17-01-2001 10:23									#31
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Nasty cough you have there Omni....

The new design for your website is substantially better.

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History is written by the victor.

	17-01-2001 03:56									#33
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One suggestion I would make is to take a look at the while Gift offer. Getting a free city can be a VERY bad thing.

In SMAC you could cripple the AI by giving faction A a city of yours that is about to be overrun by faction B. Faction B is going to take that city, even if they are allied with faction A. You could keep doing this and always keep everyone fighting.

If it is possible, I would suggest that the AI consider the diplomatic status outcome for accepting a free city. If the sender is at war with a faction that shares a border with the gift city, then the AI should probably turn down the free city offer.

I have no idea what is possible through modifying the text files, so if this is too complex to implement, no big deal. It would be good to close that kind of loophole though.

	17-01-2001 07:32									#34
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Martina:

The AI wasn't changing it's diplomatic strategy. It considered it but didn't change it. Therefore, in the 'BeginTurn' routine you need to change all the ConsiderDiplomaticState's to ChangeDiplomaticState.

Kinjiru:

At lunch I drew up some flowcharts to map the flow of diplomatic proposals and what to check (on paper of course). Pity I got beetroot juice all over it. Anyways, I thought of just that problem you mentioned. I figure it could be overcome if CityToExtort is within 10 squares of OwnCity which would make the city a border-city. That way, at least it has a fighting chance of getting defense there quickly. If you take into account the reality of supply problems, you don't want to accept a city that is too far from your borders, or on another island totally. I think this simple measure could simulate that. Any suggestions anyone?

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Author of Diplomod. The mod to fix diplomacy.

Rommell to a sub-commander outside Tobruk: "Those Australians are in there somewhere. But where? Let's advance and wait till they shoot, then shoot back."

	18-01-2001 08:35									#36
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Dale, I'm having some trouble with your mod. I'm getting an array out of bounds slic error as soon as I startup. I'm also running Frenzy v1.03. Maybe I'll just wait until v. 3.0 and re-try. I unzipped into install, but the files were in a 'default' folder, so I copied them over their namesakes down a couple of levels. Maybe I missed something.

P.S. Is there a way I can set this up with Frenzy as a scenario, and leave the base system alone?

	18-01-2001 11:04									#37
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To those who have errors with my diplomacy mod, sorry bout that. Here's my suggestion. Instead of me spending time bug-fixing v2.2, I'll continue with v3.0. I now have the AI's swapping maps, advances and peace-treaties. Alliances are a little more complex to work out. I'm basing alliances on a combined overall rating of the two civs, whether they're at war or desire war with the same civs, and regard is fairly high. Now to get that part of the script running.

So question for you guys:

Do ya want me to bug-fix or continue till I get a v3.0 alpha for you to play with?

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Author of Diplomod. The mod to fix diplomacy.

Rommell to a sub-commander outside Tobruk: "Those Australians are in there somewhere. But where? Let's advance and wait till they shoot, then shoot back."

	18-01-2001 11:53									#38
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i'm not much for temp fixes, so my vote is 3.0

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History is written by the victor.

	18-01-2001 15:19									#39
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Same for me , ... and keep up the good work Dale !

Thanks!

	19-01-2001 10:49									#40
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One annying thing I noticed in the diplomod is that when I exchange an advance with the AI for gold I do not get any gold. I think they got my advance so they cheated.

I don't know if this is a bug in the game or in your mod cause I never tried exhanging advances for gold with the AI before.

Maybe it is just my version or something so I would like to have it confirmed. Otherwise I will have to reinstall the game/mod.

Keep up the good work. Looking forward to v. 3.0

GreatDane

	18-01-2001 23:29									#41
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The advance for gold bug is part of the game not the diplomod. Hopefully it's something that can be addressed by future patches.

Thanks for the great work on the mods everyone!

	19-01-2001 05:24									#42
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Yeah, the advance for gold exchange ain't my bug. But the "array out of index" bug is. I know what it is now. It's when the "player[DIP_civx]" variable goes out of the amount actually there. Basically, the script trys to make a call to a player number that isn't there. I did a quick test on my machine and found that changing:

DIP_NumOfPlayers = Preference("NumPlayers") + 5;

TO

DIP_NumOfPlayers = Preference("NumPlayers");

fixed the problem. Of course, if you're in a saved game you need to reload SLIC (either through the chat dialog or the cheat menu).

Just on version 3.0, I had an interesting test last night. Started a hard - small map game (so contact is made quickly). Found the Greeks about turn 5. They immediately demanded my capital. Over the next ten turns they demanded my capital 3 times, and on the last one threatened war. I rejected all of them, they declared war and sent their army at me (which consisted of a hoplite and a warrior). He beat me as I only had a warrior in my captial. The other was getting ruins. This was all within 30 turns. So how's that folks? I just don't know if it was an isolated incident.

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Author of Diplomod. The mod to fix diplomacy.

Rommell to a sub-commander outside Tobruk: "Those Australians are in there somewhere. But where? Let's advance and wait till they shoot, then shoot back."

	19-01-2001 06:16									#43
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I'll probably wait until version 3.0 so that's my vote. (But just in case - in which files would I change the numplayers and the considerdiplo.... statements?)
P.S Thanks for all the effort. Sounds good and I look forward.
P.P.S It might be a while before you see any mods from me, being a beagle of little programming ability. For example. I was trying to do a bit of tweaking the other day and couldn't figure out why I was crashing. Then I realized I had left Net Nanny on and she had edited out all the "naughty bits", like "bomb_cabinet".

	19-01-2001 16:42									#45
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Nice site, Omnigod. There needs to be a central place where people can go to try out all the new things being worked on.

Dale, I would be very interested in seeing your mod once you are a little further along in it. Are you just adjusting the original text files, or are you making slic for all this?

	19-01-2001 18:52									#46
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Hi Dale,

quote:
P.P.S It might be a while before you see any mods from me, being a beagle of little programming ability. For example. I was trying to do a bit of tweaking the other day and couldn't figure out why I was crashing. Then I realized I had left Net Nanny on and she had edited out all the "naughty bits", like "bomb_cabinet".

That was very funny! Computers, you gotta love them!

Timothy Pintello

	19-01-2001 23:36									#47
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Hi,

I'm rathern new on the block here but that solution to the array out of bounds error don't work when you take away the + 5.

In the for statements you have to change DIP_civ1 to player[DIP_civ1] and you have to change all of these statements !
This is a simple C programming language error...you have to let the SLIC know which array it's about !
The player array !

But having changed this leaves me with a new error. To many arguments in ConsiderDiplomaticState.

What the heck is this ? How do I solve this.

	22-01-2001 04:53									#48
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If you didn't see my post in the Activision statement post, then I'll repeat myself here.

I'm very pissed off with the support we've received for CTP2. While a good game, the glaring problems will not be addresses (namely diplomacy and AI ferocity). In response to the frustration I'm facing in trying to get the AI to perform diplomacy, I'm putting Diplomod V3.0 on the shelf. If I don't have anything else to do, I may go into it. But considering how many crashes I get with patch 1.1, and the fact that the unpatched CTP2 has almost no diplomacy SLIC available, I doubt very much that I'll continue. Thanks for your support though.

Except for the fact the AI will NEVER make a treaty or alliance (because of the internal programming settings and there is no SLIC to force a proposal/acceptance), I actually had a pretty decent AI diplomacy model working. But without treatys or alliances between AI's, what's the point of using diplomacy? These two options make diplomacy, not all the others which I have working well.

PS. If there is interest for the AI diplomacy script that I do have working, then let me know and I'll send it to Rich to update his link on V2.2.

Wes, it's a SLIC script, not just txt file changes.

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Author of Diplomod. The mod to fix diplomacy.

Rommell to a sub-commander outside Tobruk: "Those Australians are in there somewhere. But where? Let's advance and wait till they shoot, then shoot back."

	22-01-2001 05:12									#49
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Dale, please do not give up your efforts. I just installed your diplomod into my modern era scenario today. I already had treaties setup, and the game was going awesome. I was playing as the indians. After a few turns, the EU declared war on russia, and the next turn 4 other nations declared war on russia as well.

	22-01-2001 05:36									#50
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yeah, Dale, dont give up!
i believe we have a lot to find out on what we can do with ctp2!

	22-01-2001 05:54									#51
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I agree with Mark there.. there is potential for this game, and we'll find all the things that we can change, and maybe MrOgre will pop back, once he's had a nice rest, and give us a little guidance or someone else will find part of your solution... there's enough of us, we should be able to improve this considerably.

rich

	22-01-2001 06:10									#52
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speaking about discovering things...
check out my last post in the thread about the medieval mod: an experiment with the gamefile.txt

	22-01-2001 13:31									#53
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Hey,

I've tried Diplomod and it was great...for the first time since I bought the game I actually thought that it had some kind of intelligence.

It activelly seeked out my civ and made diplomacy it's priority instead of conquest.
Also it's extremely good in making contact and diplomacy with other civ's now.

If you quit it will be a dark day in the history of CTP2, a day in which the players said : "The game sucks but we will make it work !".
I hope sincerely that you continue your work !

greetings, a big fan of diplomod

	22-01-2001 18:43									#54
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Dale - are you posting version 3.0 at all ?

And thanks for your work on this mod

	23-01-2001 00:48									#55
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Here's a question I hope someone can answer.
Is it possible to use the diplomod in the MedMod2 mod ?

If so, how do I go about doing it?

	23-01-2001 04:16									#56
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Okay, thanks to a heap of emails and the comments here in the forums, I've been pressured back into finishing V3.0

Here's where it stands right now:
1 - The AI's will swap maps.
2 - The AI's will buy advances from each other.
3 - The code is in there (but the stupid internal programming of the game will never allow the AI to do it) for AI's to make peace-treatys, trade pacts and research pacts.
4 - The AI will use three different AI-Human diplomatic states (friendly, war and default) and a special AI-AI state (regard penalties don't hit so hard).
5 - The AI doesn't refuse everything by default (like in V2).
6 - The AI is more demanding of Human players (give me this, give me that, etc).
7 - I still need to code in withdraw troops and a couple of 'catch' commands. I left them out so I could test at this point. Eg. The AI can make proposals to people it hasn't even met.
8 - Refining and bug catching also need to be done.

So I'm not that far off a Beta V3.0 Is there anyone who would like to beta-test for me? If so, email me and I'll send you the mod when it's ready for testing.

Thanks guys for your support.
Dale - dale.kent@mel.alphawest.com.au

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Author of Diplomod. The mod to fix diplomacy.

Rommell to a sub-commander outside Tobruk: "Those Australians are in there somewhere. But where? Let's advance and wait till they shoot, then shoot back."

	23-01-2001 05:00									#58
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I cant understand why activision stopped treatys by a.i.s it sucks big time.So there will never be a.i treatys what a let down.

	23-01-2001 05:17									#59
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Dale, your mod sounds great. As you develop your mod, it would be a big help to everyone, yourself included, if you would try and keep track of which changes had which effects on the ai. I know that this can be quite difficult when dealing with diplomacy, but anything we can learn will help our efforts.

I look forward to using any progress you make with the text files in the Med mod, and perhaps the slic parts as well, eventually. I will probably wait until the other slic parts of the Med mod are in place first, though.

	23-01-2001 05:48									#60
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Good idea. I'd get a well-rounded AI first before trying anything with diplomacy.

I've got a history file in my mod that tracks changes and what they do. Does this cover it? If not I should be able to come up with something more detailed. Though a lot of my experimentations have ended in CTP2 crashing severely or hardware locking. Don't ask me how, but it can hardware lock on ya.

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Author of Diplomod. The mod to fix diplomacy.

Rommell to a sub-commander outside Tobruk: "Those Australians are in there somewhere. But where? Let's advance and wait till they shoot, then shoot back."