13-10-2004 00:27									#121
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Oh, and I didn't even go into the magnitude of the lies, and there are more Kerry "lies" that are truth strechings or roughly true statements that I still counted as a lie. I admit I didn't count it up compared to Bush, but there seemed to be a lot more "white lies" from Kerry than from Bush.

Of course, both sides have a number of blatant lies.

-Drachasor

	13-10-2004 00:28									#122
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Badnarik

I forgot -- pragmaticism and praticality are not your strong points when it comes to voting.

	13-10-2004 00:38									#123
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Actually my rationale is quite simple. Georgia is a foregone conclusion for Bush. My vote is simply a vote to endorse by and large the Lib platform agenda items in the vain hope that some may be incorporated into major party platforms going forward.

IMO practical and pragmatic.

	13-10-2004 00:40									#124
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quote: Originally posted by Drachasor Total Net: 18 So While the number of articles doesn't seem that out of kilter (10 vs 8), many more lies are coming from the Bush camp. -Drachasor

I trust your results. Feel free to keep us posted.

	13-10-2004 00:55									#125
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Actually my rationale is quite simple. Georgia is a foregone conclusion for Bush. My vote is simply a vote to endorse by and large the Lib platform agenda items in the vain hope that some may be incorporated into major party platforms going forward. IMO practical and pragmatic.

note, key operative words "vain hope"

	13-10-2004 01:05									#126
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Hey what can I say. I'm a conservative and by default that means an optimist.

	13-10-2004 01:19									#127
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Hey what can I say. I'm a conservative and by default that means an optimist.

Actually, that makes you be default a pessimist: liberals believe Man can change his own fate and through ideas recreate society for the better.

Conservatives don't believe man has this ability- at best they think man, through a set of rules an values slowly evolving through centuries can make things better without collapsing. Its corservatives who believe in Original Sin. Not LIberals.

	13-10-2004 01:32									#128
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quote: Originally posted by GePap Conservatives don't believe man has this ability- at best they think man, through a set of rules an values slowly evolving through centuries can make things better without collapsing. Its corservatives who believe in Original Sin.

Exactly the reason to be optimistic rather than advocating the pessimism required of liberals to encourage revolution, and teh ensuing death and destruction as has been so often the case in human history.

	13-10-2004 01:45									#129
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Exactly the reason to be optimistic rather than advocating the pessimism required of liberals to encourage revolution, and teh ensuing death and destruction as has been so often the case in human history.

You got to tear down something to build something up- you would not be alive unless lots of other things died in order for you to ingest them. We had to blow away a mountain to make Mt. Rushmore, so forth and so on.

	13-10-2004 01:47									#130
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Kinna like tearing down Sadaam's reign ehhh?

	13-10-2004 01:57									#131
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Hey what can I say. I'm a conservative and by default that means an optimist.

I'm a liberal and I'm also an optimist.

I'm a liberal and I do not advocate for radical revolution.





Did you know that whenever you assume something about others, you make an *ss out of yourself?

	13-10-2004 01:59									#132
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Kinna like tearing down Sadaam's reign ehhh?

Yes, kinna. Of course, what matters is what you build on it. If you tear down a burned down husk to replace it with a burning pile of garbage, that is no improvement

	13-10-2004 01:59									#133
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Fun,



Tell it to GePap who made the generalizations about libs and conservatives. I only spoke for myself (and perhaps if you stretch it fellow conservatives).

	13-10-2004 02:00									#134
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Tell it to GePap who made the generalizations about libs and conservatives. I only spoke for myself. :

But you agreed with me, so you are stuck now, pessimism boy

	13-10-2004 02:02									#135
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Where, ohh raincloud of optimism?

	13-10-2004 02:03									#136
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Fun, Tell it to GePap who made the generalizations about libs and conservatives. I only spoke for myself (and perhaps if you stretch it fellow conservatives).

Yeah, maybe the same can be said with GePap, but maybe he was just trolling.



Anyway, by EMPHASIZING that because you're conservative that thus, you are optimistic, you were insinuating/implying that optimism is antithetical to liberalism.


And thus, you are PWND!!

	13-10-2004 02:07									#137
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun Anyway, by EMPHASIZING that because you're conservative that thus, you are optimistic, you were insinuating/implying that optimism is antithetical to liberalism.

I think you are assuming and you know what YOU say about assuming

quote: Did you know that whenever you assume something about others, you make an *ss out of yourself?

Here's the opening you should have gone for as more appropriately substantiates a claim by me of liberals being pessimistic "Exactly the reason to be optimistic rather than advocating the pessimism required of liberals to encourage revolution, and teh ensuing death and destruction as has been so often the case in human history." and thus pwnage.

	13-10-2004 02:09									#138
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Seriously this has been fun and all guys. But gotta run. Toodles.

	13-10-2004 02:11									#139
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe I think you are assuming and you know what YOU say about assuming

There is a difference between reading someone's statement, and then making a mistake, from that of assuming something without even attempting to understand what one said.

	13-10-2004 02:16									#140
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Dans'd

	13-10-2004 02:19									#141
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Where, ohh raincloud of optimism?

quote: Exactly the reason to be optimistic rather than advocating the pessimism required of liberals to encourage revolution, and teh ensuing death and destruction as has been so often the case in human history.

You agreed on the premise that all liberals or conservatives in the end believe X.

Sorry to PWNZ you

	13-10-2004 02:19									#142
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Beat you to it. And with that I really do have to leave.

	13-10-2004 02:23									#143
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OK, so good by PWNZ!

	13-10-2004 02:51									#144
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it's been fun today, GePap and Ogie

	13-10-2004 03:39									#145
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quote: Originally posted by GePap You agreed on the premise that all liberals or conservatives in the end believe X. Sorry to PWNZ you

IN reality both my comments and beleifs go counter to your assumptions. Whilst your assertions about beleifs may hold weight/merit your conclusion that that makes them either respectively pessimistic or optomistic is flawed.

For example, I'm am fully optomisitc in the belief that an individual has the wherewithal to help themselves and will do so because it is in their own selfish nature to do so.

	13-10-2004 03:41									#146
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First, you sir are a liar! (You said you were leaving )

Second:

The issue is not self help-the issue is about society as a whole and the ability to change society, not just one individual.

	13-10-2004 03:42									#147
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He lies AND he assumes.



Talk about evil.

	13-10-2004 03:44									#148
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quote: Originally posted by GePap First, you sir are a liar! (You said you were leaving ) Second: The issue is not self help-the issue is about society as a whole and the ability to change society, not just one individual.

Ahh but conservative by and large are happy and see no compelling reason for change at least in a drastic sense.

And I'm back just to vex you.

	13-10-2004 04:06									#149
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quote: Originally posted by Ogie Oglethorpe Ahh but conservative by and large are happy and see no compelling reason for change at least in a drastic sense.

You mean conservatives adhere to the fallacy that because we have always done something a certain way, we should always continue to do so.

	13-10-2004 04:30									#150
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Both sides are "optimistic" about different things.

That's why (imho) Libertarians and Communists are both idealists and inherently unrealistic. They both think too mcuh of certain aspects of human nature.

-Drachasor