19-06-2005 00:40									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker wtf?

A Clockwork Orange.

	19-06-2005 00:45									#32
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker wtf?

Stefu quoted Anthony Burgess' Clockwork Orange.

	19-06-2005 00:45									#33
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Damn, crossposted with Ann.

	19-06-2005 13:29									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Kuciwalker This seems like a self-correcting problem.

Catching the culprits does nothing to correct the problem for the young girl - being gang raped and having her demeaning humiliation broadcast to everyone at her school and wider circles. I would guess this girl is going to have serious issues for a long time.

	19-06-2005 13:32									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov But I agree with banning mobile phones in schools, anyway. There's no reason kids need to be taking and receiving calls during school hours.

Just put up jammers on school premises, like they do in theaters.

	19-06-2005 13:34									#36
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What really disgusts me about these cases is the brazenness of the young offenders. To commit the deed is bad enough. For it to be 14 year old kids makes it shocking. To have them record their activities and boast to all and sundry distressed me.

I don't know how to confront the problem, banning phones would be ridiculous. Is it poor upbringing? Poor parenting? Lack of disicipline?

	19-06-2005 13:56									#37
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quote: Originally posted by Dauphin I don't know how to confront the problem, banning phones would be ridiculous. Is it poor upbringing? Poor parenting? Lack of disicipline?

My take is this is not a new phenomenon. Having mobile phones that can take videos just make it easier to arrest the criminals.

For example, rapes are mostly about power and very little about sex. While a rapist could only have power over the victim in private, now he can show it to mobs of people. Feel that power!

So, to show others the heinous act, he has to shoot the video, and to put himself in it.

I think that it is this mentality that will lead to their apprehension.

	19-06-2005 14:03									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Dauphin I don't know how to confront the problem, banning phones would be ridiculous. Is it poor upbringing? Poor parenting? Lack of disicipline?

These things do contribute (especially the last one). I think another factor is maybe a very poor image of women in the collective imagination. If women are simply deemed as sluts that are here only to get f*cked, it also encourages it.

However, another cause is psychological (power-hunger, as UR said), and I have no idea as to how to tackle it collectively.

	19-06-2005 15:06									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue Yes it's sick, but they're 14, and have a lot of changing and growing up to do. Hopefully (and probably) in time they'll see that what they did was wrong.

I'm sure the only thing they will think they did wrong was to get caught. How many acts of remorse have we historically seen years after the fact? I'd say almost zero. Fry them.

	19-06-2005 15:15									#40
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue Kill 14 year olds? If there's a case for possible reform, they're it. Sure, kill some adult reoffender who's deemed incurable, but kill a kid? Yes it's sick, but they're 14, and have a lot of changing and growing up to do. Hopefully (and probably) in time they'll see that what they did was wrong.

I say these kids are irreformable . If they're too dumb to understand basic morality at the age of fourteen , they'll never "get it " . Unless they're made to undergo what they made someone else suffer , that is .

	19-06-2005 15:16									#41
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quote: Originally posted by General Ludd Pervert.

I just say thay you should make them undergo the same thing they did to someone else . That should make them see the error of their ways .

	19-06-2005 15:17									#42
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quote: Originally posted by aneeshm Unless they're made to undergo what they made someone else suffer , that is .

Send them to prison.

	19-06-2005 15:22									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Strangelove Who get's to inflict the torture? You might be creating a bigger monster.

Machines get to inflict the torture ( and no , it does not involve mutilation of any sort ) , machines whose controls are on the internet , accesible to all upstanding American citizens willing to do their patriotic duty by randomly clicking on the buttons on their screens ( "Ooh , what does THIS button do ? Let's find out . . . . . . ." *sounds of button getting presed* *random disgusting sounds* "Oh , so THAT'S how you bring that over to the backside !" ) ) .

	19-06-2005 15:26									#44
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quote: Originally posted by aneeshm Machines get to inflict the torture ( and no , it does not involve mutilation of any sort ) , machines whose controls are on the internet , accesible to all upstanding American citizens willing to do their patriotic duty by randomly clicking on the buttons on their screens ( "Ooh , what does THIS button do ? Let's find out . . . . . . ." *sounds of button getting presed* *random disgusting sounds* "Oh , so THAT'S how you bring that over to the backside !" ) ) .

I like the way you think.

	19-06-2005 15:43									#45
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 I'm sure the only thing they will think they did wrong was to get caught. How many acts of remorse have we historically seen years after the fact? I'd say almost zero. Fry them.

How many times have you seen 14 year olds rape someone?

quote: Originally posted by aneeshm I say these kids are irreformable . If they're too dumb to understand basic morality at the age of fourteen , they'll never "get it " . Unless they're made to undergo what they made someone else suffer , that is .

At 14 maybe, that's why you let them grow up and see if they reform. And yes, your view that "they're irreformable" having never met them must be true! They may get it, they may not. We don't know. At 14, they haven't fully developed their moral code. The whole point is that at 14 they don't understand basic morality. That doesn't mean they never will.

	19-06-2005 17:15									#46
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THE CELL PHONE MADE THEM DO IT!!!!

	19-06-2005 17:40									#47
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It's time to usher in an era of 'chav vigilanteism'...care to join me Ted and Pekka

	19-06-2005 17:42									#48
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that's right.. I also heard from realiable source that pedophiles use mobile phones in communicating with each other, and they even exchange pictures, live, from childrens clothing stores etc.. what a sick, sick game.. we can't stop the game, but we can sure as hell stop the players having the tools to operate!

	19-06-2005 19:42									#49
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger Just put up jammers on school premises, like they do in theaters.

Nope--because the faculty should be able to have them. Cells phones come in handy for emergencies, and there shouldn't be anything stopping the teachers from using them.

	19-06-2005 20:44									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Dauphin Catching the culprits does nothing to correct the problem for the young girl - being gang raped and having her demeaning humiliation broadcast to everyone at her school and wider circles. I would guess this girl is going to have serious issues for a long time.

But there end up being fewer such culprits to perpetrate similar crimes.

	19-06-2005 21:10									#51
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I wonder how often this sort of thing happens here in the states.

	19-06-2005 21:26									#52
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quote: Originally posted by aneeshm I say these kids are irreformable . If they're too dumb to understand basic morality at the age of fourteen , they'll never "get it " . Unless they're made to undergo what they made someone else suffer , that is .

In most cases this might be true, but I knew someone who at that age was too wild. Most people who knew him imagined him spending most of his life in prison, but the last thing I've heard about him (been many years since I last saw him) was that he was almost the opposite of what he used to be

	19-06-2005 21:43									#53
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People often act differently when in a group.

Years ago a woman jogger in Central Park was raped and sodomised by a group of teenagers, whom, according to their parents and friends, were nice kids individually.

So maybe group dynamics has a lot to do with these attacks.

	19-06-2005 21:50									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger People often act differently when in a group. Years ago a woman jogger in Central Park was raped and sodomised by a group of teenagers, whom, according to their parents and friends, were nice kids individually. So maybe group dynamics has a lot to do with these attacks.

Your example doesn't prove your point at all. I can think of several other causes than group thought. Therefore, your conclusion that group dynamics has a lot to do with these attacks is unfounded. Let alone your assumption of the degree of difference between group thought and individual thought.

	19-06-2005 22:37									#55
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Send those 14 year old boys to prison, let Bubba and his buds reform their asses.

Also, confiscate enough wealth from the boys parents to enable the 11 year old girl and her family to relocate and get her a shrink.

	20-06-2005 07:04									#56
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quote: Originally posted by DaShi Your example doesn't prove your point at all. I can think of several other causes than group thought.

Go ahead and list them then.

	20-06-2005 07:40									#57
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue How many times have you seen 14 year olds rape someone?

I don't recall ( ). The point being is that we typically see remorse after the fact. How many 14 year olds do you know that were sorry about committing a felony before they were caught?

	20-06-2005 08:36									#58
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quote: Originally posted by aneeshm I just say thay you should make them undergo the same thing they did to someone else . That should make them see the error of their ways .

Yeah, sure. You just want to get your jollies off torturing someone.