative" and oppressive, why can we air the Tom Leykis show and Canada can't?

face it, Canada is more conservative than the U.S.

yes I listen to the Tom Leykis show. His show is hilarious a lot of the time. It is so offensive, you gotta love it. I love it when the women call in. They are so enraged by the things Tom says, they can't even talk straight. .

	27-02-2004 12:22									#78
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quote: Originally posted by Shogun Gunner Um, because there are only two companies in the radio business now. Clearchannel and Infiniti. Thank you market consolidation. You just have presented the government the gift it can't refuse...the ability to control a mass media medium via the twisting of only TWO arms.

Westwood One as well.

	27-02-2004 12:33									#79
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Because the fact of the matter is, Diss, we are the freest country in the world and it's usually bitter Old Eurocoms looking to make the slam...

	27-02-2004 12:48									#80
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quote: Originally posted by Ted Striker "Show your boobs!" "Let's talk about blojobs!" Repeat for the next 10 years straight.

No wonder you find him boring, you already have to listen to that 24/7.

	27-02-2004 15:38									#81
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You guys are all forgetting how biased everything is as it is. All of the corporate mass media compnaies are all owned by six major corporations. Viacom, AOL-TIME-Warner, I don't know the rest b/c its like 2:00 am, but ya think aboot that.

	27-02-2004 18:53									#82
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quote: Originally posted by Dissident If Canadians support free speech Why does the Tom Leykis show get taken off the radio station in Vancouver? And don't tell me it is because of low ratings. He is the top rated talk show in nearly every market he is on. It is because feminists in Vancouver protested and the station owners caved and took the show off the air.

Actually, I don't have any problem with this. A community organized, filed a compliant and the local station made a business decision. I didn't hear "gov't involvement" in there anywhere.

	27-02-2004 20:38									#83
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quote: Originally posted by Grandpa Troll He calls up the National Airport desk of Air Florida and asks how much a one way ticket from DC National (Now Regan airport) to the 14th street bridege would be?

That's actually funny (in a dark humor way) ...

quote: It is coming up on Martin Luther Kings Birthday..so he get on the air and makes a statement..."Martin Luther King Holiday?..we get a day off? We should shoot 6 more and get the whole week off!!"

Also funny (BTW Chris Rock did a similarly tasteless bit about MLK day).

quote: Both Cases the FCC fined the station...

Why? Bad taste? Perhaps the FCC should fine the women of Long Island for still wearing spandex (if they show up on broadcast TV).

quote: I am all for entertainment and yes Greaseman has some very funny monolgues..BUT...sometimes humor hurts and is inappropriate..PERIOD.

Humor is often a sharp-edged sword. Inappropriateness heightens the humor of an otherwise mediocre talent like Stern. There is a place for it. Its like Carlin said - making fart noises in church is doubly fun because it angers earthly authority and risks the wrath of God.

quote: I do however understand BIG BUSINESS concepts of Sales & Profit versus content and responsibility.

Actually, I'm not sure that you do. Whose responsibility to whom? I grew up Richard Pryor (the albums and the comedy shows - not the lame ass movies). Censoring Howard Stern does not do me any favors. Moreover if the market supports this type of humor, then the people have spoken with their feet and their money and there is no need to "protect" the people from what they have chosen. Howard Stern is popular. Is it the responsibility of corporate America to deny to the people what they want?

	27-02-2004 20:44									#84
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Or even worse, why does the government feel the need or "responsibility" to deny programming?

It's funny how personalities are criticized in their era for being TOO ANGRY or TOO DISGUSTING or TOO WHATEVER...then twenty years later everyone fawns all over the "geniuses" and talks about how ground breaking they are.

I don't think Stern is a genius, but a lot of people like him. I'm just highly offended that people, organizations and government would try to impose their will over another group. I can accept the individual or individuals organized together, but when they try to activiate the machinery of government, I have to draw the line there.

	27-02-2004 20:46									#85
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quote: Originally posted by bipolarbear You guys are all forgetting how biased everything is as it is. All of the corporate mass media compnaies are all owned by six major corporations. Viacom, AOL-TIME-Warner,

Yeah, it does suck. And that's why people need to quit being vacuous sheep and seek out independent media. There's ultimately a choice,no matter how much conglomeration there is, and people have the choice not to be spoonfed crap.

Stern's not funny, despite his popularity with the mouthbreathing set. And Clear channel will have to succumb to putting him back on at some point. Besides, what's a few million here and there in fines when you own a gazillion stations plus ticket distribution

	28-02-2004 02:06									#86
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quote: Originally posted by bipolarbear You guys are all forgetting how biased everything is as it is. All of the corporate mass media compnaies are all owned by six major corporations. Viacom, AOL-TIME-Warner, I don't know the rest b/c its like 2:00 am, but ya think aboot that.

Sava, remember my earlier post about socialists?

	28-02-2004 02:22									#87
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why are people attacking clearchannel naturally socialists?

i hate clearchannel. seriously. which is why i refuse to listen to any radio station that plays music that was made after, oh, say, 1900 or so.

as far as the other media companies, i hate them too. which is why i'm always happy when you see destructive innovation at the edges in the form of things like creative commons.

destructive innovation. that's not something you'll generally hear from a socialist.

	28-02-2004 02:55									#88
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Marketing evolves slowly, from the ground up.
Innovation disrupts quickly, from the top down.

Established market leaders' biggest legitimate fear is of groundbreaking innovation. That's their only reason to maintain advanced development depts. anymore.

Examples:
--Japan taking over from the Swiss when wristwatches went digital.
--Makers of phonographs and cartridges going belly-up when the CD was introduced.
--Mainframe makers in the face of the personal computer.
--Arcade game makers dying by the dozen when video games came online.
--Fax machines obviated the Telex, and are now being destroyed by email and text messaging.
--Rewriteable discs are nearly done destroying the floppy/zipdisc fiefdom.

Of course, there's no guarantee that a given innovation will be disruptive enough to change the status quo. NTSC is an inferior video format. Beta was way better than VHS. But the government can enact protective legislation, and pricing is often a barrier to radical technological change.

The problem with the deregulation of media ownership is that the megacorps are powerful enough to lay off risk by investing in those who would disrupt them. Easiest example? Microsoft's longstanding (pre-legal mess) policy to "buy any successful software startup that's doing something we're not."

ClearChannel will live. AOL/TW will continue to live.
Rock radio and TV prgramming will continue to suck.
The Internet will become progressively less diverse.

Welcome to Century 21... (sigh)

	28-02-2004 02:57									#89
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Uh, Sava? You're starting to sound like a liberal Rush Limbaugh. You even say "repugs" instead of "dumbocrats." Calm down.

As for Stern, the company has a right to censor what it pleases, and I won't miss his delightful style of penis-based humor. If you really miss him, you can just order some back-issues of Playboy on tape and Paypal him your cash.

I don't think this is the start of a slippery slope either. They're basically gentrifying the airwaves, not suppressing actual intelligent opinions that might be dangerous to people in power. And while it may be in response to government pressure, the government pressure comes from people-pressure. And people get their opinions from...mass media. So on second thought, blame whoever you want. It's probably partly true somehow.

	28-02-2004 06:58									#90
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quote: Originally posted by Shogun Gunner Or even worse, why does the government feel the need or "responsibility" to deny programming? It's funny how personalities are criticized in their era for being TOO ANGRY or TOO DISGUSTING or TOO WHATEVER...then twenty years later everyone fawns all over the "geniuses" and talks about how ground breaking they are. I don't think Stern is a genius, but a lot of people like him. I'm just highly offended that people, organizations and government would try to impose their will over another group. I can accept the individual or individuals organized together, but when they try to activiate the machinery of government, I have to draw the line there.