21-01-2001 12:33									#31
	Inflate your Upload Space

What no email or PBEM? I wish I never would have bought this game. I don't have time to sit around and play people in real time. I have to use email. I don't have a network. I have to use hotseat. I can't stand playing a against a stupid computer. Those of you that want a better AI, well that is impossible as there is no such thing as AI. A computer is just a machine that follows code. THAT IS IT! I love CTP1 except for some of the bugs and combat system, but nothing I can't live with. I hate CTP2. It should not have been named CTP2 because it is not the same game - similiar - but not the same. Too many changes. Damn, I wish all of the new stuff that is in CTP2 was in CTP1. Life sure does suck.

	21-01-2001 12:37									#32
	Increase the size of your Attachments

I want my my freaking money back. Store won't take back unopened software. ******.

	21-01-2001 13:16									#33
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Well one and all...You've heard the verdict.

And what are you going to do about it?

I suggest we all abandon this "popcicle stand" of a game called CTP2 and one and all move on over to the Apolyton CIVIII site!!!

Mark my word that Firaxis/Hasbro has followed and has taken note of what has happened to us by Activison...I don't believe Firaxis/Hasbro (Sid Meier) will treat us as "used toilet paper"

CHARGE!!!!

	21-01-2001 14:02									#34
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I can't believe I wasted my money on CTP 1.5! Not only do these people have the gall to release an incomplete, bugged piece of shit as a final product, they don't even bother trying to fix it!

	21-01-2001 20:05									#35
	Full PM-box? Change here!

I just looked at my shelf of games, and was happy to see only one game from Activision on it... CtPII.

It will now stay that way.

If you are going to contact the company, snail mail is the best way to do it. Don't flame, just state how disappointed you are that the company has failed to provide a functioning game. And let them know that you will never buy another game from them. Also throw in that you will let your friends know how Activision has withdrawn support for a game that is still on the shelves in stores, and they should think twice before ever buying a game from them.

From looking at the above response Activision, it is pretty obvious that nothing will change the situation. All we can do right now is hope that the company has problems in the future selling new games.
And that other game companies can point to this decision as the reason why. Maybe somebody else will learn from Activision's mistake.

It is a sad day when a company knows they produced and sold a defective product, and will not even attempt to fix the situation.

	22-01-2001 10:33									#36
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I'm most happy with getting a pirated version of this game, cuz it not only mean I haven't wasted money on a game that will never be done, but it also means that Activision isn't getting this money.
How can they make a sequal to a game and remove so many good features from the original one?
Like hotseat, PBEM, scenario-support in MP?
The AI sucks, diplomacy isn't finished and the game is generally buggy.
Scenario-support is what was most important to me, as well as hotseat, since me and my girlfriend loved playing CTP hotseated, and also making custom maps. Without the ability to have custom maps in MP, I will never buy this game, wich I thought I would do if it was good enough.
I bought CTP, and I don't regret it. I pirated CTP2, and I don't regret that either.
Just my oppinion.

	22-01-2001 10:36									#37
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I am an angry. :frown:

Not because I cannot accept the fact that companies are created to make money, not because I cannot accept the fact that companies have other projects to do. These are facts of business that I do accept.

I am angry because Activision has decided to completely neglect customer relations with CTPII players from here onwards.

I own only two games from Activison: CTP and CTPII. I am also a novice modifier for CTPII, but now, I will not be buying any more games from Activision. In fact, I am considering selling CTP I and CTP II once Civiliztaion III is released.

I have played Sid Meier's Civilization gmaes since the Super NES days. I am anxious to see how well Firaxis does with Civilization III.

	21-01-2001 23:07									#38
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

The line that really pisses me off is:
"we feel that in the end, we have delivered a game that met the design goals of the project"

So their design goal was to produce and release a game that STILL has major bugs in it and do nothing to solve them.
Maybe the should have just said that our goal was to make as much money as possible and not care one damn bit about our customers. At least then, I could have respected their honesty. This response is just proof that customers come last to them. The good news is, companies that think like this go out of business... I look forward to that day! And I will try to help that day come closer by never buying anything from them again, and telling all my friends about their fine example of customer support!

	22-01-2001 00:19									#39
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I am very disappointed myself and will never buy another Activision product. This is such a slap in the face that it is hard to overlook and walk away from. In fact, this could easily be conceived as fraud.

I might add sending a few email to an Activision supplied email address is not going to do any good. You need many people bonding together and sending their coherent thoughts to the people that count, namely the Board of Directors.

I might also add, while Activision's PC games division lost money (gee I wonder why), their Console Games Division is doing good enough to pull them through so they are not even close to going out of business. They are just abandoning the PC Games Market and concentrating on Console games.

Now, where is that petition to sign.

	22-01-2001 03:57									#40
	Remove this text

On the market for less than 90 days and Activision punks out. What a shocker! NOT!!!!!

	22-01-2001 04:26									#41
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

All I can say is that I spent the weekend fighting CTP2 to create a mod that will activate AI diplomacy. But after reading this statement I'm of a mind to completely trash the program and stop.

This is just bloody typical of capitalist bullcrap. No wonder human society is rotting in its own refuse when capitalist-pig companies (and governments) run the show. No support, no care, no ****! It's because of crap like this from companies/governments world-wide that the social revolution is gaining momentum in Australia. Vive le Revolution!

------------------
Author of Diplomod. The mod to fix diplomacy.

Rommell to a sub-commander outside Tobruk: "Those Australians are in there somewhere. But where? Let's advance and wait till they shoot, then shoot back."

	22-01-2001 05:27									#42
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I think that on the box of CTP1 it said 2 million copies sold? Well multiply that by an average of $30 a shot (Conservative estimate). Does that come up to $60 million dollars? An average programmer might make $40k a year probably less at activision. That leaves millions of dollars left over. Can't the cheap capitalists spend a little of that to fix the damn game? Are there laws against companies releasing defective products? When a car company has a defect there is a recall. To heck with it, I just want my $50 dollars back.

P.S. Boycott Hasbro too! Falcon 4 was the best flight sim ever created and they killed it.

	22-01-2001 05:30									#43
	Remove this text

I agree! Revolution or the 2nd coming of Christ (too slow) is needed.

quote: Originally posted by Dale on 01-21-2001 06:26 PM All I can say is that I spent the weekend fighting CTP2 to create a mod that will activate AI diplomacy. But after reading this statement I'm of a mind to completely trash the program and stop. This is just bloody typical of capitalist bullcrap. No wonder human society is rotting in its own refuse when capitalist-pig companies (and governments) run the show. No support, no care, no ****! It's because of crap like this from companies/governments world-wide that the social revolution is gaining momentum in Australia. Vive le Revolution!

	22-01-2001 06:04									#45
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I wonder how long it will be before Consumer Protection agencies start getting heavy with companies which produce defective products like CTP II. The multiplayer side of the game was unplayable and they must have known it. I think game consumers are far too accepting of this sort of thing.


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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.

	22-01-2001 07:11									#48
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Maybe people should take this media release to their local consumer protection agency and point out the bugs. Consumers have been very tolerant of Activision till now - but now they are saying they don't care if the game is flawed. Maybe its time for consumers to flex their muscles. If Activision was selling toasters or cars they wouldn't be able to get away with selling defective products. The multiplayer side is clearly defective and unfinished. That's consumer fraud and there are heavy fines in most Western countries for that.

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Chaos, panic and disorder - My work here is done.
[This message has been edited by Alexander's Horse (edited January 21, 2001).]

	22-01-2001 07:12									#49
	Put an end to popups!

from CGO

quote: Front Office Football Central is reporting that EA Sports has no plans to issue a patch for its NFL GM sim, Front Office Football 2001. Despite claims from users that own Voodoo based video cards that the game is unplayable due to instabilty problems, the company issued a statement that the it could find no technical problems that were in need of a patch. An EA representative also stated that the company simply had no additional funds to continue to support Front Office Football 2001.

	22-01-2001 08:54									#50
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I didn't buy CTP1 but now I understand all the anger from those who did.

My first impressions of CTP2 were positive but after reading various posts I have realized:
1) CTP2 isn't really a new game but more of an extended patch of CTP1. Charging full price for it is an outrage. Although since I didn't pay for CTP1 I can't personally complain about being swindled on that front.
2) Even though CTP2 isn't very innovative it is still not a finished product. Stopping support now is another outrage.

Oh well. I suppose the whole CTP saga is a text-book case of how to swindle custormers with shoddy half-finished products. The pity is that they had some really good ideas like stacked combat and reducing micromanagement.

	22-01-2001 14:56									#52
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

To whoever wrote that message, if you make a patch for CTP i'll be your best friend, and if you guys make an expansion pack, we can be more than just friends!

	22-01-2001 15:52									#53
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Up to now, I've not considered a game's producers as an issue when deciding what to buy... this will change.

*All* software has bugs... some serious, some minor, but bugs nonetheless. It is the way companies deal with these bugs that determines the longevity of the company (despite a certain company from Redmond apparently bucking that trend).

Unfortunately, many companies (and most games developers) cannot afford to provide after-care for their products. Setting the authorities onto this sort of thing would open the flood-gates, and may result in fewer titles at higher prices... and niche products such as those in the turn-based strategy games category may disappear entirely... there is much more money to be made of shoot/beat/race-em-ups.

So we have to hope that Firaxis/Hasbro take the moral highground on this one, patch any bugs (and there *will* be bugs) and provide the degree of openness that Activision have done (up to now).

P.S. If Activision is dropping the product entirely, why not throw the source code into the public domain... I'm sure there won't be much earth-shatteringly groundbreaking in the code anyway

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Nostalgia isn't what it used to be
[This message has been edited by Gwap (edited January 22, 2001).]

	22-01-2001 18:49									#54
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I can't say I'm surprised. I can't say I'm happy about it, either, but it's my fault for giving Activision my money in the first place. The company has demonstrated lukewarm support for its products time and time again; those of you who paid for the steaming mound of crap known as Heavy Gear (1) should know what I'm talking about. That game never worked properly on my system, and the patch that would have fixed its most egregious crashing problems was never officially released.

In my cynical view, the publishers are cutting their development costs by releasing incomplete products, and then refusing to budget an adequate amount of time and money to actually finish them properly.

Thanks for nothing, Activision!

	22-01-2001 19:39									#56
	Increase the size of your Attachments

How i long for the days of the commodore 64 where games were produced for the most part by companies that cared for it's customers. WE were the cash cows to these companies and they treated US like gods. every game came with manual that explained every aspect (or the vast majority of them anyway) of the game and the games themselves weren't rushed to meet some marketing deadline (well they may have been under a deadline but it was a damn reasonable one that allowed the game to be made correctly)...sigh.

well those days are long gone now. i will NEVER buy another Activision game again. Activision needs to be humbled and disgraced before the industry. let them serve as an example to the others.

out of curiousity, anyone know a lawyer for a class action against Activison? maybe we can get our money back or at least spook that worthless company. (i wish that big grin was in fact an evil grin!)

	22-01-2001 19:44									#57
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

This was my first AND LAST experience with ACTIVISION.

And for any EXECs that may read this........

There is a profit to be made by customer service.
Companies that don't provide it disappear. And I hope Activision does too.

It's been over a year since CIVII MP was released. There were some initial problems and enough of them were resolved quite quickly. And the game was always playable. And guess what, the game is still selling. And people are waiting to pay $$$$ for CIVIII.

So live and learn or go bankrupt. You can all guess which I would prefer.

RAH
Word of mouth is a powerfull tool. Every persion you piss off tells ten more.

	22-01-2001 19:57									#58
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Sad sad sad story.

oh well at least Elite Force is quite

ATa