16-05-2005 18:34									#61
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quote: Originally posted by Sikander Check out the Amber series next. It's fascinating and maddeningly uneven in quality. The first two books are fantastic (there are 10 total iirc) and after that they vary a lot in quality.

Like Moorcock, its stuff I havent in a long time. I remember them as being quite good though.

	16-05-2005 18:39									#62
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quote: Originally posted by Mordoch One fantasy series I'd recommend is L.E. Modesitt's Recluce series. The best point to start off with is probably the "The Magic of Recluce. " While its not chronological, its probably the easiest point to start from, and it was the first of the books written.

Just finished this series myself. A fine read that I recommend. Even though the heros and themes are similar throughout there is enough difference to keep it entertaining. I would also recommend reading them in the order published instead of the true cronilogical order. He weaves a good consistent universe. And with 12 or so books written, it will keep you busy for quite awhile and 10 of the are avail in paperback so it's not expensive.

The best thing about the work as a whole, is that there is no generic good and evil. It's usually a gray area that must be treated personally.

	16-05-2005 18:51									#63
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I read the first few..

maybe I will try it again (Depends ont eh time I have on hand)

Jon Miller

	16-05-2005 18:57									#64
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With the exception of one of the middle books, the later books are better than the earlier ones. Especially when he deals with the White tower and the ealier histories.

	16-05-2005 19:16									#65
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I re-read Asimovs "Foundation" trilogy and realized how mind-numbingly boring it really is. It was far better 20 years ago...

	16-05-2005 20:17									#66
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True. I struggled through the first book. Started the second, but I don't remember finishing it...I don't think I did.

	17-05-2005 01:26									#67
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The Hyperion books after the first are more traditional narratives, and easier to read than the first. Also, Ilium (and certainly its upcoming sequel, Olympos) are very similar to Hyperion but with more interesting source material (the Odyssey instead of Keats' Hyperion).

And definitely check out A Deepness in the Sky if you haven't read it. I like it more than A Fire Upon the Deep. I named my computer after one of the characters.

SP

	17-05-2005 01:42									#68
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the first is the best of the Hyperion books though

I would also like to say that Vinge is great..

M

	17-05-2005 01:45									#69
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Julian May
Pliocene Saga
Great characters...

	17-05-2005 01:46									#70
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quote: Originally posted by Jaguar This is clearly an impostor.

Now you know how I felt when Oncle Boris showed up.

	17-05-2005 01:48									#71
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quote: Originally posted by Lancer Red Mars, Green Mars, Blue Mars...

I'm rereading those now, in fact.

	17-05-2005 02:00									#72
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I read some classics recently: "Dracula", "Frankenstein", "The Strange case of doctor Jekyll and mister Hyde". They're all excellent and, best of all, dirt cheap. Btw, Frankenstein is very different from the movie version, at least the one that I remember.

	17-05-2005 04:44									#73
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--"I dislike short stories most of the time."

As mentioned elsewhere, they did novels as well.

--"Fritz Leiber: These might be ok, though again I can't see what sets them apart from most fantasy."

He did a fair bit towards setting some of the tropes, along with Howard's Conan. Leiber captured this wonderful, dark yet humorous tone that made his two heroes stand out. At the least, read "The Bazaar of the Bizzare" for a sample.

--"THE DEED OF PAKSENARRION:"

That was pretty decent. Unfortunately, she uses essentially the same theme in the next two fantasy series she wrote, which are set in the same universe. Made me think she was trying to become the female David Eddings.

--"i was reading the posts and was surprised no one had mentioned HEINLEIN yet."

Don't know how I missed that one.

--"the first 3 books of George R. Martin's Wild Cards series are wonderful."

Quick warning, but Wild Cards is a shared-world series. The stories vary widely in quality. There are some really good ones, and interesting characters (like Sleeper and Yeoman), so it's definitely worth trying. Just don't expect it to be uniformly brilliant.
In the same vein, you might want to check out the Thieves' World, a fantasy shared-world series edited by Robert Lynn Asprin.

--"Michael Moorcock was one of the first fantasy writers whose work I couldnt get enough of when I started reading the genre."

I was going to mention his Elric series today, but I guess you saved me the bother ^_^

--"Btw, Frankenstein is very different from the movie version, at least the one that I remember."

This is very often the case ^_^

Wraith
You can't judge a book by its movie.

	17-05-2005 06:22									#74
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My picks would be:

Zelazny (especially the first five, but once you're hooked, the second five are tolerable too!)

Clark's Rama series (if you play or played SMAC you will recognize a LOT of the material here)

Alan Dean Foster's "The D@mned" series...good stuff, and a bit of a different treatment of the humans...

-=Vel=-

	17-05-2005 06:25									#75
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Does Damned make it past the censors?
edit: yes it does.

	17-05-2005 06:35									#76
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quote: Originally posted by Fve Crathva The Hyperion books after the first are more traditional narratives, and easier to read than the first. Also, Ilium (and certainly its upcoming sequel, Olympos) are very similar to Hyperion but with more interesting source material (the Odyssey instead of Keats' Hyperion). And definitely check out A Deepness in the Sky if you haven't read it. I like it more than A Fire Upon the Deep. I named my computer after one of the characters. SP

Olympos is scheduled for release on June 28th. My copy is already on pre-order.

However, I disagree with your implication that Ilium/Olympos are better books - in fact, they're more of the same and are the lesser for it.

I agree with you on the Vinge... why the denounement alone makes DitS a better book than FutD.

However, if you're interested in space opera, you should RUN, not walk to your local bookstore and pick up a copy of Peter F. Hamilton's Pandora's Star. Possibly the finest example of the genre released in the past 10 years. One can only hope he gets past his deus ex machina problems...

	17-05-2005 06:40									#77
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Second Pandora's Star

Whens the sequel coming out?

	17-05-2005 06:43									#78
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For us poor bastards living in the US... January 2006.

It's enough to make me purchase it on amazon.uk, damn the shipping charges, full speed ahead!

	17-05-2005 06:56									#79
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quote: Originally posted by JohnT Olympos is scheduled for release on June 28th. My copy is already on pre-order. However, I disagree with your implication that Ilium/Olympos are better books - in fact, they're more of the same and are the lesser for it. I agree with you on the Vinge... why the denounement alone makes DitS a better book than FutD. However, if you're interested in space opera, you should RUN, not walk to your local bookstore and pick up a copy of Peter F. Hamilton's Pandora's Star. Possibly the finest example of the genre released in the past 10 years. One can only hope he gets past his deus ex machina problems...

I didn't like one of Hamilton's other series..

it seemed boring

Jon Miller

	17-05-2005 07:57									#80
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quote: Originally posted by Velociryx Alan Dean Foster's "The D@mned" series...good stuff, and a bit of a different treatment of the humans... -=Vel=-

Actually upon reflection, unless you want to go into more the lighter space opera style Flinx novels, the D@mmed series is probably the best Alan Dean Foster novel series to get into. Definately a series I would suggest.

	17-05-2005 07:59									#81
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You know Jon, in a thread asking for recommendations you have criticized the selection of no less than 7 separate posters, all of them gracious enough to not return the favor.

Except me.

Can you just fuc*ing stop it? Or is rudeness just part and parcel of the Jon Miller package?

	17-05-2005 08:03									#82
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quote: quote: Originally posted by Lonestar I would recommend David Weber's "Honor Harrington" series, starting with On Basilisk Station. Think of it as Horatio Hornblower in space. some are ok, they get worse as he goes on... JM

quote: quote: Originally posted by Qilue Piers Anthony. Here's a list so I can save typing. http://www.hipiers.com/bibliography.html ack, horrid horrid stuff, most isn't even entertaining.. JM ( a few are entertaining in a mildly juvenile way)

quote: quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov What about raymond feist? Anyone read? My boss' husband raves about him. has some good stuff (for standard fantasy fun), I haven't liked hie most recent stuff however... JM

quote: ID din't say that I thought the Gripping Hand was very good... JM (not a Niven fan)

quote: for Cherryh tha cat people books (despite being veryt popular) aren't her best Jon miller (although they are better than you would think, she doesn't write anything that is just 'Meh', everything is good or great or amazing)

(The above is just from the first page!)

	17-05-2005 08:05									#83
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it's about recommendations

and beyond that has, I think, gotten to the point of discussing our particular likes and dislikes

I am not saying anything about you as a person (or anyone else as a person.. )

for me recommendations include what someone likes and dislikes.. if you like similiar books to me (and dislike similiar books to me) than other books I like (or dislike) is rellevant information for you

if you don't share similiar tastes,t han that is useful information also

Jon Miller

	17-05-2005 08:06									#84
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Yes, but nobody else is criticizing others recommendations. Repeatedly.

	17-05-2005 08:09									#85
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hmm

lets see

I liked The Gripping Hand (and said so), I was just clarifying that while I liked it, it wasn't very good

I said, in that post, that I liked (and recommended) earlier Feist stuff (which is what Boris was asking about) but not later.. (this is part of the whole having an oppinion thing)

I was saying that some of the honor books were ok (ie, I liked them)

I stand by my Peirs Anthony statement

and if you didn't see, I recommended/recommend Cherryh whole heartedly (she is my favorite living writer)

I recommend all her books, including her cat people ones (and in fact own most of hers, since I reread them often)

I was mostly just stating my opinion that the cat people ones aren't her best (those would be the Morgaine ones, or some of the Alliance/Union ones or some of the independent ones)

Jon Miller

	17-05-2005 10:06									#86
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quote: Originally posted by JohnT Olympos is scheduled for release on June 28th. My copy is already on pre-order. However, I disagree with your implication that Ilium/Olympos are better books - in fact, they're more of the same and are the lesser for it.

I didn't mean to imply that Ilium was better. You're right that it suffered from Simmons stealing from himself (although I'm not sure how they'd compare if one read Ilium first). I just enjoyed Ilium more, because I'm more interested in the Odyssey and the related mythology than in Hyperion-the-poem. Martin Silenus and the other poet got on my nerves.

SP

	17-05-2005 11:35									#87
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Night's Dawn Trilogy: Couldn't find out much about it, but his other book Pandora's Star sounds interesting.

Asimov: Read most of his stuff, but I skipped the robot short stories.

Ken MacLeod: The books have bad reviews, but sound interesting, I'll keep them in mind.

Robin Hobb: I only read one book by her, but I thought it was very good, so i will probably keep looking for more.

Daughter of the Empire: I read the first book and liked it, and I now have the second book, but every time I try to start it I don't remember enough of what was happening in the first book

David Brin: When I said Uplift War I meant the entire series. I also read Earth and Kiln People and liked them.

Vernor Vinge: Yes, I read the prequel too. I'm still looking for a copy of his book The Peace War

Jack Vance: Most of his stuff seems to be short stories, but I will check out his other books.

Theodore Sturgeon: Also mostly short stories.

Mervyn Peake: Sounds interesting, might try it.

Dragon's Egg: Looks very good.

Barbara Hambley: Quite mixed reviews, what sets it apart from most fantasy?

Michael Moorcock: Dosn't look particularly interesting.

Pliocene Saga: Time travel and a tolkienesque world? You're going to have to sell me on this one...

Rama: Might try this. (love SMAC)

Alan Dean Foster: The damned series looks interesting.

Personally, I don't mind a little negative feedback, I've got enough to sort through that being able to put those with mixed reviews lower on the list is nice.

	17-05-2005 13:30									#88
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quote: Originally posted by quantum_mechani Fritz Leiber: These might be ok, though again I can't see what sets them apart from most fantasy.

Did you read any of the Fafhrd and the Grey Mouser series? Good fantasy with a terrific sense of humor written over about 40 years iirc. The characters are great, the world is both weird and very familiar and the books are quite light reading. The earlier "novels" are mostly assembled from pulp magazine short stories, which assures their quality while in this case it detracts almost nothing from the structure of the series in general as the stories are typically timeless like the heroes and the gods they describe. This is one of my favorite series without a doubt.

	17-05-2005 13:38									#89
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quote: Originally posted by DeathByTheSword jenny governments - unkown 4x

I think that's Jenifer Government. It is written by Max Barry and the game NationStates is very loosely based on it. Hm, actually there isn't any connection whatsoever.

	17-05-2005 13:42									#90
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quote: Originally posted by boann thank you... i was reading the posts and was surprised no one had mentioned HEINLEIN yet. you should read Methuselah's Children first before reading time enough for love.. ... its the short story that sets up the beginning of Lazarus Long's epic Methuselah's Children Time Enough For Love The Cat Who Walks Through Walls To Sail Beyond The Sunset The Notebooks of Lazarus Long Stranger In A Strange Land Farnham's Freehold those are some of my favorites of his i just finished reading the Symphony of Ages series by elizabeth haydon its more fantasy than science fiction though.

I teeter somewhere between admiration, terror and rude laughter when I read Heinlein. Some of his stuff is great adventure, some of it is interesting, and when he has enough rope to hang himself (almost everything he wrote late in life) he does so with enthusiasm. His most disturbing book for me is Farnham's Freehold in which his traitorous son is neutered by aliens, his wife is ungrateful and also turns against him and the other reasonable folks to her great regret and to his indifference. His daughter wants to marry him and while it's obvious that he is totally into the idea he can't allow it because of the potential for birth defects, so instead he gives her to his loyal employee and satisfies himself with her hot roomate from college. How exactly this jackoff plot managed to achieve novel length remains one of the world's enduring mysteries.

Speaking of which, how about Pillip Jose Farmer? Some of his stuff I liked quite a bit. Then I ran into some erotic SF he wrote when he was of advanced age. All I can say is wow! Keep me away from any typewriters after I pass 60 please, for the good of everyone.