11-02-2002 04:33									#31
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israel never used mass-destructive weapons against its people or its neighbor. irsael is responsible and doesnt vow to wipe islam
off the face of the earth.

saddam has gased the kurds twice and the iranians 3 seperate occassions (see iran-iraq war)

	11-02-2002 04:37									#32
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quote: israel never used mass-destructive weapons against its people or its neighbor. irsael is responsible and doesnt vow to wipe islam off the face of the earth. saddam has gased the kurds twice and the iranians 3 seperate occassions (see iran-iraq war)

The French, Britons and Germans used to gas eachother as well.
And the Americans nuked two Japanese cities.

Why is that less bad than what Iraq does?

	11-02-2002 04:41									#33
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quote: Originally posted by Saint Marcus The French, Britons and Germans used to gas eachother as well. And the Americans nuked two Japanese cities. Why is that less bad than what Iraq does?

do i have to explain this like you are a little kid?

He hit me so its ok I hit him back? Right?


so because of what europe and america did 60 years ago (and hastn done since) makes it ok for iraq to gas its neighbors? thats stupid logic, and the kind of logic that leads to events like munich. when badboys can get away with what they want too. i cant believe im argueing this.

	11-02-2002 04:49									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Sceptor107 saddam has gased the kurds twice ...

And our friendly Turkish allies wipe them out the old-fashioned way.

quote: ...and the iranians 3 seperate occassions (see iran-iraq war)

And that war was instigated by whom? I´ll help you: 3 letters. First is a U. Second is an S.

	11-02-2002 05:49									#35
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No it wasnt. It was instigated bye your little friend khomeini, who began arming Shiite's in South Eastern Iraq. Which USA wanted to stop because the whole region was boiling over. At the time, we did business Saddam. Why wouldnt we? he was there, he was lesser of an evil at the time.....(hitler-stalin)


also, remember the hostages now?

	11-02-2002 05:50									#36
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Should also mention, Saddam did 98.9% of his business with the Soviet Union...So blame them. (And for Afghanistan also)

	11-02-2002 06:57									#37
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quote: And that war was instigated by whom? I´ll help you: 3 letters. First is a U. Second is an S.

Saddam didn't need any instigation to start that war. He was happy to do it on his own.

	11-02-2002 07:07									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Saint Marcus the Americans nuked two Japanese cities.

Possibly saving the lives of millions of Japanese and Americans because of the all-out invasion of Japan that would most certainly have happened without the bombs.

I hate the fact that they were used, but I can see why there were limited choices.

	11-02-2002 07:17									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Sceptor107 No it wasnt. It was instigated bye your little friend khomeini, who began arming Shiite's in South Eastern Iraq. Which USA wanted to stop because the whole region was boiling over. At the time, we did business Saddam. Why wouldnt we? he was there, he was lesser of an evil at the time.....(hitler-stalin) also, remember the hostages now?

So you admit that the US didn´t have a problem with Iraq having weapons of mass destruction at that time. So why is it suddenly a problem now?

And btw, why didn´t Carter or Reagan go to war against Khomeini? It seems that guy talked in a language US understand; there is obviously a lot to learn from him.

	11-02-2002 07:24									#40
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tribune So you admit that the US didn´t have a problem with Iraq having weapons of mass destruction at that time. So why is it suddenly a problem now? And btw, why didn´t Carter or Reagan go to war against Khomeini? It seems that guy talked in a language US understand; there is obviously a lot to learn from him.

Because Saddams government is a Socialist Secular one. Khomenie's was a Radical fundamentalist one. We had to pick saddam to throw our wieght behind. Carter was in no position (left in 80), and Reagan considered it after they attacked our destroyers. But decided supporting Saddam was a better policy.

It is truw we turned a blind eye on his weapons program. We thought he was somebody he could deal with, he wasnt that brutal at the time, he built lots of factories, roads and infrasturce. we though after the war that he would build on this. but sadly, his infrastructure was only a platform to launch further wars. so we boofed up.


(btw: the germans and Soviets helped saddam get womd)

	11-02-2002 07:26									#41
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also thank the frencsh for jimmy-rigging together that anti-aircraft system that shot down 60 coalition jets.

	11-02-2002 07:36									#42
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quote: Originally posted by Sceptor107 also thank the frencsh for jimmy-rigging together that anti-aircraft system that shot down 60 coalition jets.

Well, if you attack them again, I hope this time they shoot down at least 120.

	11-02-2002 07:43									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tribune Well, if you attack them again, I hope this time they shoot down at least 120.

na we beat it down over 11 years. maybe 5 or 6. But not as much as gulf war. (40 of the shoot downs were saudi, syrian or other anyway)

i wouldnt rule out the chinese fiber cables. they have downed 3 unmanned drones since august. almost got a U2 also.

	12-02-2002 16:12									#44
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Comrade Tribune

Perhaps you can explain to a fellow socialist why you're such a fan of Saddam Hussein, a man who has killed more Muslims than anyone else alive.

	12-02-2002 18:49									#45
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Sorry, guys, but it's Tuesday, which means no attack:

Bush has no plans to attack Iraq: Schroeder

Check back tomorrow.

	12-02-2002 18:52									#46
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quote: Originally posted by macaskil Perhaps you can explain to a fellow socialist why you're such a fan of Saddam Hussein, a man who has killed more Muslims than anyone else alive.

The US doesn't like him, therefore he must be A-ok. At least that's the impression that I get.

	12-02-2002 18:53									#47
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we shuold bomb irak



kill saddddammmm

	12-02-2002 21:06									#48
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quote: Originally posted by uh Clem Sorry, guys, but it's Tuesday, which means no attack: Bush has no plans to attack Iraq: Schroeder Check back tomorrow.

Na....not that bush would tell shroeder anyway?


I hear Bush is still "Considering" the matter on how to go about it (lots of domestic pressure to take out Saddam. Senators and public opinion).

	13-02-2002 01:04									#49
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quote: Originally posted by macaskil Perhaps you can explain to a fellow socialist why you're such a fan of Saddam Hussein, a man who has killed more Muslims than anyone else alive.

First of all, I am not a 'fan' of Saddam Hussein.

With this out of the way, my position is that the US don´t have a business to meddle in anybody´s internal affairs, or starting a war against them without casus belli. This would include Iran, Iraq, Syria, Lybia, North Korea, China, did I forget anyone?

	13-02-2002 01:09									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tribune With this out of the way, my position is that the US don´t have a business to meddle in anybody´s internal affairs, or starting a war against them without casus belli.

Europe itself already discredited this position themselves with the Balkan interventions. Point the blame at them for opening the door that we are just now walking through.

	13-02-2002 01:21									#51
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Europe itself already discredited this position themselves with the Balkan interventions. Point the blame at them for opening the door that we are just now walking through.

I start to like you a little bit better for that remark. You are the least moronic of the US cheerleaders in this forum.

And yes, this is completely right. We should have helped the Serbs against the CIA thugs arming the Kosovo Mafia.

	13-02-2002 01:24									#52
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Europe itself already discredited this position themselves with the Balkan interventions. Point the blame at them for opening the door that we are just now walking through.

So you finally understand why you did it...
why yo orchastrated the whole thing to the point where only bombing would rectify it and then you bombed.

	13-02-2002 01:28									#53
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 why yo orchastrated the whole thing to the point where only bombing would rectify it and then you bombed.

Let's not explore your rapant paranoia about how the CIA is the direct cause of all the world's problems again. It gave me a headache last time.

	13-02-2002 04:33									#54
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Let's not explore your rapant paranoia about how the CIA is the direct cause of all the world's problems again. It gave me a headache last time.

Not CIA. US foreign policy. And not responsible for all the worlds problems. Just responsible for the part where it had an interest to accomplish and had to force it.
and that's damn big part of the world

	13-02-2002 04:48									#55
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quote: Originally posted by Sceptor107 we shuold bomb irak kill saddddammmm

Always nice to see intelligent posts

	13-02-2002 21:56									#56
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quote: Europe itself already discredited this position themselves with the Balkan interventions. Point the blame at them for opening the door that we are just now walking through.

I may not agree with the US foreign policies and I do believe they should stay out of other countries with their armed forces.

And yes, Europe has done this too.

But just because I disaprove of US policies doesn't mean I approve off all European policies. I for one was against the Kosovo War, at least in the way it was fought.

	15-02-2002 10:38									#57
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quote: Originally posted by KrazyHorse Your logic is as flawless as your grammar.

Then lets correct the grammar and clarify the logic. In 1993, ex-President George Bush paid a visit to Kuwait, an independent and sovereign state. At that time Iraq was pretending to go along with weapons inspections, and no military action was being undertaken against Iraq. Iraqi agents attempted to assasinate Mr. Bush while he was in Kuwait, but the plot was foiled.

This establishes the following
A. The US has a casus belli against Iraq, 9-11 and fears of biological and chemical weapons aside.
B. Iraq is in fact a sponsor of international terrorism, in particular international terrorism directed against the United States. At a time when the world community is clamping down on state sponsorship of international terrorism, it is appropriate to take action with respect to the Iraqi regime.
C. Given Iraq's past sponsorship of international terrorism, coupled with its hatred for the US, it is not unreasonable to expect that at some point they will ally with Al-qaeeda, despite Iraq's secularist agenda. Stranger alliances have taken place in the past. This supposition is only reinforced by reports from Czech intelligence of contact between Iraqi intelligence and Al-Qaeeda operatives prior to 9-11.

LOTM

	15-02-2002 10:46									#58
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quote: Originally posted by Comrade Tribune And our friendly Turkish allies wipe them out the old-fashioned way. .

Our friendly Turkish allies forcibly suppress Kurdish culture. Not nice, but not genocide. The PKK responds with a vicious terrorist campaign against our friendly Turkish allies, including against Kurds who are not pro-PKK. Turkey responds with a military campaign against the PKK. Turkey plays rough, jailing without charges, using torture against prisoners. Not nice, but not genocide. Not what Saddam has done to the kurds (for that matter not what your friend Slobo did to the Kosovars in analogous circumstances)

But blurring distinctions is what you totalitarian guys like to do. Its part of "the big lie". Its how you can justify anything.

LOTM

	15-02-2002 10:49									#59
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quote: Originally posted by macaskil Comrade Tribune Perhaps you can explain to a fellow socialist why you're such a fan of Saddam Hussein, a man who has killed more Muslims than anyone else alive.

why shouldnt a communist like Saddam? After all the roots of Baathism are in european totalitarian politics, which owe so much to the ideas and practices articulated by Lenin. you are forgetting that Communism is not so much socialism as totalitarianism, as pointed by Hannah Arendt.

LOTM
Social Democratic Party of Apolyton

	15-02-2002 10:52									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Saint Marcus The French, Britons and Germans used to gas eachother as well. And the Americans nuked two Japanese cities. Why is that less bad than what Iraq does?

er, perhaps because there was no international law regarding such things at the time? But i forget, international law is to be appealed too only when it can be used against the United States.

LOTM