19-06-2002 00:25									#31
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http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tm...in_ted_turner_2

	19-06-2002 00:26									#32
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he does sound like some people going to all those pro pal demonstrations though

actually he sounds exactly like them.

	19-06-2002 00:27									#33
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Paiktis:

We occasionally run wire copy that is analysis in nature by the more experienced and knowledgeable AP and KRT writers whose stories move over the wires. Locally, the print journalists do not express their opinion anywhere in the paper; that is reserved for the publisher, executive editor, associate editor and those folks from outside the paper who sit on the editorial board.

However, you just gave me an idea that I might propose to my boss: namely, allowing our local writers to write analysis pieces on relevant issues, should they be interested.

Gatekeeper

	19-06-2002 00:28									#34
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quote: An Israeli government spokesman quoted by the newspaper said Turner's remarks were "stupid."

Helluva rebuttal there, smart guy.


Stop the presses, I agree with Paiktis on something:

quote: besides the laughing stock of the world remains Fox News

Fox is horrid. The others are merely bad.

-Arrian

	19-06-2002 00:29									#35
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Paiktis:

The article is a lot more expansive than what CNN itself said in its 15-second piece on Turner's comments. See, it pays to read about stuff rather than gathering snatches of it from the little time that TV news gives to it. Maybe it's just me, but CNN made it sound like Turner was blaming Israel part and parcel for terrorism. The news article indicates otherwise to a degree.

Gatekeeper

	19-06-2002 00:32									#36
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Gatekeeper,

we must have the full interview (as well as a verification of it by turner) to be 100% sure, but yes from the AP brief it seems he is accusing both sides.

I think what sticks out is that he accused Israel of terrorism

	19-06-2002 00:36									#37
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the interview in guardian is here

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Archive/A...4435748,00.html


but this is the electronic copy of it so it may not be the full article.

(tricks to make you buy the printed copy )

	19-06-2002 00:37									#38
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 Gatekeeper, we must have the full interview (as well as a verification of it by turner) to be 100% sure, but yes from the AP brief it seems he is accusing both sides. I think what sticks out is that he accused Israel of terrorism

Of course Israel is conducting terrorism. The only difference is that isreal has the bigger stick and its a master of propaganda. Every time the the pals commit a act its all over the news, everytime israel does something they never show pictures.. I am betting we don't even hear 99% of whats going on.

	19-06-2002 00:38									#39
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yawn. This maybe even not his real opinion, relax. AOLTimeWarner has some muslims as shareholders. If jews can pressure , they can as well.

	19-06-2002 00:39									#40
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People let their emotions decide their actions far too much. When Turner attempts to place blame on both sides, i.e., being fair and equal, he is criticized and called pro-Palestinian.

When he voices an opinion concerning the World Trade Center attacks other than, "The terrorists are evil and think we suck," he is criticized.

People must see reason.

I don't think the Israelis are terrorists, but they are most certainly to blame (at least in part) for this little situation they're in right now.

	19-06-2002 00:40									#41
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marcusf
but as gatekeeper already said it is not our place to epxress opinions or to speculate but to report.

but just let me be the devil's advocate here for a bit (yes eli,siro and dal I'm going to defend Israel )

the allegded propaganda machine of Israel could well be a hoax. and could well be in infantile state compared to the arab one.

after all arabs hold 60% of the world's wealth, can you imagine what sort of a lobby that much wealth can produce?

just playing a bit of a devil's advocate

	19-06-2002 00:44									#42
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 marcusf but as gatekeeper already said it is not our place to epxress opinions or to speculate but to report. but just let me be the devil's advocate here for a bit (yes eli,siro and dal I'm going to defend Israel ) the allegded propaganda machine of Israel could well be a hoax. and could well be in infantile state compared to the arab one. after all arabs hold 60% of the world's wealth, can you imagine what sort of a lobby that much wealth can produce? just playing a bit of a devil's advocate

uhm the USA holds 60% of the worlds wealth, Speculated reserves in oil etc etc don't mean a damn. The only thing that means something is stock & cash holdings.

I think you'd have your answer if you looked into "what makes a bomber" Why is it that only in the middle east people are willing to line up to blow themselves up?

	19-06-2002 00:45									#43
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after al, in which country of the world are people being blown up almost in a daily basis and the rest of the world, to a large extend, has the tendency to consider it "normal" or "justified"?

what has created this sort of "special" approach towards Israel's plight?

	19-06-2002 00:46									#44
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stock holdings mean something?

that's new...

before or after a stock market bubble bursts?

	19-06-2002 00:47									#45
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Paiktis:

My own employer often just publishes the ledes and maybe a few grafs after that of local stories that we post to our Web site ... to tease the readers into buying our paper and getting the whole story. Wire stories appear in their entirety, though. No teasing with those, 'cause it isn't produced by our local staff.

Gatekeeper

	19-06-2002 00:50									#46
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 after al, in which country of the world are people being blown up almost in a daily basis and the rest of the world, to a large extend, has the tendency to consider it "normal" or "justified"? what has created this sort of "special" approach towards Israel's plight?

I am saying look at the source, what others think doesn't mean a damn. Isreal will do whatever they want till the USA takes away the money. Its simple to see what has created this "special approach" people are sheep and they will believe what they are told. If you spit out the same old propaganda over 50 years people will believe it. How come cuba is so evil, and china is the USA's best friend? Haven't you noticed whats "evil" "justified" "terrorism" etc etc changes from month to month.

	19-06-2002 00:51									#47
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Gatekeeper,

yup most greek papers do the same thing also.
i can propably get the full interview from private sites but it not for public scrunity. (= i dont have the right to forward it to public sites).

is this what wire stories mean in english?

	19-06-2002 00:55									#48
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 stock holdings mean something? that's new... before or after a stock market bubble bursts?

I can't believe what you just wrote.. Stock holdings are the only thing in this world that mean anything (even more then cash).. No point in saying anything else, unless you read up on world the world of economics banking etc etc.

	19-06-2002 00:58									#49
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the only think that means something in this world is gold and that can get blurry quickly too

actually i find it hard to believe what you say!

that stock holdings are solid. it is one of the most volatile values there are (many of them - blue chips excluded blah,blah,blah).

what about property, industrial base etc?

or, INDEED, oil production!

woudln't you say these constitute a more solid value than stocks?

	19-06-2002 00:59									#50
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Paiktis:

Yes. A number of stories have an embargo on them, which means journalists can peruse them and, I imagine, let the authors know of any errors or questions, but we cannot put the articles in a public-accessible area until the embargo expires. Journalism practices often ignore national borders ... what's done in America is done in Greece and vice-versa.

That said, I have to "book" off to work.

Gatekeeper

	19-06-2002 01:02									#51
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Gatekeeper,
ok! have a productive work!

I just finished. (hence the luxury of time)

The difference of time zones

	19-06-2002 01:07									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Victor Galis (Including a Romanian newspaper whose name translates into The Truth).

Then it has got to be true. Can you post a link?

	19-06-2002 01:10									#53
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara Israel does committ terrorism. This makes CNN lose it's credibility to you?

So George W. Bush is a communist?

CNN is a liberal hardliner source... for a more conservative news station check out Fox... or if you want one off the internet these are the ones I suggest:

http://www.townhall.com
http://www.enterstageright.com

	19-06-2002 01:19									#54
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Fez, the only standard by which CNN is liberal hardliner is by right-wing nut job standard. So I guess that applies to you.

Under American political standards it is center with a twinge of left. By World standards, it's probably right-of-center

	19-06-2002 01:23									#55
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quote: Originally posted by paiktis22 the only think that means something in this world is gold and that can get blurry quickly too actually i find it hard to believe what you say! that stock holdings are solid. it is one of the most volatile values there are (many of them - blue chips excluded blah,blah,blah). what about property, industrial base etc? or, INDEED, oil production! woudln't you say these constitute a more solid value than stocks?

No, its all about expressing power, stocks allow you to express power. Stuff like propertiy is in the hands of individuals that can't really do much with them.. Oil, industrial base etc those are all owned by people who own shares in the companys. Oil production is governed by OPEC, they are basically expressing their power to raise oil from a $1.00 a barrell to $30.00. But even the arabs can't control the oil markets that much anymore because of russia...

	19-06-2002 01:27									#56
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even a company which is not listed has value and actually that value can be determined without the need of stock listing. (as in a takeover of said company).

OPEC controls production only to a point yes.

russia has come to the game lately and its impatc is not yet fullfleged.
(and there are shortcomings there too)
OPEC retains a crucial role.

and actually it is this power of OPEC that tha arabs are using as a "weapon" of sorts to serve their interests sometime.

i think you would agree with me when i say that oil production and the control of it can be (and is) a far more potent "weapon" that say 50 mil shares of new ecnomy companies and has a much more solid value.

	19-06-2002 01:28									#57
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quote: Originally posted by Boris Godunov Fez, the only standard by which CNN is liberal hardliner is by right-wing nut job standard. So I guess that applies to you.

I am not American so I wouldn't know. Guess you want to classify me as a Nazi because I disagree with you already... gee go ahead... you will get nothing out of me. I will classify you as a Stalinist then.

quote: Under American political standards it is center with a twinge of left. By World standards, it's probably right-of-center

CNN is NOT right of center.

I need a cup of coffee this is too much to bear... oh the lies...

Alright... alright... I will tell you what I truely rely on political news for... http://www.pp.es - Strictly my country though!

	19-06-2002 01:32									#58
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Left, Right and Center kinda depend on your perspective, wouldn't you agree, Fez? And I think Boris is merely pointing out that Europe's political center of gravity is well left of the US's. This does not apply to you, clealry.

-Arrian

	19-06-2002 01:36									#59
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"CNN Just Lost All of Its Credibility"

What credibility was that? They have almost as much credibility as NPR (National Pathetic Radio). Someone said on this thread to search the news wires and other sources for news. I could not agree more. It is too bad that we have to go to the BBC for our news in this country to even come close to an even handed approach to the raw news.

	19-06-2002 01:38									#60
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Arrian, not just Europe--Canada, Mexico, much of Central and South America, and a good deal of Asia are left of the U.S. The only places more right seem to be Islamic countries and Third-world African despots.

Shouldn't that tell you something, Fez? And since I didn't call you a Nazi (you like to make up arguments, don't you?), I hope to not see any accusations of being a Stalinist.

I'd also have that narcolepsy checked out if I were you. Replacing intelligent discourse with the smiley wears thin quickly.