10-01-2002 08:02									#31
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

This is the best decision that Firaxis has made.Should have been done eons ago.

Put some Civ2 players on the team!!!...there is a reason that game is still going strong today.ESPECIALLY some civ2 MULTIPLAYERS...they do know how to play single play

	10-01-2002 08:29									#32
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

To bad you are doing this for Americans only, especially when I can walk to Detroit from my home in Canada, but I am going to link this thread to I-ChallengeU.com In our Civ3 section. A great chance for all of those living in the states.

Last edited by bobT on 10-01-2002 at 08:53

	10-01-2002 08:47									#33
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Smash ESPECIALLY some civ2 MULTIPLAYERS...they do know how to play single play

They do???!!!

And on the serious side ... Probably should have happened earlier but better late than never.

	11-01-2002 01:42									#34
	Got spare money?

quote: Originally posted by Travathian They need to take note of Blizzard, you know the guys who do a public beta test THEN release the game, not the other way around.

If that eliminates the need for fixes, then what is this

	11-01-2002 02:04									#35
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

While its fine to say better late than never, once a project has come as far a long as civ3 has the ammount of influance the beta team can have on the project is limited, when compared to what they might have done if they had been involved eariler.

Its hard for us to speculate what they will actually use the beta team for. Maybe they just want to give us the courtesy to put a few more hundred hours playtesting into a patch before releasing it to us after enduring the hailstorm of bug complaints from the original release. Maybe they want help with ideas for improving the scenario and editing tools, but there's nothing specific in the request to lead to that. Another thought is the testing or impletmenting of multiplayer.....this is where actual player feed back and massive testing is a big need.....and a good guess of where the resources might go.......but still its unlikely that this group of beta testers will greatly alter the game we already know as civ3, good or bad.

	11-01-2002 16:21									#36
	Put an end to popups!

Yeah, I sadly have to agree that maybe this will not change Civ3 by anywhere near as much as could have been altered before its release (but then again, pleasant surprises are all good ), yet it sounds to me like Firaxis has realized something, and is doing what they can to rectify the problems. Even if this doesn't help immediately, I expect improvements in games to come...

Wouldn't you rather have a better Civ 4 with fan input and consultation than get Firaxis to give up on the series completely after this one (admittedly large) blip on the graph...

I would.

	11-01-2002 16:56									#37
	Idea so Non-Americans can get some input. Put an end to popups!

Hey!

In order that the millions... and millions of Civ3's non-American fans get some input into the beta testing, can we get some thread set up to offer suggestions to the team that gets selected? Or even just get a moderator to occasionally collate some ideas and get them to the team?

And if anyone from Firaxis is reading, is it possible that, before the legal thingies are signed, is it too hard to allow members of the beta team that frequent Apolyton, Civfanatics or other sites with discussion fora to ask for specific ideas from the other posters? For example if there was the idea of improving or adding units in an expansion, they would be allowed to start a thread here asking for ideas on what ppl like about existing units or compile a list of units ppl want to see?

Do you smell what I'm cookin' here?

	11-01-2002 17:02									#38
	Increase the size of your Attachments

i dont think any names will be announced. in fact the only indication will be if someone disappears from the forums...

	11-01-2002 17:08									#39
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Well, yeah. It would come about because someone is brave enough (or stupid enough) to announce it themselves, and have to cope with the swarms of email, both prank and otherwise, that they would get.

That's why perhaps we could ask for members to with a moderator or other sufficiently powerful (forum-wise) person and get them to arrange things. Or otherwise just instigate a thread or beta forum so that the team's anonymity can be preserved, yet those of us with something to say can still be heard!

I throw this out to the floor...what do YOU think?

	11-01-2002 21:06									#40
	Public Beta testers for Firaxis? Aren't they like 5 months late? Put an end to popups!

Although I do applaud for an open beta test to every game, I have to rant that most probably many testers will be used to test SimGolf, in order to "clean" the quality "face" of Firaxis after the failure to launch Civ 3 shinning and polished.

Of course I want Sim Golf to be a great game, but Civ 3 should have gotten a lot more attention from the Firaxis administration board, because if Civ 3 isn't polished enough to meet the public expectation, that is certainly due to insufficient human resources available to the development of the project. And this is even more a bigger issue, since this board allowed two projects to be running simultaneously!

In short, Firaxis should have started this public beta testers search a lot sooner.

	11-01-2002 21:40									#41
	Re: Public Beta testers for Firaxis? Aren't they like 5 months late? Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by Zealot Although I do applaud for an open beta test to every game, I have to rant that most probably many testers will be used to test SimGolf, in order to "clean" the quality "face" of Firaxis after the failure to launch Civ 3 shinning and polished.

Didn't you post this exact same message elsewhere already?

In any case, here are some fun facts:

1) Jeff is putting together the beta team.
2) Jeff is not the producer on (or for that matter involved in any way with) SimGolf.
3) SimGolf has already gone gold.

You can draw your own conclusions with these facts, but they don't lead to a putting green...


Dan

	11-01-2002 22:24									#42
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

a secret plan to get civers to test simgolf?
what an amazing idea zealot! firaxis should have thought of this much earlier(preferrably before the game going gold)

	11-01-2002 22:24									#43
	Re: Re: Public Beta testers for Firaxis? Aren't they like 5 months late? Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Dan Magaha FIRAXIS Didn't you post this exact same message elsewhere already?

Yes, I did, but MarkG closed my thread short after I created it. Despite having a short discussion with him, because he has the opinion that I should have posted my comment in this thread instead of creating a new one in the General forum, and I have the opinion that this would cause what we all know as "threadjacking".
Today I sent him a pm saying that I would copy and paste into here if he had no answer to give me about my request for him to re-open my original thread. He didn't reply. So I guess it's his intention to keep anything with the words "beta test" and "Firaxis" only in this thread.
The reason I wanted a separate thread is because my comment is just about Firaxis' Beta testing politic, which I criticize for being, IMO, a tad too late for Civ 3; and not about how wide the requisites for being a beta tester should be.

I don't consider myself one of those guys who aren't ever happy until they get everything their way, but I also think that every one's "space" should be respected in this wonderful forum. I still feel that I'm invading Firaxis "space" with such "off-topic" post, but I don't want to have an unpleasant relationship with a moderator but still discuss my subject with the community. I think both things are possible, without hurting anyone's feelings.

quote: Originally posted by Dan Magaha FIRAXIS In any case, here are some fun facts: 1) Jeff is putting together the beta team. 2) Jeff is not the producer on (or for that matter involved in any way with) SimGolf. 3) SimGolf has already gone gold. You can draw your own conclusions with these facts, but they don't lead to a putting green...Dan

1- As I said before, he should have started earlier.
2- Do you clearly mean that no tester will be asked to help on SimGolf?
3- So has Civ 3 a long time ago, but you'll need testers for SimGolf patches anyway.

I'm sorry for any inconvenience.

	11-01-2002 22:28									#44
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by MarkG a secret plan to get civers to test simgolf?

A secret evil plan!

quote: Originally posted by MarkG what an amazing idea zealot! firaxis should have thought of this much earlier(preferrably before the game going gold)

I gave my opinion why I thought this way in point 3 of my post above.

	11-01-2002 22:56									#45
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Zealot I gave my opinion why I thought this way in point 3 of my post above.

actually, you didnt give a single reason on why would firaxis look for simgolf testers in the civ3 creation and strategy forums

	11-01-2002 23:07									#46
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by MarkG actually, you didnt give a single reason on why would firaxis look for simgolf testers in the civ3 creation and strategy forums

Because that's where the people who explore and tweak everything AND love Firaxis are?

	11-01-2002 23:21									#47
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot Shoot

why couldn't this have been done a few years ago (or even last year?)? (well I would not have been old enough...)

Next semester is fairly light (a lot lighter than the one I just went though) so I ould help then, but then I go to grad school and that is more important to me.

Maybe I will apply anyway (for the next semester).

BTW, I think this is a good idea (and I do not have any serious problems with Firaxis's old testing strategy either, as long as it gets done I am fine) and do not agree with those that look for the bad in everything (hopefully zealot was joking).

I am sure though that more Quality (I like the application idea and think maybe it should be longer) Beta Testers will improve the speed in which the Beta Testing is finished (which will result in either Patches getting out faster or Better Patches getting out)

good luck to everyone out there that is applying

Jon Miller

	11-01-2002 23:25									#48
	Put an end to popups!

quote: Originally posted by Zealot Because that's where the people who explore and tweak everything AND love Firaxis are?

yeah the same people who were saying that sid should drop golfing and work on civ3 full time.....

	11-01-2002 23:37									#49
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by MarkG yeah the same people who were saying that sid should drop golfing and work on civ3 full time.....

We both know that most of these guys would do anything to work with Firaxis in anything they want to.
Heck, even I would! Yes, even in SimGolf! "You want me to test a new patch for Gettysburg? Sure, no problem! How much do I have to pay?"

quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller and do not agree with those that look for the bad in everything (hopefully zealot was joking).

Huh?
Waht are you talking about? What "bad in everything"?

You see Mark? No one is paying enough attention to my post! This is deffinetly the wrong place!

	12-01-2002 01:21									#50
	Inflate your Upload Space

I did a quick readby

if I mistaked your intentions (probable), I am sorry

Jon Miller

	12-01-2002 01:35									#51
	Re: Re: Re: Public Beta testers for Firaxis? Aren't they like 5 months late? Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by Zealot The reason I wanted a separate thread is because my comment is just about Firaxis' Beta testing politic, which I criticize for being, IMO, a tad too late for Civ 3; and not about how wide the requisites for being a beta tester should be.

...a tad...

	12-01-2002 01:41									#52
	Re: Re: Re: Re: Public Beta testers for Firaxis? Aren't they like 5 months late? Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tribune ...a tad...

I don't want to be rude.

	16-01-2002 16:04									#53
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

always americans
I which have maybe spend a percent of my awake time the last 10years on civI->SMAC and now civ3 can not partcipate

	17-01-2002 02:09									#54
	Increase Your PM Length

The game is so totally wrecked I would not participate in a salvaging effort, if they paid me. They limit this to Americans, because they believe Americans are more naive and gullible. Same as with the LE. Itīs actually a compliment to us Europeans, sort of.

	18-01-2002 03:26									#55
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Shame its US only. If there were no buildings, the US border would be just on the horizon from my house. I'll just patiently hide into the shadows, quietly waiting for future patches and the like.

	18-01-2002 22:49									#56
	Please don't look at it as nationalistic garbage Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tribune The game is so totally wrecked I would not participate in a salvaging effort, if they paid me. They limit this to Americans, because they believe Americans are more naive and gullible. Same as with the LE. Itīs actually a compliment to us Europeans, sort of.

Probibly for several very good reasons, most of them legal (IMHO). Language and time zone differences don't help, either. Shipping of Items (CD's with updated patches/new beta's, Legal Documents, etc.) overseas can be expensive (you want to send it some way the gives you a tracking number) and needs to meet proper Customs documentation for exporting (even to Canada) or your Import/Export License could be pulled.

	23-01-2002 07:49									#57
	Nearby Relatives Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

How about if we're only a teeny way North of the border. Some of us are bilingual (Mrricun and Canajun).

(multilingual dans la belle province - mais bien sur (Sesquilingual on the prairies, but it's hard to learn French from our Cornflake boxes.))

	24-01-2002 16:50									#58
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Please Dan answer these Questions:

- Are the future projects that are mentioned CIV related?

- Will those future projects be included in the edition that is said will be released in Spring?

I will buy anything related to CIV, because I like all the three titles. But I really would like that one of those projects to be a editor that allows the creation of scenarios at least as good as those done by the fans for CIV II.

Thanks

(of course for many people in the forums I am naive, have no taste or criteria for games etc, if so, it will be better, If I had I would not be as happy as I am with CIV III)

	06-02-2002 23:23									#59
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

What happen if a Costa Rican Player aply???

Thats discrimination!

	08-02-2002 00:33									#60
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Hi guys. We're leaving the beta@firaxis.com email address open but we're starting the selection process based on those applications we've already received. Thanks to all who applied. If selected, we'll be notifying you by email over the coming weeks.

Jeff