12-06-2005 01:08									#31
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Actually, Lula wants us (as well as the Euros and the Japanese) to come to our senses and drop our agrisubsidies.

And quit rationalizing your stealing, you thief!

	12-06-2005 03:21									#32
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo Actually, Lula wants us (as well as the Euros and the Japanese) to come to our senses and drop our agrisubsidies.

He's been doing that cocaine from Columbia, right?

	12-06-2005 05:28									#33
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EU's reducing spending on the CAP, both as a percentage of the EU budget and in absolute figures, it's slowly going down. Hopefully the current talks on the EU budget will reduce it further. Meanwhile, the WTO have ruled against the US cotton subsidies, not the CAP or US farm subsidies. When they do, we may find countries retaliating.

	12-06-2005 07:00									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo Actually, Lula wants us (as well as the Euros and the Japanese) to come to our senses and drop our agrisubsidies.

I'v e been saying we should do that for years! Lula seems to be attacking the US on the copy right issue because it won't unilaterally give up subsidies. The US has repeatedly said that it would like to end subsidies but only if the EU and the Japanese do so as well. Japan has said that a deal might be worked out but Chirac has catagorically said he'd fight any move to cut or end farm subsidies.

	12-06-2005 07:01									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue EU's reducing spending on the CAP, both as a percentage of the EU budget and in absolute figures, it's slowly going down. Hopefully the current talks on the EU budget will reduce it further. Meanwhile, the WTO have ruled against the US cotton subsidies, not the CAP or US farm subsidies. When they do, we may find countries retaliating.

There is no difference between cotton subsidies or subsidies to any other crop. The only difference is that someone actually pushed through a case on cotton while the other cases are still pending.

	12-06-2005 09:03									#36
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quote: There is no difference between cotton subsidies or subsidies to any other crop.

Yes there is, the WTO ruled against the cotton subsides, therefore they are illegal.

	12-06-2005 09:09									#37
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quote: Originally posted by Bosh Yes there is, the WTO ruled against the cotton subsides, therefore they are illegal.

The WTO can go screw itself all I care.

	12-06-2005 09:29									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Odin The WTO can go screw itself all I care.

Your personal opinions are quite irrelevant to the legalities of the issue.

	12-06-2005 16:23									#39
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Moreover, other countries will try and screw you for not abiding by a WTO ruling, whereas they're less likely to when it's still legal.

If you don't like the WTO, withdraw - and see how many tariffs go up against you. The WTO started because the US and other developed countries wanted to remove tariffs across the board. You gain more than you lose from free trade.

quote: Originally posted by Oerdin There is no difference between cotton subsidies or subsidies to any other crop. The only difference is that someone actually pushed through a case on cotton while the other cases are still pending.

Yes there is. Cotton is not a necessity for to stay alive. Food is. However yes, you are broadly right. I think the CAP is evil and should be destroyed, similarly for cotton. However currently the WTO has only ruled against one of them.

	12-06-2005 17:21									#40
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quote: Originally posted by Oerdin Why? Simple Brazil's market isn't that big but the markets of rich countries which want intellectual property rights protected is very large plus they've all already signed numerous agreements to punish states which don't meet rich country standards of what adequate protections are. Lula is playing with fire and his country's economy will get burned if he isn't careful.

I am not sure about that. Some of the biggest pharmaceutical companies started when Switzerland (IIRC) didn't have any patent protections. So I reckon there are a large number of people who are very interested in jumping at this chance to make stuff without paying through their noses.