18-03-2004 09:05									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo No... examples of socialism is either Somalia or Ethoipia where millions have starved.

If food is really in such short supply under socialism....
It'd be great for the US

quote: There is no difference. Leftist, democrat, socialist. They are all Stalinists to me

You didn't answer the first point I made in that post

	18-03-2004 09:06									#32
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo There is no difference. Leftist, democrat, socialist. They are all Stalinists to me

sig material

	18-03-2004 09:07									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar If food is really in such short supply under socialism.... It'd be great for the US

quote: You didn't answer the first point I made in that post

You make points? That'd be the day!

	18-03-2004 09:08									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo You make points? That'd be the day!

Todays your lucky day Fez Answer me this:

quote: Anarchy had nothing to do with it?

	18-03-2004 09:24									#35
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Fez, your problem is you are taking the BEST POSSIBLE example of capitalism, the USA, and comparing it to a third world hellhole where it really doesn't matter WHAT you do, in a century you'll still be in civil wars, dictatorships, and making rich white American kid's shoes.

---

I saw the part about education. Classic stuff. Especially the part where he started calling the education guy a socialist. I wonder if he is Fez in disguise

	18-03-2004 09:25									#36
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quote: Originally posted by mrmitchell Fez, your problem is you are taking the BEST POSSIBLE example of capitalism, the USA, and comparing it to a third world hellhole where it really doesn't matter WHAT you do, in a century you'll still be in civil wars, dictatorships, and making rich white American kid's shoes.

Unfortunately for you the third world is the best possible example of socialism.

	18-03-2004 09:27									#37
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quote: Unfortunately for you the third world is the best possible example of socialism.

I thought someone already mentioned Sweden

	18-03-2004 09:30									#38
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That would me me, baby.



And I don't think the USA represent the best possible example of capitalism......Capitalism run amok, yes. But other than that, not by a long shot.

	18-03-2004 10:13									#39
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quote: Originally posted by mrmitchell I thought someone already mentioned Sweden

Since when was Sweden not part of the third world?

Frankychan: The US is a model capitalist state where people live in economic freedom. Down with communism and stupidity! Down with socialism!

	18-03-2004 10:14									#40
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Is there a point for this thread any longer?

	18-03-2004 10:17									#41
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Not really, although it is kinna funny to keep seeing the Thread title keep on jumping to the top of the list.

	18-03-2004 10:20									#42
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quote: The belief that most of society is middle class is a myth.

Um... if by myth you mean absolutely true?

	18-03-2004 11:35									#43
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Socialism makes people lazy, dull, and dependent. East Germans still haven't recovered from their 40 years dose of socialism.

	18-03-2004 11:42									#44
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But in Socialism the equality gets turned and twisted into something unhealthy many times BECAUSE people are greedy.



Anyway, I don't like this O'Reilly guy just for this one. The whole Europe? This is an insult to Europe. We are bunch of many contries with lot of variety. To call Europe wants this or that is bunch of BS. He don't know **** about Europe. Say individual countries, not the whole dman place, next time I'm going to slap his flubby azz all the way to the audience and 6th row if he can't tell the difference. Generalizing mf.

	18-03-2004 11:47									#45
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And I mean it too, guy is shouting clear stereotypes and saying there are whole bunch of countries wanting it, doing it, trying to achieve. He knows nothing. I'd say this guy is pretty much about entertainment and dangerous to American minds, turning Euro friends against you in your minds. **** O'Reilly. I just might need to come to a live tv show, shout biblical stuff like Sam Jackson and kick his ass for doing this.

	18-03-2004 12:36									#46
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**** you guys. I want inequality. I want to be better than other people. I want to kick some ass. If it is socialism, then you better let me be party head so I can have my cavier and fine wine... then when my time comes I will take corrup... I mean retirement money numbering no more than $500 million.

	18-03-2004 14:09									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Frankychan Hmmm, Universal Healthcare.......... [ sarcasm ] Yup, that is definitely weak. Providing healthcare to anyone that needs it. [ /sarcasm] O'Reilly can kiss my a**. Socialism's core roots are in equality, whereas capitalisms core roots are mired in greed.

In my 30 odd years of life, I've come to the conclusion that indivual human beings have a knack for ruining things, just as they have a knack for doing good things. IOW, it all comes down to the indivual and the choices s/he makes in life. I've seen plenty of capitalists do good by their people, and the same holds true for those who hold more "socialistic" views. OTOH, I've also seen both do terrible things.

It's all about the individual and the choices s/he makes ...

Gatekeeper

	18-03-2004 14:42									#48
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If students fail to master the skills taught in a certain grade then they should be held back. Social promotion won't do them or else one bit of good plus it devalues the worth of a high school diploma.

	18-03-2004 14:44									#49
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How dows socialism devalue High School Diploma?

	18-03-2004 14:46									#50
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quote: we finally realized why oreilly wants to keep kids back -

This quote made it sound like LoA disagreed with the idea of making kids repeat a grade if they don't master the necisary skills. It has nothing to do with socialism and instead deals with LoA original post.

	18-03-2004 14:53									#51
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oh sorry I misunderstood. YEs, definitely, if the kid don't get it, make him go at it again. This is just statistic games you know.. 'if we can mark him up as graduate, it's good to us' instead of actually getting educated. Statistic game will not do anything good in the long term, and such, I'm already writing my Biblican stuff I'll be shouting and trying to make faces like Sam Jackson.

	18-03-2004 15:13									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Frankychan Socialism's core roots are in equality, whereas capitalisms core roots are mired in greed.

Yea, one is rooted in an idea that doesn't exist in the real world beyond the molecular level and the other in something universal to human nature.

	18-03-2004 15:16									#53
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quote: Originally posted by Frankychan You have got to be kidding me, right? Capitalism makes its wealth by stratification of society. Where the rich become richer by making money off of those with less....in essence, exploitation.

Yea, that's why the same families have dominated the U.S. to a greater and greater extent since it was founded, while the penniless immigrants have been reduced to lira-less citizens. No wonder so many people are queing up to leave the country and no one wants to come here.

	18-03-2004 15:23									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Gatekeeper In my 30 odd years of life, I've come to the conclusion that indivual human beings have a knack for ruining things, just as they have a knack for doing good things. IOW, it all comes down to the indivual and the choices s/he makes in life. I've seen plenty of capitalists do good by their people, and the same holds true for those who hold more "socialistic" views. OTOH, I've also seen both do terrible things. It's all about the individual and the choices s/he makes ... Gatekeeper

Keep your damnably reasonable opinins to yourself!

Capitalism and Socialism are not mutually exclusive. One is simply the codification of observations about human economic behavior, the other a political system. The U.S. system is simply one which subscribes to both Capitalism and Socialism, though the latter to a lesser degree than in most of Europe.

	18-03-2004 15:32									#55
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Wait - a guy named Bill O'Reilly speaks bad about us Eurocoms? Oh the horror!

	18-03-2004 16:13									#56
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http://www.flash.gr/


Scroll to the bottom of the page and look at the left bottom part

	18-03-2004 17:49									#57
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Pointing the finger at Europe is not the answer becuase we have many socialists here. So we creep ever closer to socialism here while we ridicule Europe. Of course Pekka is right. We cannot group all nations in a certain geographic area together and write the whole thing off.

Anyway, socialism is based on the big mommy principle. People cannot handle individual liberties so they depend on the state to make decisions for them just like their mother did when they were children.

	18-03-2004 18:27									#58
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Lincoln, What would those decisions be that the state would make for you?

	18-03-2004 18:31									#59
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we have a socialist governement

and although i would rather see a more right course of action, i cannot say i feel the governement is making all of my decisions.

of course, if by socialism you meen communism you have a point.

	18-03-2004 18:40									#60
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I don't think by core socialism is bad. It doesn't count out the capitalist thinking and implementation.

I would say as far as socialism goes, we do have pretty working system, but it is starting to crumble. I think we could keep some of the socialist ideas, but change the system more that it would generate more money. Generating money is only possible when you have big corporations doing business beyond borders, so that's where we need to put some more light. If we had many more succesful businesses, it could be different situation.

But as for now, there is not enough money and everyone suffers from it. The system is expensive, and if it's not working, there's no value to your system because the benefits of it are non existent, but you still pay for the system. Some ideas of socialism just needs to be dumped, but I think we could still keep the healthcare etc. We just need to step it up, generate money so it would actually work.

Call it capitalism with care.