22-10-2004 17:32									#31
	Inflate your Upload Space

LoL yeah obviously they're not very talented. They need that much practice to pwn

	22-10-2004 17:59									#32
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Uh, actually most people become very skilled at something because of practice, talent does help, but given someone who does not practice with medium talent, so someone who does not practice with good talent, and the practicer will win 90% of the time.

	22-10-2004 20:29									#33
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I seriously doubt I would be that good if I practiced FPS games alot. But I don't know. I never had the desire to do the same thing over and over like that.

The fact is. I suck at FPS . I did get like 10 kills once on Battlefield Vietnam. I kind of like that game. Better than Doom3. I'm so stupid to buy that game. I never bought battlefield:vietnam though. I only played it on my brother's computer. I don't have it on mine. I still always get more deaths than I get kills though. Sometimes I can get in the middle of the pack on score, but never above that.

	22-10-2004 20:44									#34
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Spaced Cowboy Uh, actually most people become very skilled at something because of practice, talent does help, but given someone who does not practice with medium talent, so someone who does not practice with good talent, and the practicer will win 90% of the time.

Quite.

People have said 5 hours per day is sad. In competitive FPS games where you have to be very very good to stand out at the top level playing 75+ hours a week is not uncommon.

	23-10-2004 04:33									#35
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Once you put in enough hours in one FPS game it carries over to the next. It's like riding a bike once you learn the basics you don't forget.

	23-10-2004 10:07									#36
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quote: People have said 5 hours per day is sad. In competitive FPS games where you have to be very very good to stand out at the top level playing 75+ hours a week is not uncommon.

Why would you want to stand out as that good at playing a game? I can understand practicing a little bit to become better than your friends, but why take it beyond that?

That has to be the most tedious thing in the world anyway, playing CS for more than 10 minutes a day, they must have no brain left.

	23-10-2004 14:13									#37
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

I've never played that much myself, but I've played enough to understand the mindset of those that do.

For a start you need to understand there is a small if burgeoning pro-gamer circuit; many of those people I referred to play such games for a living. In fact 75 hours is quite extreme, the only people I know who play/have played that much are pro-gamers.

You also need to understand the ultra-competitive mindset that drives people to improve at their chosen game. And once you reach a certain point you have to chose between being a decent competitive player or striving further to be the best (I chose the former twice, but I empathise with those who chose the latter). This goal ultimately means a large investment of time to realise.

I think attitudes towards dedication to a game as an e-sport are shifting. In europe strides have already been made, and America is starting to look like more tourneys will come there in the following years.

I always wonder if people would be quite so amazed at someone playing 8+ hours per day of a more well-established game, with a hope of one day being amonst the best in the world. Food for thought.

	23-10-2004 14:39									#38
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

quote: Originally posted by DrSpike I've never played that much myself, but I've played enough to understand the mindset of those that do. For a start you need to understand there is a small if burgeoning pro-gamer circuit; many of those people I referred to play such games for a living. In fact 75 hours is quite extreme, the only people I know who play/have played that much are pro-gamers. You also need to understand the ultra-competitive mindset that drives people to improve at their chosen game. And once you reach a certain point you have to chose between being a decent competitive player or striving further to be the best (I chose the former twice, but I empathise with those who chose the latter). This goal ultimately means a large investment of time to realise. I think attitudes towards dedication to a game as an e-sport are shifting. In europe strides have already been made, and America is starting to look like more tourneys will come there in the following years. I always wonder if people would be quite so amazed at someone playing 8+ hours per day of a more well-established game, with a hope of one day being amonst the best in the world. Food for thought.

Well i'm sure as more compititions get run, and more money is available to win, then we will get more pro-gamers.
Still i would hope that it doesn't lead to guys droping out of school to persue the dream of being a pro-gamer, the 'sport' isnt well established enough yet to make that worthwhile i would say.
But in the next 10-20 years who knows?

	23-10-2004 22:26									#39
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Korea seems to already be there, especially with Starcraft and other TBS games

	23-10-2004 23:05									#40
	Get a bigger avatar today!

I'd like to play games with Swedish girls.

	23-10-2004 23:13									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Smiley Korea seems to already be there, especially with Starcraft and other TBS games

Think you meant RTS, but yes, Korea is progamer heaven.

	24-10-2004 12:56									#42
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by DrSpike I always wonder if people would be quite so amazed at someone playing 8+ hours per day of a more well-established game, with a hope of one day being amonst the best in the world. Food for thought.

Like Doom?

	24-10-2004 13:46									#43
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Clearly I meant a more well-established game outside of computer gaming.

	24-10-2004 14:15									#44
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I suppose I should have stuck several smilies at the end of the sentence to denote humour.

	24-10-2004 14:46									#45
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Or you could have made it funny, so we knew it was humour.

	24-10-2004 14:49									#46
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I never knew you were a closet Amercian.

	24-10-2004 16:00									#47
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Don't worry Skanky, he's just so used to my jokes.

Wait....that came out wrong.

	25-10-2004 02:07									#48
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Professional gaming and money prizes aside...

When I started playing Civ2 I just got hooked. I'd play a lot more than 5 hours a day, but only because I loved the game. It was pure, scary addiction...

Why can't the same thing happen to other people playing other games? Especially if they're tailormade for interhuman competition, the real challenge in gaming?

I don't find it surprising that people spend all that time playing computer games.

Carolus

	25-10-2004 02:13									#49
	Increase Your PM Length

I don't think ANY of us find it anything other than 100% normal.

-Jam

	25-10-2004 02:34									#50
	Increase Your PM Length

Until I was about 10 I didn't really understand why people bothered having friends, which is about the same time I met people who actually liked playing board and card games. Go figure.

	25-10-2004 02:35									#51
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Heh, heh!

Edited: A post slipped in between this one and Jamski's.

Carolus

	25-10-2004 02:36									#52
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

You cheering Jamski or my pseudo-autistic behaviour?

	25-10-2004 02:39									#53
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Heh, heh!

I edited while you posted... Seems that I'm completely out of synch with Apolyton tonight... I'll better get home and get some sleep!

Good night!

Carolus

	25-10-2004 03:18									#54
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote: Originally posted by Carolus Rex Professional gaming and money prizes aside... When I started playing Civ2 I just got hooked. I'd play a lot more than 5 hours a day, but only because I loved the game. It was pure, scary addiction... Why can't the same thing happen to other people playing other games? Especially if they're tailormade for interhuman competition, the real challenge in gaming? I don't find it surprising that people spend all that time playing computer games. Carolus

Indeed.

	25-10-2004 04:39									#55
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Pro-gaming for money is just silly imo. It's not like football or other big sports where it's actually an entertainment for many. Progamers always meet eachother on LANs only to win a few prizes there that are always given to the same group of people. Occasionally there are a few demos that are put on the internet but other than that other people don't really enjoy it. Games are fun when they're played. You might get a few better strats and some fun watching a few games but it won't be something you'd do on a regular basis, except for some true addicts of course.
The Pro-gaming circuit has no real purpose except for those few who participate in it. But of course, if those sponsors want to waste their money on it, and those players want to play all day that's okay for me, but if you're a pro-gamer then imo you're not 'good'. You're just a nutter that plays the game all day.
In my eyes a good player is someone who plays the game for a normal amount of time and kicks ass at it. I know people that are better than others who have played far more than those ass-kickers. Now that's a 'good' gamer

	25-10-2004 11:54									#56
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Yeah, all those sponsors are stupid to sponsor people in a game no one watches or cares about. Dumbasses.

	26-10-2004 00:43									#57
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

yeah idd. The whole point of sponsoring is advertising, but that just don't happen with progamers.. I play a lot of FPS, got to LANs occasionally but I've never heard of a sponsor of one of those progamers

	26-10-2004 01:15									#58
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Sorry, you are flat out wrong.

	26-10-2004 07:47									#59
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quote: Originally posted by DrSpike I think attitudes towards dedication to a game as an e-sport are shifting. In europe strides have already been made, and America is starting to look like more tourneys will come there in the following years.

It's like disc golf. Disc golf has been around for a long while, IIRC first disc golf course was set up in 1930s. But don't hold me to it - the point it has been around for a while but I never heard of it until late 1990s.

I've noticed competitive e-gamings years ago but it's not as mainstreamed as other sports although that's slowly changing.

Doesn't anybody remember that mid-1980s movie about this kid who travels and play in Nintendo tournaments?

	26-10-2004 07:58									#60
	Remove this text

The Wizard?

It sucked

But it had SMB3