09-03-2004 09:18									#31
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Mead the turn you posted seems to be the one that haven't been played with. Did I misunderstand you? I thought you have a partial turn that you would like us to comment on.

	09-03-2004 09:24									#32
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quote: Originally posted by HongHu I will look at the turn right now. My biggest concern is still that you are planning to go solo on uni attack. We didn't have the immediate need for this. We would not be able to continue to wipe out the other bases in the next turn. In addition, Voltaire had appointed Rubin to be in charge of CMC and he was supposed to be the final decision maker regarding all military issues. If you feel strongly that we must attack Uni territory this turn I would like to hear more of your thought.

Hong Hu

I am ready to pull the trigger.

I have launched two needlejets.

One is just outside Sunshine coast with one movement point left ready to Kill the Sunshine Trance Speeder and Probe.

The is other, launchd out of Rokossvygrad, is just northwest of the CyCon CP on that island ready to Kill it.

My needlejet that was next to the CP returned to New Moscow and Killed the Data Angle Infantry.

My chopper (which was 40% damaged) Killed the Data Angel Impact Rover and Foil. It is now Hardened Moral. I landed it in New Moscow.

I need help.

How do I declare Vendetta (when they won't pick up the phone)? On CyCon.

I can sneak attack, and will if I have to, but I don't want to if I can declar Vendetta before.


Mead

	09-03-2004 09:51									#33
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Looks like that we are at a point of no return then.

I suggest you clear whatever bases you can, but please do not take sunshine coast. We have agreed that the Drones should have that base.

Use the chopper to take longreach, and drop all the probes and garrisons into it. Let's hope all goes well.

	09-03-2004 09:57									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Mead I have launched two needlejets. One is just outside Sunshine coast with one movement point left ready to Kill the Sunshine Trance Speeder and Probe.

Um... will this have an impact on the CPU noticing the unit and on Foreman Buster's plan?

Perhaps this unit needs to be disbanded to prevent the scenario that Foreman Buster fears regarding the disbanding of Uni bases...

EDIT: Nevermind... apparently, you're TAKING the base.

	09-03-2004 10:04									#35
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Actually that is a good idea. Disband this plane we can still hold.

	09-03-2004 10:12									#36
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We don't have any probe in postition to drop to longreach. We only have one or two drop garrisons too I think. I don't think we should start strike this turn.

Anyway, I have to go now. Best of luck!!!

	09-03-2004 10:31									#37
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Quick question... I know we discussed only opening up on the so-called "Eastern" front because we didn't want to mess up what Foreman Buster worried about on the so-called "Western Front" until Buster had a chance to attack....

So why did we open up our attack on both fronts? Are we not worried that this could have the impact that Foreman Buster worried about or is there something else that I'm failing to consider (if so bear with me)?

	09-03-2004 10:45									#38
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You know, I haven't the foggiest. I would rather us focus on the Uni, with some punitive expeditions against the Data Angels so that PEACE can take and hold those bases.

It's highly doubtful that the CyCon would lay waste to the Uni bases until things are completely one-sided. I don't think that they would do that even IF the Uni was a lost cause.

	09-03-2004 11:09									#39
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Sigh.

We don't have a war in the estern front. We only need to take a Roze base for the PEACE to stay and kill the CC colony pod.

The war we are talking about is at the western front, it is not for buster. We are doing it together. In the end of 2161, we will each get half of the uni bases. But I am not sure now. The war may become a little not according to the plan and it may take longer to finish. Hopefully I am wrong.

	09-03-2004 11:24									#40
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quote: Originally posted by HongHu Sigh. We don't have a war in the estern front. We only need to take a Roze base for the PEACE to stay and kill the CC colony pod. The war we are talking about is at the western front, it is not for buster. We are doing it together. In the end of 2161, we will each get half of the uni bases. But I am not sure now. The war may become a little not according to the plan and it may take longer to finish. Hopefully I am wrong.

Yes, this is my worry. Attacking the colony pod, fighting the Data Angels, and trying to protect PEACE made sense this turn. I supported it. But I question whether we should have attacked the University until doing it with the Free Drones next turn.

But whatever, it's been a while since I played this game and I'm not entirely up to date on what is going on in here, so I'm sure there must still be some piece of this picture that I'm missing.

	09-03-2004 11:28									#41
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http://apolyton.net/upload/view.php...ve2159Meads.SAV


Comrads

Above is the Save.

I have not hit End Turn yet.

Please review and give me your comments before I hit end turn.

Highlights.

Eastern Front:

CyCon Colony Pod Destroyed by Needlejet launched out of Rossovkygrad.

Data Angel Invasion on our shores destroyed.
Data Angel Transprt off our shores destroyed.

Attack on Conshelf57 by Chopper out of Googliegrad FAILED. Chopper destroyed. Data Angel garrison at 80% damage. No other Hive units within striking distance this turn.


Western Front:

Sunshine Attacked
Population dropped to 1
Uni 1-2t-2 and 0-1-1 probe garrison destroyed.
Very Green Needlejet took 70% damage, is sitting on road/river providing aerial blockade.

Longreach Taken
Population dropped to 1
Dropped two 1~3-1 infantry in it, one Disciplined, the other Green.

Uni 1-2t-2 and 0-1-1 probe garrison destroyed.
Uni 1-1-1 scout outside Longreach destroyed.
Uni transport SE of Longreach destroyed.

All Choppers within range of Longreach landed in Longreach.

Recon of nearby fungus for Probes accomplished by choppers and needlejet. Negative findings.

More details to follow.


Mead

	09-03-2004 11:35									#42
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quote: Originally posted by HongHu Sigh. We don't have a war in the estern front. We only need to take a Roze base for the PEACE to stay and kill the CC colony pod. The war we are talking about is at the western front, it is not for buster. We are doing it together. In the end of 2161, we will each get half of the uni bases. But I am not sure now. The war may become a little not according to the plan and it may take longer to finish. Hopefully I am wrong.

Eastern Front was repulsing the Data Angel Invasion near New Moscow, Killing the CyCon CP, and Emptying Conshelf57 for Peace to occupy.

All went well except our attack on Conshelf57 failed.

Mead

	09-03-2004 11:53									#43
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Comrade Mead, it seems you have issued military orders without the consent of the Central Military Committee. Our line of communication may be quirky--but if you have actually engaged any University units and thereby overridden the Central Military Committee's jurisdiction in major military matters I believe the Central Military Committee is redundant.

Hence, I shall resign as Chairman of the Central Military Committee and assume general citizen advisory status. However, there is a possibility that there's been a simple misunderstanding--and I need your confirmation on what has happened before I take any final action and elaborate on this decision.

Comrade Rubin
Chairman of the Central Military Committee

	09-03-2004 12:03									#44
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quote: Originally posted by Rubin Comrade Mead, it seems you have issued military orders without the consent of the Central Military Committee. Our line of communication may be quirky--but if you have actually engaged any University units and thereby overridden the Central Military Committee's jurisdiction in major military matters I believe the Central Military Committee is redundant. Hence, I shall resign as Chairman of the Central Military Committee and assume general citizen advisory status. However, there is a possibility that there's been a simple misunderstanding--and I need your confirmation on what has happened before I take any final action and elaborate on this decision. Comrade Rubin Chairman of the Central Military Committee

Comrade Rubin I confirm that I engaged Uni forces.

Please see above save.


Mead

	09-03-2004 12:10									#45
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Let's all talk about this before things get out of hand again.

	09-03-2004 12:38									#46
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What do we want for our Research Goal.

I realize it is a little late to check with you folks.

The most recent guidance I had was our beeline posted by Hong Hu:

quote: 08-02-2004 01:14 | profile | pm | search | buddy edit | quote link | report | ip Support Apolyton Future beeline: Hive: Planetary economics Drones: AMA/fusion Would like to get your thoughts. Also could somebody check which tech PEACE is offering would we need? I don't want all of them since it will increase our tech cost and slow our tech rate.

Then Hong Hu posted this and nobody responded:

quote: 07-03-2004 03:49 | profile | pm | search | buddy edit | quote link | report | ip Support Apolyton We will finish Intell Integrity this turn. I believe the next available tech are the following: Polymorphic Software Bio-Engineering Cyberethics Nonlinear Mathematics Suggest reseach Bio-Eng. I would appreciate if somebody can double check if I am correct.

Right now we are researching Planetary economics 7 years per breakthrough, 6 years to go.

If we change it to something else we will lose half of these Lab points.

If I hear nothing. I will hit End Turn and post it as is.


I offer no opinion on which one to take. Let me know what you want.


Mead

	09-03-2004 12:40									#47
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Everyone

Hong Hu

Rubin

Please check the turn.

I am preparing to hit End Turn and Post it.

Let me know what you want changed.


Mead

	09-03-2004 12:45									#48
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Keep research as is, no use in letting our accumulated research points go to waste.

	09-03-2004 12:50									#49
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We have until 17:46 today, 9-3-2004 in which to post th turn.

I will be logging off shortly but will log on again in about 4 hours.

At that time I will have to make any required changes, that we can still make, hit End Turn and upload the Turn.


Please review the Turn and post corrections.


Mead

	09-03-2004 13:34									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Frankychan Keep research as is, no use in letting our accumulated research points go to waste.

I would agree with this in any case, but Planetary Economics isn't a bad tech.

My only concern is that perhaps we should invest in Non-Linear Mathematics, given our current situation (if I remember my SMAC/SMAX techs correctly after a year and a half of not playing the game, that is...).

	09-03-2004 14:29									#51
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Is it too late for somone else to play the turn?

I mean, we failed in the main objective, to get ConShelf, and we attacked the Uni one turn early.

-Jam

	09-03-2004 16:25									#52
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If I understand the rules of this game correctly, our move is due in less than 10 hours?

Whatever happens, we need to figure it out FAST.

	09-03-2004 19:13									#53
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Based upon Objections raised by Rubin, Arnelos, and Jamski

I'll hold onto the turn and will not post in open forum.

I do note:

Buster was consulted and replied "you can go if you want to but will probably take some casulties." We took none in the Uni invasion. Probably avoided some.

Arnelos asks

quote: If I understand the rules of this game correctly, our move is due in less than 10 hours? Whatever happens, we need to figure it out FAST.

We may be able to get an extension, if needed.


Jamski wrote

quote: Is it too late for somone else to play the turn? I mean, we failed in the main objective, to get ConShelf, and we attacked the Uni one turn early. -Jam

I can see you asking to get someone else to play for the Uni invasion. But, there was no question that we were going to attack the CP, and there was no question that we were going to attack Conshelf57, and there was no question that we were going to eliminate the Data Angels invasion force on the ground near New Moscow.

We had a limited number of Aircraft within range of Conshelf57. We had the odds in our favor in the attack on Conshelf57. Replaying that portion of the turn would be wrong to the other teams. That probably would not be pemitted.


We will need a ruling from Googlie if you want the turn redone. CyCon will cry murder if we try to redo it, but if it is the will of the people to ask to replay then have Voltaire ask Googlie.

I will check back in, in a few hours.


Mead

	09-03-2004 19:25									#54
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This was posted by Kody in the Open ACDG forum.

I am not sure he should be posting it there because it let the other teams know hat we are up to, but he points out a lot of teraforming and production errors I made (some which can be corrected) before End Turn is hit (if we play this turn).

If we do play this turn then I would fix the above.

A couple of things:
One, I wish Kody hadn't posted the info he got from looking at the turn saved in the Hive forums in the open forum.

Two, I am glad he offered a number of very important, and accurate, observations on the teraforming. Although he is not a member of this forum he gave a lot of useful info. We can fix a lot of it.

Three, I wish he was still a member here as the quality and quality of his work is excellent.


Mead

quote: I just had to comment on most recent turn. Support Apolyton 1. Crawlers goes on Mine, workers goes on Forest. Not the other way around. (in more than one place) 2. Borehole goes on Mineral bonus, not next to mineral bonus. 3. You already have a terraform plan that was drawn up a long time ago so you shouldn't even be making that mistake. 4. Borehole on river eliminates river, avoid losing a several squares of river system to a borehole. 5. Check for drone riots before they happen, not when they're already rioting. 6. Upgrade certain scouts to police units for 10 ECs, unset doctors. 7. 9 terraformers on one square is not efficient, unless you're carefully planning all your terraforming moves. Spread terraformers in groups of maybe 2 or 4 (at most 6) if you're not carefully planning everything. Otherwise terraformers spend a lot of time just moving around. (Use even numbered groups of terraformers as terraforming usually takes even numbers of turns) 8. moving 7 terraformers to an unroaded square is not efficient, especially when it doesn't cost 7 terraforming turns to make a road. 9. Network nodes = -2 drones, consider building them now and again when you have time. 10. Consider building more +labs +econo facilities in captial and putting energy a little energy in. 11. I'm saddened to see pop booming completely stopped as soon as Enigma left and looks to be too late now

	09-03-2004 20:41									#55
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Confirm researching Planetary Economics. My other post was based on an excel research tree application that must have incorrect inputs and generated incorrect results.

	09-03-2004 20:49									#56
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I have notified the Drones about what happened.

quote: Comrade Mead has gone ahead and attacked Uni disregarding orders from CMC Chairman Rubin and oppositions from about all the current active players in the Hive. I have PMed GooglieGod for a replay. If it is ruled that we must use the turn, Mead has attacked sunshine coast without taking it, but reduced its population to one. It may not be suitable for taking at your turn. I apologize for the disruption this has caused for our entire plan.

	09-03-2004 20:51									#57
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Comrade Mead, although a slightly different approach was suggested by the Central Military Committee you were cleared to:

1) Eliminate the CyCon colony pod.
2) Engage Datajack Roze's small invasion force.
3) Disable defensive measures at Conshelf57.

Also, as suggested you did consult Foreman buster prior to launching the University invasion. However, the 'bold and decisive plan' to start the University invasion during M.Y. 2159 was never authorized by the Central Military Committee--instead concern was expressed. The University invasion is considered a matter of major military importance.

The 'objection' I raised was that of the Central Military Committee's jurisdiction being overridden. Even if the orders you dispatched prove to be the better strategy the result is that the Central Military Committee has been relieved of its military mandate. The Central Military Committee is reduced to a redundant, academic 'Parade' Committee. (I'll elaborate if required.)

To the best of my knowledge we cannot--and shall not--re-issue orders! You, Comrade Mead, were designated to dispatching orders. You have done so! And to this, I believe, you have worked hard and tried your best to accomplish hivean objectives. We should instead focus on the planning of M.Y. 2160.

Comrade Rubin

	09-03-2004 21:28									#58
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The CMC is not redundant. Turn players have many responsibilities. There are many details in game that needs to be decided by the turn player. However, it is also the responsibility of the turn player to follow the team's decision on major issues.

	09-03-2004 21:58									#59
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So there is still a chance?

-Jam

	09-03-2004 22:15									#60
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We will always have our chances Comrade Jamski. As long as we still believe in ourselves. To me, it is not about whether a turn should be used or not. It is more about how we as a team should work together. I guess I have failed again. The Hive cannot be put together based on persons. We need rules to hold everybody together.