02-08-2001 19:32									#31
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger I am a god

awww,
urban ranger = dan magaha??????

	02-08-2001 19:51									#32
	Got spare money?

A PII-300 without graphics card has been less than the minimum required for the many styles of games for years. I know it is inappropriate to compare across genres too much, but just think how it must feel to try and keep up if you are a FPS or flight/racing fan. Even RPG's are graphics heavy these days. I've already gone through 3 different 3D cards (one blew up) and expanded to 256MB Ram and 50Gb hard disk space. These requirements are so low it amazes me.

	02-08-2001 19:58									#33
	Put an end to popups!

Of course not LaRusso. Don't be ridiculous.

Ranger = SID

	02-08-2001 20:48									#34
	Computer components at an all time low Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

For those of you griping about an upgrade:
-1.2GHz (that's 1200MHz) Processor: $89
-Supporting Motherboard: $100 (and that is a *top of the line* motherboard manufacturer price, so you can find an adiquate motherboard for probably $75)
256Mb stick of RAM: $45 (from the leading manufactureer of ram - I've seen other manufacturers as cheap as $21)

If you don't meet your system specs, then your system is aproximately 4 1/2 years old (Pentium 350 was released 1st quarter 1997). Sorry to tell you, but normally 3 years in technology is like 9 years in the automotive industry --it's time for a new one, or buy some new parts to make it hobble along. So, you pretty much have the equivilant of a 13 1/2 year old car (thats 1988 car, btw)

A pentium 350Mhz is NOT too much to ask.

	02-08-2001 20:54									#35
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

It's actually P2 300, Nemo, which makes your point even more valid. I'm not saying that everyone should have a top of the line computer, especially if you don't have the money for one, but Firaxis couldn't have made the requirements much lower without sacrificing game quality. It's as simple as that.

	02-08-2001 21:48									#36
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Dan Magaha FIRAXIS Civ III does not require a Pentium III, it requires a PII 300Mhz, which is even a middle-of-the-road PII. By the time the game hits shelves, Pentium 4 2Ghz machines will be available, so by contrast, PII-300Mhz doesn't sound unreasonable to me, but I suppose I'm slighly biased

That is better- I may buy it to 'try' to play it now.
I thought you announced it required a Pentium III- but I suppose I was mistaken.
Thank you for the lower system requirement!

quote: Also, I'm not sure where you got the idea that you needed a 3D video card, because you don't -- you simply need to be able to do 1024x768x16bit color.

So... It isn't 3D it is merely 2D modeled to look like 3D- this sounds good
-I do have a 3D card by the way

quote: As far as your opinion on the graphics, all I can do is say what I've been saying for quite some time, which is that you should wait until the game is released before passing judgment on the graphics. Many of the screenshots floating around the net are *months* old, and we are still in development.

If you can fix the unit graphics (please make them look like Civ II's or, if you must update them... Heroes of Might and Magic's... not Call to Powers) and still keep light colors on the terrain- it will look much better!

Dan [/QUOTE]

	02-08-2001 21:49									#37
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Thank you for speaking to us, Dan

	03-08-2001 02:56									#38
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I've got a Celeron 333 Mhx processor will that be enough to run it ? I know Celerons aren't the best processors around

	03-08-2001 03:09									#39
	Re: Computer components at an all time low Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote: Originally posted by Nemo If you don't meet your system specs, then your system is aproximately 4 1/2 years old (Pentium 350 was released 1st quarter 1997). Sorry to tell you, but normally 3 years in technology is like 9 years in the automotive industry --it's time for a new one, or buy some new parts to make it hobble along. So, you pretty much have the equivilant of a 13 1/2 year old car (thats 1988 car, btw)

Tell that to my parents :victim of young age:
What I can tell mostly_harmless, that doesn't look too good. A friend of mine once told me that you should take at least 50 to 100 Mhz off the Celeron's rating to get a PII rating
I've decided that I'd upgrade my piece of s*** from -98 when there is a TBS I really really want (that is, Civ3) that exceeds my comp's hardware. I'm not sure am I happy or sad about Mr. Managa's announcement, come to think of it

	03-08-2001 05:12									#40
	Get a bigger avatar today!

for all of those complaining about the outrageous cost of computers here is one for you...

here is a new dell computer with the following

(it's a customized Dell Dimension L)

Celeron 800 MHz
128 mb ram
20gb hd
48x cd rom
speakers
56k modem
(no monitor)

all for $599
(tax and shipping included at checkout)

which should add about another $120 bringing it up to $720...however you can sometimes catch free shipping from dell and all you'd have to pay is tax

and if you get financing it's $18 a month...

the reason i didn't add in a new monitor is because if you have an old one you don't need a new one...so really if you can't play civ3 because you have less than a pII 300, then you most likely paid between $1,500-$2,000 to buy that brand new 200 mmx pentium with a whopping 48mb of ram...i think it's time to invest just a little in a new computer...because the one you have is probably challenged by SMAC, and about the only thing it can run with no problems is civ2

	03-08-2001 05:21									#41
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Nobody is disputing that computers can be very cheap nowadays. I think the issue some people are having trouble with is that they don't have $600 just sitting around in a neat pile waiting to be spent. Another problem some (younger people) have is convincing their parents to upgrade (I went through several years of hell before I escaped this).

	03-08-2001 06:11									#42
	Increase Your PM Length

Sabre2th

you may not have 600 dollars laying around ready to be spent...but if you are over 18 you do have the option of buying this on credit...you can goto your local bank and borrow 750 dollars (which will certianly be enough for this)...which with interest if you pay off your loan in one year you'll have to pay about 68 dollars a month (which is 17 dollars a week or basically taking your gf out to eat one time that week)...you can get your parents to cosign, and once you pay off your bill you'll have better credit and you can get a better computer right now

if you are under 18 then you don't have as many options...if you are 15 you just have to rely on your parents to upgrade...however before you do that

the minimum requirements are a 300 mhz processor and 32 mb ram...

i am almost positive that a p2 266 or probably even a p2 233 with 64 mb of ram will be able to run civ3 once you cut off every single little optional thing...it probably won't run it very well but it will still run it...so basically we are talking about people who own the original pentiums (which are are four to five years old)

ok so if you own an orignial pentium 200 mhz that has 32 mb of ram no you can't run civ3, but on the same hand you probably had problems running starcraft (it would run it but it would stutter from time to time...i know one of my friends had a 166 p1 with 32 mb of ram) which came out in 98...black and white, emperor, quake 3 all of those games would be beyond your computer...no dvd player...pretty much just word processing...most likely you are running windows 95 internet explorer edition, which also limits which programs you can run...you can type, surf the internet, and play older games and that's about it

over the years computers start running slower, so your computer is probably chugging away now...now if you do have a p1 200 then somebody in your household did pay a fair amount to buy it (unless they got it at a yardsale used last year then you are SOL)

so talk to the parent that bought the computer...present them with the most reasonable computers available, and just complain about how slow your current computer is, keep on asking for a new computer, and tell them you want it as a christmas present...and keep on asking until they eventually buy it for you...civ3 won't be out until october at the very least, and it could be later than that...unless you are just completely poor then more than likely you can get a new computer if you are under 18...if you are completely poor or your parents are unreasonable then goto plan b

find a geek who likes civ, and threaten to beat his ass unless he lets you play civ3...

if worst comes to worst and you are 16...then get a job work it for a month buy a new motherboard, amd duron processor, and ram (maybe 150-170 dollars) then goto http://www.sharkyextreme.com/ read their installation guides and upgrade your computer...once you buy your parts quit your suckass job and play civ3

i can't really see computer power getting in the way of owning and playing civ3...between cheap computers, yardsales, upgrades, getting 300 mhz isn't that hard...buy civ3 and play it at a friend's house...

mostly_harmless

dooes your celeron have an onboard cache? (it should be 128kb if it does) if so you will be fine...if not as long as you have ample ram and you cut off all of the multimedia then you should be able to run it

	03-08-2001 07:23									#43
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

OC your celeron

	03-08-2001 16:24									#44
	Increase Your PM Length

quote: Originally posted by Dan Magaha FIRAXIS you simply need to be able to do 1024x768x16bit color.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! :banned:

Do you know what this means to me? It means that I need to upgrade my video card and monitor! Wich means, in other words, that it's better for me to buy a new PC to replace my oldie AMD K6-2 with 64 MB RAM. Wich means that I have to buy a new PC with my own money, wich will only happen around April 2002! Man, Civ 3 only in April?!?

Life is so cruel!
Damn resolution... What's wrong with 800x600?

	03-08-2001 17:23									#45
	Got spare money?

I repeat, if they don't let us to go under 800x600, I'll not buy Civ 3, and will curse Firaxis for the rest of my life, like others are cursing Activision now. There are 3 reasons not to buy a new monitor for me, and they are important.
Firaxis, you see, most people are yet using 800x600 resolution, for various reasons. Actually, there are more people running 800x600 than people running CPUs slower than 350MHz. If you don't make Civ 3 work under 800x600, youºe losing profit, as you force many people to change their resolution, perhaps buy a new monitor, and many, like me, will not do that for various reasons. Please think about it, as I really am excited about Civ 3, and if the resolution will suit me, I'm usre to grab the game as soon as it comes here.

	03-08-2001 18:37									#46
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

Actually acording to most surveys (I have often looked them up for web design info) 86-90% of all people have 15" monitor or bigger (and there is usually 3-5% that don't know what size monitor they have). And since all 15" monitors can run at 1024x768, I dont see what the problem is? Even my 13.3" laptop screan can do 1024x768! I have 2 monitors I salvaged from the university's reject pile that can do 1024x768...and they were 14" monitors, btw. So, if you have a 15" or bigger monitor and you cant go to 1024x768, then you have a video card problem, or need to RTFM (Read The F---ing Manual) on how to change your desktop resolution.
Either way, I don't see why 1024x768 is an unreasonable request
You can find a used $30 15" monitor just about anywhere these days.

	03-08-2001 18:43									#47
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

My monitor can't! It's a bit over 6 years old. Why not buy a new one? :
1) With this one, I can do everything I need, except for Civ 3. i don't work with graphics
2) Resolutions higher than 800x600 anyway make me feel sick in quite a short time
3) I have nostalgia. I've been using that one at home for siz years no, and why should I get another one? Nooo.

And all other games do run at 800x600, that is the standard resolution. Firaxis, do you hear me?

	03-08-2001 18:46									#48
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

screen resolution stats for apolyton

 Resolution                      % 

1.  1024 x  768 pixels    45.84  

2.   800 x  600 pixels    32.11  

3.  1152 x  864 pixels     8.43  

4.  1280 x 1024 pixels     6.74  

5.  Other Resolutions      3.08  

6.   640 x  480 pixels     1.90  

7.  1600 x 1200 pixels     1.34  

8.   800 x  553 pixels     0.31  

9.  1024 x  721 pixels     0.21  

10.  640 x  433 pixels     0.04  

	03-08-2001 18:49									#49
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Look Solver, dump the 14" monitor like I did ages ago and splash out on something nicer. Larger monitors are getting quite cheap nowadays. Go on. Spoil yourself. You know it makes sense

	03-08-2001 18:53									#50
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Mine is 15". Those days it was something awesome. But look, even if I got a 21" monitor, I can't play a game with resolution of 1024x768. I have tried doing that at other PCs, I couldn't play for any more than half an hour. Some monitors are good for it , but rare . I know, they're cheap yes, but look at my reasons above.
And, for the cost of monitor, I can get 128 MB RAM slots.

	03-08-2001 18:54									#51
	Tired of ads?

That few use 1280x1024. I use it all the time when I am at home!

	03-08-2001 18:55									#52
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

sorry Solver, you are in the minority...a very small minority.

Mark G: very nice but, your stats are biased agains gamers (i.e. more gamers come to your site, and we all have the tendency to have cool video/sound stuff ) Do you take stats of screen size? Because what resolution people use, and what resolution people are capable of are two different things (I bet if you do, we will see more people capable of 800x600 than we can shake a stick at )

	03-08-2001 18:58									#53
	Get a bigger avatar today!

I don't actually think I'm in such a minority. I guess there are many people who will not, for various reasons, want to play under anything higher than 800x600.

	03-08-2001 19:04									#54
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by Nemo but, your stats are biased agains gamers

and i suppose civ3 is intended for accountants....

	03-08-2001 19:07									#55
	Increase Your PM Length

I am in the minority too... I fall under "Other"
Here is a tip for monitor sizes that I picked up a few years ago for the best quality:
divided you first number of your resolution by the second number, if it is not 1.3333... (its a 4:3 ratio) then you images are actually being scewed/stretched. so, if you are running at 1280x1024 (1.25 or a 5:4 ratio), you are actually stretching your pictures and not getting the best quality your monitor/video card is capable of. I used to use 1280x1024 until I found this out, now I use 1280x960 in win2k or, preferably, 1400x1050 in win98 (you can create custom screen resolutions in win98 by editting your registry )

edit: lol, of course its for accountants Mark G, didn't you know that its truly a statistics program disguised as a game?

	03-08-2001 19:07									#56
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

And I suppose Civ 3 is made to force me boycott Firaxis .

	03-08-2001 21:56									#57
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I don't agree with you. Yes, it would be nice if firaxis was able to include a 640x480 mode for all of you with ancient monitors , but the textures and resolutions may prevent that. I used to use windows in 800x600 mode all the time, then I tried 1024x768 and found it was much better, not only for Windows but for games.

Firaxis looks at the standards when they make their game, and a lowball standard is probably a PIII500 with 128megs of ram and a 15" monitor. Heck, they're selling 128MB ram sticks here for $18! Computer prices have gone way, way down, and you can get a good system for $600 or less.

Technology is not for the weak of heart.

	03-08-2001 22:11									#58
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

128 MB RAM about 26$ here.
PIII 500 is not a standard. Those who don't play much have 333 and under. Civ doesn't need much, other things need even less, unless you work with graphics.

	03-08-2001 22:53									#59
	Got spare money?

And let's face it, 800x600 can be supported by any monitor made in last seven years. Monitors older than that MUST have been changed anyway, since they're no bigger than 12", and can't show more colors than 256 or 16. While there are no drawbacks in using a six year old one, showing up to 32bit colors, and 800x600 resolution. Firaxis, please listen to me! I know you're browsing these boards frequently, so please take me in account. I'm so enthusiastic about the game, except for this part of it - resolution.

	04-08-2001 05:36									#60
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Finally, I'm not alone in the resolution protest!

Go Solver!

And those stats that show that about one third of Apolytoners use at least a resolution of 800x600 or under, mean that is a considerable number of potential players who might prefer (or must use) a 800x600 resolution!

How did those guys at Firaxis didn't see this problem coming?

Of course that we would like to use state of the art monitors, but you (and I mean everybody) should respect those who just can't get a higher resolution than 800x600.

I won't be enjoying the beauty of the game unless I have a 1024x768 resolution? Hey, it's me who has to live with it, not you! And if you didn't worry about it on SMAC, please don't start it now...