15-12-2001 12:43									#31
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What's a "virtual democracy?" Is it anything more than a figment of Sid's imagination?

	15-12-2001 12:46									#32
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Ugh, Ramo... how dare you combine the crap that is CtP with Sid's good name!

	15-12-2001 12:50									#33
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quote: I almost wish we would go into anarchy to see what happens to those people that voted for it

I suggest looking up the Spanish Civil War. Or the Paris Commune. Hell, just look up the history of the anarchist movement.

One would think I've explained the concept of anarchism enough on 'Poly...

	15-12-2001 12:53									#34
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I guess I've been playing too much CtP 2.

	15-12-2001 12:56									#35
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You're a Syndicalist, not a pure-bred anarchist. I know you fall under a formal definition of anarchist, but most of those in that camp probably don't want to have much to do with you.

	15-12-2001 17:22									#36
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Different governments work in different situations. I voted Technocracy, but was also tempted to choose Totalitarianism - but just for the purpose of this poll, because totalitarianism really doesn't mean "dictatorship by more than one person", but it means that the state controls all aspects of life.
Constitutional Dictatorship might also be a good idea.

	15-12-2001 19:27									#37
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quote: What's a "virtual democracy?" Is it anything more than a figment of Sid's imagination?

Virtual Democracy is democracy in the extreme. Based on heavy utilisation of computers and networks to allow extreme rights to everyone, and litteraly everyone. Rights to vote often, to make oppinion heard and to discuss, and discussion is what democracy is all about, much more important then even voting.

So, Virtual Democracy may be very Socialist or not. Since people discuss and interact better in VD then now, it should reflect peoples wishes better, after allowing for a wider discussion then now.

It is more a new way to practice politics, then a new political ideology.

	15-12-2001 19:47									#38
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this poll makes no sense at all

Despotism can be: monarchy, republic, communism, fascism, fundamentalism

Social democracy can be a parlimentary monarchy, a virtual democracy or a republic

Anarchy isn't a form of governement, but the lack of one.

ETC

ETC

ETC

	16-12-2001 00:09									#39
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quote: Originally posted by KrazyHorse You're a Syndicalist, not a pure-bred anarchist. I know you fall under a formal definition of anarchist, but most of those in that camp probably don't want to have much to do with you.

This is not true, you don't know what your'e talking about. I am a non-syndicalist Anarchist and have a lot of respect for Anarcho-Syndicalists. The association of Anarchism with choas and the like is pure slander, it has no basis in what we actually believe. Anarchy means "the absence of rulers" not "choas and destruction." In some places the term "democracy" used to be slander in the same way because it was thought that without a Monarch you'd have choas. I suggest you go here and read about what we really believe.

Oh, and BTW, Anarcho-Syndicalism was the most popular form of Anarchism in the 20th century and it remains quite popular among many Anarchists. To say that most Anarchists don't want much to do with Syndicalists is rubbish.

	16-12-2001 00:29									#40
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I voted Republic. A government that serves the people under a decentralized government conserted powers to the provinces/states allowing a confederation to be formed, but not a government that has strong central controls. The small central government in my opinion must protect and defend soverignity and the law.

BTW I was never banned, Ming gave me a chance.

	16-12-2001 00:45									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo I suggest looking up the Spanish Civil War. Or the Paris Commune.

The leaders were killed and thier small victories were crushed.

quote: Hell, just look up the history of the anarchist movement.

Gia-pet would probably point out the movements association with terrorism here.

Anyway my favorite government form would have to be Demesos (sp)

	16-12-2001 00:50									#42
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc The leaders were killed and thier small victories were crushed.

No offense ramo or anything, but wasn't it Franco who ruled my country with an iron fist from the 1930s till 1975? I wait for a reply. Franco won the civil war and my grandfather fought in that war on the nationalist side. He was an heavily decorated solider.

quote: Gia-pet would probably point out the movements association with terrorism here.

Too many to count. I am deeply upsetted about how one can believe in anarchy.

	16-12-2001 00:53									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo No offense ramo or anything, but wasn't it Franco who ruled my country with an iron fist from the 1930s till 1975?

He's rrefering to the temporary anarchist victory in Catalonia (sp).

	16-12-2001 00:55									#44
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc He's rrefering to the temporary anarchist victory in Catalonia (sp).

Which was defeated about a year after it was won. Franco was too popular. My Grandfather fought in Catalonia on Franco's side.

	16-12-2001 01:15									#45
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Anarchy is a waste of time, as is communism... but I agree, this poll is a 'civish' way of looking at government

	16-12-2001 01:21									#46
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo Franco was too popular.

That explains the right's defeat in the elections. Franco's victory had more to do with support from Hitler & Mussolini and the backstabbing by Stalinists then his popularity (which wasn't too much).

	16-12-2001 01:25									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Joe R. Golowka That explains the right's defeat in the elections. Franco's victory had more to do with support from Hitler & Mussolini and the backstabbing by Stalinists then his popularity (which wasn't too much).

And? He became popular after 1939. His economic programs are a model.

Spain was won by Franco, and gave the Stalinists their first defeat. Their next defeat came in South Korea where they were kicked out.

	16-12-2001 01:45									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo And? He became popular after 1939.

That's cause he was a fascist who suppressed criticism of him.

quote: Spain was won by Franco, and gave the Stalinists their first defeat.

Actually the Bolsheviks were given their first defeat shortly after the Russian Revolution when they tried to spread their revolution to other countries in Europe and Asia and failed miserably. And the Spanish Communist Party was a negligable force prior to the start of the Civil War. It was Franco's attempted coup and ensuing events which led to the Stalinist's emergance as a signifigant political force on the Republican side. To claim he stopped the Stalinists is BS because his actions were what caused them to be a threat in the first place. Besides, the Fascist state Franco installed was at least as bad as a Stalinist state.

	16-12-2001 01:53									#49
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quote: Originally posted by Sirotnikov I'll invent my own form. Some sort of an authoritarian parliamentarian presidency.

Exactly.

Led by the only man on this planet who can make things exactly in the way they should be. (that's me! )

	16-12-2001 02:09									#50
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:: Pulls up chair, opens bag of chips ::

Yeeha! Giancarlo vs. a Anarchist (Joe Blow or whatever the hell his name is)

	16-12-2001 02:12									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Joe R. Golowka That's cause he was a fascist who suppressed criticism of him.

[/quote]
Actually the Bolsheviks were given their first defeat shortly after the Russian Revolution when they tried to spread their revolution to other countries in Europe and Asia and failed miserably.[/quote]

I didn't know that.

quote: And the Spanish Communist Party was a negligable force prior to the start of the Civil War. It was Franco's attempted coup and ensuing events which led to the Stalinist's emergance as a signifigant political force on the Republican side.

The Republican side lost.

quote: To claim he stopped the Stalinists is BS because his actions were what caused them to be a threat in the first place. Besides, the Fascist state Franco installed was at least as bad as a Stalinist state.

He had to get support from somebody, most likely Mussolini and Hitler. Franco brought alone the economic boom of the 1960s... Encarta says that and that is apparent in Spain today.

	16-12-2001 02:31									#52
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quote: The leaders were killed and thier small victories were crushed.

Because of the power-hungry Stalinists.

quote: Gia-pet would probably point out the movements association with terrorism here.

I would probably point out that terror involves actions against innocent civilians; most anarchist acts of violence were carried out against the state.

I would also probably point out the incomparably stronger association between the state and terrorism.

quote: No offense ramo or anything, but wasn't it Franco who ruled my country with an iron fist from the 1930s till 1975?

He didn't win the Civil War until the end of the decade.

quote: I am deeply upsetted about how one can believe in anarchy.

I'm sure a fascist would be "deeply unsettled" about how anyone can believe in anarchy.

quote: Franco was too popular.

Would that be the reason why he executed over a hundred thousand Spaniards? Because they loved him too much?

quote: He became popular after 1939. His economic programs are a model.

Just like Hitler and Stalin were popular, right?

	16-12-2001 02:33									#53
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quote: Their next defeat came in South Korea where they were kicked out.

	16-12-2001 04:26									#54
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Theocracy. Really. Although Baathist neo-Islamic totalitarianism is pretty cool too.

	16-12-2001 07:11									#55
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So is Giancarlo a gay republican from Spain?

That seems quite oxymoronic.

	16-12-2001 07:16									#56
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All those social dems....



* MORON thinks this forum have a leftist bias

	16-12-2001 07:19									#57
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quote: Originally posted by Dimorier Maximus So is Giancarlo a gay republican from Spain? That seems quite oxymoronic.

No. I am a nationalist from Spain.

	16-12-2001 07:19									#58
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quote: Originally posted by MORON All those social dems.... * Goingonit thinks this forum have a leftist bias

No question. All the Canadians and Eurocoms

	16-12-2001 07:25									#59
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quote: Originally posted by Giancarlo No. I am a nationalist from Spain.

So you are a gay republican nationalist from Spain? I've heard about those nude pics, so don't deny the gay part.

	16-12-2001 07:47									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Ramo Because of the power-hungry Stalinists.

It was a civil war are you telling me that they seriously expected any alliance to hold. Anyway what does the Paris Commune have to do with Catalonia? I always thought that was more of a defeat for the Commies than the Anarchists.

quote: I would probably point out that terror involves actions against innocent civilians; most anarchist acts of violence were carried out against the state.

At which point he would say that most forms of terror are directed against the State and ask you to differentiate between Anarchist terrorism from Communist terrorism.