28-04-2004 05:44									#91
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd Lonestar, Don't forget that we also attacked Germany on a pretext in WW1.

Yes, but:

1: Germany was conducting unrestricted submarine warfare

and

2: We didn't act alone.

	28-04-2004 06:41									#92
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quote: Not really. The Soviet Union always lagged far behind the United States in economic strength, and the US possessed a FAR greater share of world GNP and world manufacturing, as well as a per capita GNP of more than double that of the USSR. Economic and industrial strength translates into long term military strength. It's true that the Soviet Union maintained conventional GROUND forces (but not air or naval forces) superior to any other individual nation (at least until the mid 1980s), but this power was only relevant in the short run, and was achieved at the expense of greater economic growth (and thus at the expense of long term potential power). If the want to talk about nuclear weapons, then the US was either markedly superior, or both sides possessed a sufficient amount of weapons to totally destroy the other, depending on the time period in question.

I didn't mention anything long term. I just said, "in parts, the USSR was the leader".

If we want to talk about nuclear weapons, the Soviets had our asses ready to hand on a silver platter, but so did we for them. Even if they did have thousands more than we did at times, those thousands don't even matter, it would only take far less than what we had to annihlate the whole goddamn earth.

	28-04-2004 06:50									#93
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quote: Originally posted by Saras Why are you so fast to turn into a hair-splitting Clinton when it comes to Russia, as ooposed to the righteous champion of "legality" in international affairs that do not involve Russia?

Why you didn't answer simple questions?
Was it a illegal? Was it against an international law? Was it an agression, an act of war, etc.?

	28-04-2004 06:54									#94
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quote: Originally posted by Saras Oh, and it was Iceland that first recognized our independence (January 1991). So there

I always thought that it was the president of RSFSR, this dumbass Yeltzin, who signed such act few months before collapse of the the USSR.
I'm not really sure that Iceland could make such diplomatic move against USSR.

	28-04-2004 07:01									#95
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 I'm pleased to report that I have returned from the re-education camp at the lumbermill and it was an unqualified success. I had all those Ruskie's singing "God Bless America" and "America the Beautiful" before I left.

Ruskies in Siberia doesn't speak English and can't sing American songs (except "Yankees, go home" and Queen's "We will, we will, **** you "). More probably this doc did something wrong with your head and now you have hallucinations time after time.

	28-04-2004 07:30									#96
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quote: Originally posted by Last Conformist Serb: You're just jealous 'cos we make better vodka than you!

Next thing you'll tell me, is that vodka is a Swedish word.

	28-04-2004 07:34									#97
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quote: Originally posted by Lord Merciless Don't worry. Russkies will sooner or later die out and be replaced by the Chinese.

Don't worry. You will die out and be replaced by Chinese, Mexicans and Arabs, much earlier.

	28-04-2004 08:01									#98
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quote: Originally posted by mrmitchell I didn't mention anything long term. I just said, "in parts, the USSR was the leader". If we want to talk about nuclear weapons, the Soviets had our asses ready to hand on a silver platter, but so did we for them. Even if they did have thousands more than we did at times, those thousands don't even matter, it would only take far less than what we had to annihlate the whole goddamn earth.

the Soviet Union never, ever, had more nukes than us.

	28-04-2004 08:04									#99
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quote: Originally posted by Serb I always thought that it was the president of RSFSR, this dumbass Yeltzin, who signed such act few month before collapse of the USSR. I'm not really sure that Iceland could make such diplomatic move against USSR.

Strictly speaking, the USA never recognized Russia's illegal occupation of the Baltic states after the deal-cutting with Hitler.

	28-04-2004 08:06									#100
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar I'm hoping your kidding

Nope.


I seriously do not believe so. Hell, they didn't even reach the "oh God, oh God, it's the end of the world" point until the '70's, up until then we could have concievably stomped them flat and came out signifigantly better. (Which is not to say I think that would have been a good idea, for either us or them)

	28-04-2004 08:10									#101
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And, amazingly, half of those are "reserve/retired.".

Reserve being commie speak for "archaic and/or useless."

	28-04-2004 08:21									#102
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar Actually, its commiespeak for "Secretly active" As in: "No, there is no danger of our stockpile being stolen. They are retired." But regardless, the Russian nuclear stockpile has been larger than the US from *at least* 1978-1985

* Lonestar hangs head in shame


I accept it's possible I have been mistaken.

I also accept that American SLBMs and ICBMs can fly farther, faster, and more accurately than Russian ones.

	28-04-2004 10:24									#103
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quote: Originally posted by Lonestar Alcohol is my anti-drug.

They allow you to drink? I thought you're with the navy intelligence or smth.

quote: I was refering to holding off on opening a second front in France, one which Stalin was begging for, incidently.

Like you didn't hold off it untill the last minute when the outcome of war was clear enough.

quote: Alright. Thanks for stopping Napoleon,

You are welcome.

quote: Because, unlike a certain other country. *cough* Russia! *cough* we don't intentionaly go after civilian targets.

Don't make me laugh. WTF your artillery is doing right now in Iraq? Or perhaps Iraqis cities are non-civilian targets or your artillery shells considering as precisious weapons? (I doubt, only Russians have such technology).

quote: Pfff....what about the mass deportations of the assorted caucus nationalities to Central Asia?

What about them? Chechens were deported to Khazakstan during WW2, since they fought against their country. No matter what you'll say, it was a crime. It is a crime when representatives of certain ethnic group take arms and join invaders in war against the state. And government deported them to stop thier support of nazi, to prevent them joining nazis forces.
It was a war, God damn it, and it was a wartime measure.

quote: What about the mysterious disappearence of the Volga Germans?

1) Why mysterious? They still live there. 1941 they were deported when nazis were just several hundred kilometers away from them and it was clear that this territory will be lost to nazis soon. It was done, because of known nazi's policy to draft 'wolksdeutche' into their army from occupied lands . The Soviet government at first year of war, always tried to evacuate as much property and population from territories that considered will be lost soon, as possible. It's pretty logical arpoach in a wartime. Do you think they just could left thousands of "wolksdeutche", knowing that nazis will force them to take up arms and fight vs. Soviets?
Your goverment deported thousands of Americans with Japanese roots, despite there was no a single chance of Japanese invasion of North American continent.

2) We were talking about natives. Volga's Germans it's not exactly a native population of this region. They are decsendents of German immigrants who populate this area since Cathrine times.

3) All those people who were deported during WW2, returned to their lands after the war. They were not thrown to reservations and slowly exterminated, like you did with Native Americans.

quote: What about the occupation of Yakut land in Siberia? (Free our Inuit bretheren!)

What about them? Yakut Autonomus Region is the largest "subject of federation (in US, it stands for the "state") of Russian Federation. Not a single inch of their land were took from them and there was not a single reservation for them (or for anyone else). Yakuts are absolute majority of Yakut Autonomus Region. Like in all authonomus regions of Russia, native population maintain its traditions and culture and have two official languages- the language of the federation (Russian) and their native language. And they write their official papers, broadcast TV, print newspapers, write street signs, etc. on those two languages. So, wtf are you talking about? What kind of occupation? Can you name me a single state in US where Native Americans is the majority of pupulation, where they maintain their culture and traditions, and where their native language considered as one of the two official languages of this state?

quote: What about stomping down on National groups that do wish to secede?

Wtf are you talking about? If it's Chechens again, then for your knowledge on referendum about this issue, ABSOLUTE (about 90%) majority of them voted for staying in federation. Why do you considering gangs of bandids and terrorists as legal representatives of entire people? The people made their choice during referendum. This choice is clear. And I don't see why our goverment should care much about opinion of f*cking terrorists. Does your or any other government care about opinion of terrorists and bandits?

quote: What about handling said groups by f--king leveling their cities?

WTF?
If you're talking about Chechnya again, then
for your information:
1) Chechens never build cities. They lived in a small villages called "auls".

2) Groznyi is the Russian city, founded by Russians in 19th century (its name originate from fortress "Groznaya" (Terrible) and it was Russians who lived there till Chechens started to cut their throats in early 90's.

3) You, as 99,9% of westerners have no idea about Chechnya, Chechen-Russian relationship, the history of this relationships and do not know why Russians came into such sh!thole as Chechnya at the first place. (hint: no one really cared about oil a couple of centuries ago. Back then, Chechnya was an absolute sh!thole, there was nothing to take in this land, only rocks.)

quote: What about the enforced "Russification", and the subsequent oppression of religions under both Tsarist and Communist Russia?

Wtf are you talking about? What opression? What Russification? You've beaten childrens of Native Americans held in reservation, if they spoke on their native language. You did everything to exterminate them and their culture. Where is the Native population of the territory you occupy now?
In Russia, none native ethnic group was treated this way. NONE. They still maintain their cultures, languages, traditions and have the same rights.
Just how long ago you've abolished the segregation?
You did abolish it, in all states, right?

quote: I don't claim America has the most blindingly fair history, but Russia's hands are every bit as dirty as ours, and, if desease had as big a factor in your expansion they'd probably be dirtier. We're just honest enough with ourselves and others to admit it.

Russian expansion was absolutely different from American or any other expansions. ABSOLUTELY. So even don't try to paint Russia in the same colours as US.

quote: Chechnya comes to mind. I'm afraid I don't know the Russian spelling.

You spell it absolutely correct, but the problem is, that such country doesn't exist and NEVER existed. You really have to read something about the history of this ethnic group. They have a very... hm... unique culture.

quote: Because we've had a grand total of one civil war and you've had endless coups, revolutions, and civil wars in your history?

No, because your state based on expoltation of others and sooner or later it will fall.

quote: Yep, I know who's more self destructing.

Me too.

quote: Or maybe we're inclined to mind our own damn buisness. Remember, we're a nation of Draft-dodgers. Why do you think so many Germans came over to the states in the 1800s? However.... Starting from1798: 1798: The quasi-war with France 1801-1815: The Barbary Wars 1846-47: The Mexican War (Don't laugh...their army was three times ours' size) 1860-65: The Civil War, largest General War anywhere since the Napoleonic wars. 1898: War with Spain 1898-1904: The Phillippine Insurrection 1906-1922: A million fricking interventions in Central America 1916: The Mexican Expedition 1962-1973: 'Nam Followed by the Dominacn Republic, Grenada, Panama, Haiti, etc.

Well, aside various punishing raids, for two centuries it's how many wars that you fought alone? Three?
Russia had dozen within a single decade sometimes.

quote: No country ever abstains in the UNSC unless that's their quiet approval and you know it.

No, I don't know. If someone abstains, it just means he doesn't pleased with two other choices. Had SU voted "Yes", then your claim about blessing would have been corect. It wasn't a blessing, Soviets just turned around and wistle.
But, OK, first war was justified, in accordance with international law, since Iraq acted as agressor in the first place.

quote: History will judge that.

Not a chance.
If you'll break into your neighbour's house and kick his ass, because you considering him a bastard who is beating his wife or think that he is planting something against you (perhaps to blow-up your car or smth) you will be arrested and thrown in jail. No one would care about your moral ground, you'll be arrested if such act is an illegal by current law. And no one will rehabilitate you after 100 years, even if such act will not be considered as crime anymore.

quote: Chechnya,

Which international law, says that country can't fight bandits and terrorists on their own territory?

quote: Modavia, continued occupation of Central Asian countries.

Russia occupy Moldavia and Central Asian countries!!!

Also in our news: Martians attack the New-Yourk city!!!
If you think if country A has military bases on territory of country B, it means that country A occupy country B, then US is absolute champion of occupation. Because no one else has so many millitary bases on territories of other countries as US has.

quote: And this is with your military power diminished. Before that we had Afghanistan, China, Hungary, Czech Republic, all those "liberated" eastern Europen countries, and the Baltic states.

From legal (I'm not taling about morality now,) point of view, those invasions were more or less legalized. USSR was invited there by recognized govermnets of those countries. It's something that you lack in case of Yugoslavia and second Gulf war.
China? WTF? When SU invaded China?

	28-04-2004 10:47									#104
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quote: Originally posted by Lonestar And, amazingly, half of those are "reserve/retired.".

It's true only for 1986-1997.
For 1945-1987 this statistic is for nukes that were in active, operational forces. And in 1985 USSR had more than 1,6 times more nukes than USA, so your claim was wrong.
Good work Tass.

	28-04-2004 10:50									#105
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quote: Originally posted by Lonestar * Lonestar hangs head in shame I accept it's possible I have been mistaken.

*Serb is shocked.

quote: I also accept that American SLBMs and ICBMs can fly farther, faster, and more accurately than Russian ones.

Not a chance.

	28-04-2004 10:52									#106
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I'm not sure if this has been said, but:

communism sucks

	28-04-2004 11:04									#107
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Thank you for your valuable contribution.

	28-04-2004 11:34									#108
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quote: Originally posted by Serb You, as 99,9% of westerners have no idea about Chechnya, Chechen-Russian relationship, the history of this relationships and do not know why Russians came into such sh!thole as Chechnya at the first place. (hint: no one really cared about oil a couple of centuries ago. Back then, Chechnya was an absolute sh!thole, there was nothing to take in this land, only rocks.)

Well, those mountain tiles in caucasus give 100% defense bonus

	28-04-2004 11:40									#109
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Mountain terrain always gives huge bonus to defenders.
(But as for 19th century I hardly can call Chechens a defending side).

	28-04-2004 11:48									#110
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quote: Originally posted by Lonestar Israel did it in Lebanon within a matter of days.

I doubt they had such infrastructure in Lebanon. It wasn't like withdrawing an army after the operation, it was like re-location of entire army, its personel, armaments, suplies, etc. from one place to absolutely new, unprepared place. You can't just take military facilities (that you build there for decades )from one place and move them by air to absolutely new place. It takes shitloads of time.

	28-04-2004 12:10									#111
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quote: Originally posted by David Floyd Atomic weapons,

So what? You had how many operational nukes in 1945? Six? Two were used against Japanese already. I doubt you could deliver remaining 4 into Russian core territory. And even if you could somehow, I doubt you had balls to do this. In this case Soviets would retaliated with their chem weapons. Not that chem weapons are so deadly as nukes, but they don't called WMD for nothing.

quote: superior air and naval power

Naval -yes. Air- I doubt.

quote: , far superior economic power, and far superior industrial strength.

Not so far in terms of military production. Soviets outnumbered western allied forces in Europe how much? 3:1? And don't even start telling me about superiority of western equipment in 1945.

quote: Even if the Soviets overran all of Europe in 1945 (unlikely),

It is very likely.

quote: the US would STILL retain these advantages.

And? It took three years for you to create and send 2 million army to Europe. And if Soviets would have destroyed this army (and they would, no doubt), then how many years it would took to create new such army from scratch?

quote: Oh, and with regards to the Napoleonic Wars, it was the English who provided the subsidies for the successive coalitions against France, and to a large degree paid for the huge Austrian and Russian armies, while at the same time maintaining a strong naval blockade against France AND committing large forces to Spain, forces which eventually defeated the 300,000+ French and Allied troops in Spain and invaded southern France. It was the English who provided the economic means to defeat Napoleon, not the Russians, or Austrians, or Prussians, or Swedes, or anyone else.

Please, please, tell me more about this. I really wish to know more about English equipping Russian soldiers with weapons and paying their salaries.

	28-04-2004 12:17									#112
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quote: Originally posted by Lonestar Strictly speaking, the USA never recognized Russia's illegal occupation of the Baltic states after the deal-cutting with Hitler.

Blah...blah...blah...
Afterwar borders of SU were recognized by all Allied countries in 1945, including USA. Type Potsdam conference in a search engine.

	28-04-2004 12:26									#113
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Been off awhile, I'll try to catch up with some highlights:

quote: Originally posted by Serb It's a "K". Had it would be an "L", than it would be a word for "Poland" or "Tonny Blair", perhaps.

Don't like Poland, do we?

quote: Originally posted by Serb I have no idea. Is FOX already planting stories about : Russians commiting genocide towards penguins or something; Putin himself eating babies; Russian mad scientists working on Death Star project, intending to destroy America?

Haven't heard about the penguins yet. Thanks for the assist.

quote: Originally posted by Serb Just how much time your soldiers need to run with tails between their legs when they face a real resistance? Five minutes?

Those aren't tails.

quote: Originally posted by Serb Beating an Amrican who spent some time with lumber. I'm not sure. Considering how Yanks can use lumber for training (Rocky-4). I'm

The Russian fighter in Rocky was tough too.

quote: Originally posted by Serb p.s. It's really ironic that so many countries that were pretty powerfull during their history had the same national colors. Russia, USA, UK, France, Netherlands (did I miss something?) all have red, blue, and white colors. Is that some kind of mystic?

Interesting point.

quote: Originally posted by mrmitchell [Serb] The night ends, and the sun rises in the sky, thanks to the Party.

I've been to some college parties like that...

quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar Actually, -оссия

Use a "C" as the first letter and you get dangerously close to an American slang word.

quote: Originally posted by Oncle Boris I know this one's a troll... but Napoleon would have assraped anything American back in the time. America's military history profoundly sucks. It's not even close to France's.

Well... We beat the English twice around this time and they beat the French. It also would be a logistical nightmare for them. All moot points since we were generally on good terms with France.

quote: Originally posted by Serb You are living in a fantasy world. In 1945 Red Army was the strongest, most experienced and better euipped army on this planet.

Don't you think Lend-Lease had something to do with that?

quote: Originally posted by Serb Russia might be in shite NOW, but she will get here crap together sooner or later, like she always do. On the other hand, US was and will remain complete **** forever. You are doomed and we will bury you, because self-destruction is your nature.

Quoting Khruschev again?

quote: Originally posted by Serb God bless America!!!

Thank-you. We're praying for you.

quote: Originally posted by Serb Firstly, the Soviet Union never gave its blessing for this. USSR abstained in UN.

The Soviet Union was also not even present for the vote concerning Korea in 1950. Have a problem making difficult decisions?

quote: Originally posted by Serb We can always return them, just whistle.

That not a whistle you're hearing.

quote: Originally posted by Last Conformist Serb: You're just jealous 'cos we make better vodka than you!

I'm afraid I'll have to say something nice about Russia for a change. Stoly is the best, hands down.

quote: Originally posted by Serb Why you didn't answer simple questions? Was it a illegal? Was in against international law? Was in an agression, an act of war, etc.?

Best defense is a good offense, eh?

quote: Originally posted by Serb Ruskies in Siberia doesn't speak English and can't sing American songs (except "Yankees, go home" and Queen's "We will, we will, **** you "). More probably this doc did something wrong with your head and now you have hallucinations time after time.

More like I re-educated them.

quote: Originally posted by Serb Don't make me laugh. WTF your artillery doing right now in Iraq? Or perhaps Iraqis cities are non-civilian targets or your artillery shells considering as precisious weapons?

According to the Geneva Convention people who take up arms are legitimate targets.

quote: Originally posted by Serb (I doubt, only Russians have such technology).

quote: Originally posted by Serb Groznyi is the Russian city, founded by Russians in 19th century (its name originate from fortress "Groznaya" (Terrible) and it was Russians who lived there till Chechens started to cut their throats in early 90's.

So, you leveled your own city with your precision artillery?

quote: Originally posted by Serb So even don't try to paint Russia in the same colours as US.

Red, white, and blue?

quote: Originally posted by Dissident I'm not sure if this has been said, but: communism sucks

Its been said virtually everywhere except for a few countries that are in denial.

quote: Originally posted by Serb It is very likely.

It is very doubtful.

	28-04-2004 12:35									#114
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quote: Originally posted by Serb Mountain terrain always gives huge bonus to defenders.

...which is great if you want to keep those pesky Turks away from your recently conquered territory motherland

	28-04-2004 12:37									#115
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quote: Originally posted by Serb So what? You had how many operational nukes in 1945? Six? Two were used against Japanese already. I doubt you could deliver remaining 4 into Russian core territory. And even if you could somehow, I doubt you had balls to do this. In this case Soviets would retaliated with their chem weapons. Not that chem weapons are so deadly as nukes, but they don't called WMD for nothing.

They had no nukes after Nagasaki, true.

quote: Naval -yes. Air- I doubt.

That's the best one. Soviet planes were known for their crappitude. The tactical bombers were fine, there was no strategic bombing force to speak of, and the fighters would have been assraped by the P-51s.
Plus, the Allies plane factories were outproducing the USSR in a 3 to 1 ratio.

quote: Not so far in terms of military production. Soviets outnumbered western allied forces in Europe how much? 3:1? And don't even start telling me about superiority of western equipment in 1945.

Soviet tanks were better, but that's about all. The Allies had a much better intendance organization and their soldiers were 100% motorized or mechanized. And by the end of 44' the Americans started to produce a decent tank model which was a match for the T-34.

3 to 1, BTW, was pretty much a minimum for the Red Army to be succesful in any operation. Even at this rate, it took them 3 years to take back what had been conquered in a summer by a much less numerous army.

quote: And? It took three years for you to create and send 2 million army to Europe. And if Soviets would have destroyed this army (and they would, no doubt), then how many years it would took to create new such army from scratch?

The Allies had more than 15 millions men mobilized, they just weren't deployed in Europe. It's true however that disembarking them in WE would have been a pain.

quote: Please, please, tell me more about this. I really wish to know more about English equipping Russian soldiers with weapons and paying their salaries.

Why do you have to be a nationalist retard? The pride you take in defending people you have never known is bordering on moronism. We're in 2004 dude, ethnic nationalism is outdated. You sound like a Russian Texan.

This said, I do believe that the Red Army would have beaten the Allies initially, but it's unclear what the long-term outcome would have been, because of their lack of navy. Next time try to be more objective.

	28-04-2004 13:33									#116
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar quote: Use a "C" as the first letter and you get dangerously close to an American slang word. Sossiya? I've never heard that before.

Go with the original Russian spelling then drop the 'iya. All you have left is a little Cocc.

(I apologize in advance...)

	28-04-2004 13:47									#117
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278

"152-mm Krasnopol & 155-mm Krasnopol-M laser guided shell

"The 152 mm KRASNOPOL and 155 mm KRASNOPOL-M guided artillery systems are intended for use against armored targets. They may also be used to destroy fortifications and for counter-battery and coastal defence anti-ship missions.

Each system comprises a guided artillery projectile, 1D15(1D22) laser target designator-range finder, 1A35 synchronization unit, an artillery system.

The KRASNOPOL/KRASNOPOL-M uses a semi-active laser guidance system during the latter part of its trajectory. Once a target has been detected by a forward observer, the target information coordinates are transmitted to the battery command post. The gun barrel angle and elevation data are transmitted to the gun position and the forward observer is alerted. The projectile is then fired and the initial part of the trajectory is carried out using a normal ballistic trajectory. As the projectile approaches the target, the forward observer illuminates the target using a tripod-mounted 1D22 Laser Target Designator - Range finder. The designation range for tank-type targets is 7,000 m. Following a mid-trajectory period controlled by inertial navigation, the seeker in the nose of the projectile locks onto the illuminated target and the projectile guidance system makes the necessary flight corrections to guide the projectile towards the target. Shortly before impact, the projectile makes a top attack on the target's upper amour, at an angle between +35 ° and +45 °. The nose-mounted seeker has a footprint of about 1,000 m. Use of the guided projectile reduced ammunition expenditure by 10 ... 15 times, mission accomplishment time is reduced by 3 .. 4 times."


http://www.aeronautics.ru/archive/a...hicles/2s19.htm

Do you have fun now?

I'll reply the rest later.

	28-04-2004 13:49									#118
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar quote: All you have left is a little Cocc. No. You'd have Pocc (Ross). Ross is not slang. Neither is Soss. (Cocc)

I'm sorry. To make it American slang you have to pronounce (Cocc) in English. Need I replace the last "c" with a 'k"?
Nevermind, it really wasn't all that funny anyway.

	28-04-2004 13:57									#119
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quote: Originally posted by Serb "152-mm Krasnopol & 155-mm Krasnopol-M laser guided shell "The 152 mm KRASNOPOL and 155 mm KRASNOPOL-M guided artillery systems are intended for use against armored targets. They may also be used to destroy fortifications and for counter-battery and coastal defence anti-ship missions. Each system comprises a guided artillery projectile, 1D15(1D22) laser target designator-range finder, 1A35 synchronization unit, an artillery system. The KRASNOPOL/KRASNOPOL-M uses a semi-active laser guidance system during the latter part of its trajectory. Once a target has been detected by a forward observer, the target information coordinates are transmitted to the battery command post. The gun barrel angle and elevation data are transmitted to the gun position and the forward observer is alerted. The projectile is then fired and the initial part of the trajectory is carried out using a normal ballistic trajectory. As the projectile approaches the target, the forward observer illuminates the target using a tripod-mounted 1D22 Laser Target Designator - Range finder. The designation range for tank-type targets is 7,000 m. Following a mid-trajectory period controlled by inertial navigation, the seeker in the nose of the projectile locks onto the illuminated target and the projectile guidance system makes the necessary flight corrections to guide the projectile towards the target. Shortly before impact, the projectile makes a top attack on the target's upper amour, at an angle between +35 ° and +45 °. The nose-mounted seeker has a footprint of about 1,000 m. Use of the guided projectile reduced ammunition expenditure by 10 ... 15 times, mission accomplishment time is reduced by 3 .. 4 times."

Cool. We, of course have had the same thing in air/sea/ground launched missles for decades. I can't say anything about artillery for sure. Its possible we may have tank rounds like that though.

	28-04-2004 15:12									#120
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Like we did not have guided missiles for decades.
An artillery shell it's a 'bit' different thing.