16-07-2004 12:47									#31
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Using the passport of a third nation to aid and abet murder makes that nation an unwitting and unwilling accomplice in your misdeed.

Jesus, I'm getting tired of putting one of these in each post, so I'll get it over with

	16-07-2004 12:55									#32
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quote: It's what it would be used for that's offensive. Like murder.

Why do you think it would be used for murder?

	16-07-2004 12:59									#33
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Because that's what you used the Canadian passports for.

	16-07-2004 13:07									#34
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You think that this is all Intelligency agencies do? There are many other reasons to have passports. I am sure there are american agents with fake passports as well, in Iran for example.

	16-07-2004 13:12									#35
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Why don't you tell me what other nation gets false passports from supposedly friendly nations and uses them to commit murders in other supposedly friendly nations?

	16-07-2004 13:16									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel I also recall the fact that the USA planned to invade Israel in 56'. and that the USA flew recon flights over Israel, breaching sovereignity and airspace.

Thats all news to me. However, you should know that overflights above a certain altitude was accepted. In the 50's and 60's we regularly overflew the USSR and Cuba with U2s. Nobody bombarded the UN or the International Court with complaints. When we produced pictures of Soviet missles in Cuba in 1961 nobody complained that they were done illegally.

I suppose attacking a US Navy ship during one of your wars was an accident?

	16-07-2004 13:20									#37
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quote: Originally posted by KrazyHorse

I think you're missing a few. Here ya go:

	16-07-2004 13:22									#38
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quote: Thats all news to me. However, you should know that overflights above a certain altitude was accepted. In the 50's and 60's we regularly overflew the USSR and Cuba with U2s. Nobody bombarded the UN or the International Court with complaints.

a) the international court didn't exist then.
b) how exactly would the UN react, seeing as the USSR, and the US were two of it's pillars, and UNSC members with veto powers?
c)As soon as it was possible ( SAM missiles) the USSR tried to shoot down the U-2s, how is that for accepted

quote: When we produced pictures of Soviet missles in Cuba in 1961 nobody complained that they were done illegally.

Again, compained to whom, exactly?

quote: I suppose attacking a US Navy ship during one of your wars was an accident?

yes, and Israel paid full compensation.

quote: Why don't you tell me what other nation gets false passports from supposedly friendly nations and uses them to commit murders in other supposedly friendly nations?

Why do you stick to this particular case of "insulting friends"?

	16-07-2004 13:28									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel I also recall the fact that the USA planned to invade Israel in 56'. and that the USA flew recon flights over Israel, breaching sovereignity and airspace.

What's this got to do with the US?

	16-07-2004 13:34									#40
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The whole "Israel is the only one doing this kind of ****" bull.

	16-07-2004 13:59									#41
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Israel is not the only one to do this. It does it only especially ruthlessly. Of course, the USA are much worse with Echelon and alike. We have for instance the NSA station in Bad Aibling. It was installed to spy out Eastern European countries during the Cold War. After it ended, its main purpose is to spy out their own NATO allies. Political and industrial spionage costs billions yearly. It was planned to close the station in 2002, but thank September 11 we will probably have to host this scum forever.

Attachment: station11.jpeg
This has been downloaded 91 time(s).

	16-07-2004 14:26									#42
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How is Israel killing someone better or worse than the SU, or Russia killing someone?

EDIT: hey, cool golf balls!

	16-07-2004 14:29									#43
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I am not talking of killing, but espionage.

	16-07-2004 14:37									#44
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mmmmmm mushrooms

	16-07-2004 14:53									#45
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I wonder how a lot of the israeli posters here would react if a foreign government stole some Israeli passports and gave them to al queda?

Methinks they would change their tune fast.

	16-07-2004 14:53									#46
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quote: It's started with diplo sanctions. If it happens again I hope to see economic sanctions.

and if the **** still continues after that, a considerable militiary threat is in order.

	16-07-2004 14:55									#47
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and what about those 500 nuclear warheads the israeli governement doesn't have ?

	16-07-2004 15:01									#48
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quote: I wonder how a lot of the israeli posters here would react if a foreign government stole some Israeli passports and gave them to al queda?

You mean our enemy?

We didn't give Canadian passports to canada's enemy, whoever they are.

Offending our national sovereignity? That's done all the time, by governments, and NGOs.

quote: and what about those 500 nuclear warheads the israeli governement doesn't have ?

What about them? I might as well bring up the Belgian genocide in the Congo as relevant to the issue.....

	16-07-2004 15:05									#49
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referring to the possibility of miliatry threat....

	16-07-2004 15:07									#50
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quote: referring to the possibility of miliatry threat....

I thought of that as a joke. War between NZ and Israel, is like a war between the Faro Islands, and Tuvalu, i.e. ain't going to happen even if they wanted to go to war.

	16-07-2004 15:11									#51
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Don't underestimate the ability of Tuvalu to project power.

	16-07-2004 15:17									#52
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quote: The Prime Minister has speculated that Israel may have wanted New Zealand passports in order to carry out assassinations in another country. On Thursday suspected Israeli spies Urie Kelman and Eli Cara were sentenced to six months jail for trying to fraudulently obtain a New Zealand passport. Minutes after the sentencing Helen Clark suspended diplomatic relations with Israel and said she was still waiting for an official apology. Now she has compared the New Zealand fraud to a previous case in Canada involving an assassination attempt. "I can't comment on what they might have done but I can point to the precedent when the Canadian passport system was penetrated and agents involved in an assassination attempt in another country were using those false passports," says Clark. She says it is "entirely a possibility" that the same scenario could be applied to the New Zealand case. Israel is now trying to repair the damage of New Zealand's move to cut diplomatic ties. Israeli Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom says the two countries have a very long history of good relations. "We will do everything we can in order to improve our relations and bring them back to the same stage that they were before," says Shalom. But former diplomat Terrence O'Brien says the New Zealand-Israel relationship was already thin, with low levels of trade and no embassy in either country. Meanwhile, lawyers acting for the two Israelis are considering appeals, despite both men pleading guilty. They claim their clients were denied a fair trial because the government leaked information about their connections with the spy agency, Mossad. Clark denies this and says when the lawyers tried to run that argument at an earlier stage of the judicial proceedings "they got nowhere".

	16-07-2004 15:19									#53
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 Thats all news to me. However, you should know that overflights above a certain altitude was accepted. In the 50's and 60's we regularly overflew the USSR and Cuba with U2s. Nobody bombarded the UN or the International Court with complaints. When we produced pictures of Soviet missles in Cuba in 1961 nobody complained that they were done illegally.

Not...exactly.

They just shot one down.

	16-07-2004 18:51									#54
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Israel has managed to put another country in the anti-Israel camp with this. We don't pull this kind of **** with anyone, why should we tolerate your murderous crap?

I don't know if you know, but one of them was trying to pass himself off as a New Zealander, but the New Zealander in question has cerebral palsy and is extremely disabled.

Just like the Israelis to take advantage of disabled people.

BTW - did anyone see the NZ Prime Minister on the news? She looks like the Bride of Frankenstein.

	16-07-2004 19:10									#55
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This just shows how stupid Mossad is. It's the same as the French Intelligence service in the Rainbow Warrior case.

The two agents in that case were caught because they thought no-one in NZ could speak French and would talk loudly about their operation in cafes. Even worse, they would drive out into state forests to hold secret meetings, thinking that no-one would notice. The NZ authorities managed to track their movements everywhere because local trappers, hunters and loggers always take note of who's out in the bush.

Dumbasses.

	16-07-2004 19:10									#56
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quote: Just like the Israelis to take advantage of disabled people.

	16-07-2004 19:18									#57
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon Execute the scum.

	16-07-2004 19:29									#58
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quote: Originally posted by Azazel quote: Just like the Israelis to take advantage of disabled people.

Have you no shame boy?

They've taken advantage of Canadians in the past, so it's a reasonable comment.

	16-07-2004 19:30									#59
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Looking at the picture of them on the BBC's page, don't they look like a pair of comedy Villains from a james bond film?

As for the what did they want the dodgy passports for, it couldn't be killings it was only espionage? WTF It wasn't avoiding parking tickets.

International espionage agencies have not been all that successfull recently (or if they have it's secret and we don't know about it) The CIA, Mossad, MI6 have all got themselves into serious bother recently, and have a good record on supplying rubbish information. There would be a good case that these organisations are a waste of money.

	16-07-2004 19:39									#60
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quote: They've taken advantage of Canadians in the past, so it's a reasonable comment.

I am sure Canadians will appreciate that comment.

quote: The two agents in that case were caught because they thought no-one in NZ could speak French and would talk loudly about their operation in cafes. Even worse, they would drive out into state forests to hold secret meetings, thinking that no-one would notice. The NZ authorities managed to track their movements everywhere because local trappers, hunters and loggers always take note of who's out in the bush.

"Who cares about those stupid ignorant Anglophones?"


....

Seriously, though, I am not sure that these are Mossad agents. Israel usually does all it can to release Mossad agents, if captured.