24-06-2002 06:46									#31
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My mom's father was an artillery officer...or perhaps artillery communications officer, I forget which. Anyway, he came in the 2nd wave of the Normandy Invasion and was there during the Battle of the Bulge. The only specific stories I can remember were him aren't too exciting. He told us that his unit would actually be happy to come across a group of German prisoners, as they tended to be rather fun to shoot the sh*t with. A lot of them were familiar with American movies.

Another story was that my grandfather was in a French village freshly liberated from the Germans (like, just that morning, or something), and he was asking one of the French townspeople, a man who was acting as spokesman I suppose, to help get some supplies for his men and set up sleeping arrangements. The French guy absolutely refused to help, started cussing out my grnadfather and told him and his men to get out, they wanted nothing to so with soldiers at all. Well, my grandfather snapped and started beating the holy crap out of this guy. Three of his men had to pull him off. My grandfather is one of the most mild-mannered, kind and intellectual men I know, so this story was kind of a shock to us!

The only other thing he mentioned that I remember is his being happy to sail back to the US on the Queen Mary.

My dad's father did not serve in WWII, as he had a congenital heart condition that eventually killed him in 1954. My dad's stepfather, whom now I consider my grandfather, served as an infantry man in Europe. I can't recall specific stories, but whenever he and my mom's father are together, the only thing they talk about is the war. It certainly left its mark on their generation.

	24-06-2002 07:12									#32
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quote: Originally posted by markusf Who knows what really happened there is soo much propaganda..

*sniff* do I smell...holocaust denial? You should be ashamed of yourself.

-------

My grandparents were luckily all in North America; my mother's father had flat feet and thus couldn't fight; my father's father was exempt because he was a rabbi I think.

The village of Dorbyan, Lithuania was home to 3 of my 8 great-grandparents; it was burnt to the ground by the Nazis in 1944.

	24-06-2002 07:22									#33
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6 of my kin went to the war:

My great uncle was on board a British destroyer in North Sea.

Another great uncle was attached to Communications with the 8th British Army in North Africa.

Two cousins of my grandmother were on Sword and Utah, one as a tanker and the other as a GI.

Another cousin flew with the USAAF over Europe as well as a fighter pilot.

	24-06-2002 07:35									#34
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And if we're going with homefront stories here we are:

My grandmother knitted balaclavas and socks to send to the soldiers which she sent through the British embassy in Buenos Aires.

She also used to tell me about how polarised the society here was, the southern suburbs were inhabited by a lot of Anglos at the time and she'd see a lot of people wearing little Union Jack's and pins on their lapels. In town, she used to see a lot of people wearing swastikas and armbands over their overcoats, particularly in the train station. The different 'sides' would often refuse to share train coaches and you'd have all 'pro-allied' or 'pro-nazi' coaches. On the platform they'd just give each other dirty looks fortunately.

	24-06-2002 07:46									#35
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Wow! Sounds like a prelude to the conflict between you and Gia.

	24-06-2002 07:56									#36
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*stares at GP*

Who? Me?

	24-06-2002 07:59									#37
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Yes, I heard that you and he were not riding the same trains.

	24-06-2002 08:05									#38
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my one grandfather was stationed in Texas, Airforce.

The other was already in the airforce, stationed in Alaska...

neither saw combat action, both were married to their sweethearts on the base 'just incase' they would be shipped out. Thankfully that didn't happen.

	24-06-2002 08:08									#39
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I could whip out a wonderful witticism to that remark GP, but this is a nice thread I don't want to derail with Gia-pet cussing and bantering.

	24-06-2002 08:11									#40
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Rats. My evil plan is foiled. Harumph!

	24-06-2002 08:33									#42
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World War II caused a lot of problems in my family because some of the men were in protected industries and others had to go and fight. The ones who stayed at home did better financially and in terms of their long term health but missed out on all the glory and privileges of war veterans. They felt they played their part but the war vets saw it differently so that niggled away.

Also, on one side of my family half the brothers, 3 of 6, were Stalinist communists whilst the other half went off to fight. The Communists opposed the war and did their best to sabotage the war effort through strikes until Hitler invaded Russia. There were always arguments after the war about all that and they couldn't even go to a funeral fifty years later without the bitter argument starting again. The richest men of that generation of my family ended up being the communists.

The ones who fought were mainly in New Guinea and the Island campaigns. We had family in the army, navy and air force. My Grandfater brought back a captured samurai sword and a lot other Jap gear including a defused grenade.

	24-06-2002 08:39									#43
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quote: Originally posted by markusf But whats even more distrubing is the russians and the chineese killed 30 million of thier own people during peace time and the rest of the world didn't do a damn thing.

Yes, but over a much longer period of time. No one matched the Nazis for sheer speed of slaughter.

	24-06-2002 08:40									#44
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My father was a corporal in the Army ... servd in Italy and moved to Southern France and then eventually Germany.

He had always wondered if he had ever killed any of his relatives. My Dad is of total German descent His father... my grandpa.... seved in the German Army during WWI.

Grandpa, on my moms side served in the English army during WWI.

As far as other relatives in WWII.... 4 uncles, and my father in law. He just passed away this past December.

Actually the only living relatives left , thet served in WWII are my Dad and my one uncle.

And they don't like to talk very much about it. My dad came close to being killed too many times for comfort.

Glad he made it. :-O

	24-06-2002 08:50									#45
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I think one way you know people were in some serious fighting is if they won't talk about it. A lot of my relatives are like that - the Japanese were a viscious enemy.

	24-06-2002 09:04									#46
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hmm

my grandparents were too young to serve in WW2

and I haven't spoken much (or been arround) with my great-grandparents

Jon Miller

	24-06-2002 09:52									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Dr Strangelove Yes, but over a much longer period of time. No one matched the Nazis for sheer speed of slaughter.

I think you'd better brush up on your history, the soviets killed more of their own people in ww2 then the total number of people that died in ww2, in the 1930's they killed 10's of millions. A simple google search will give you more detailed stats.


But anyways I don't think you understand my point. What the nazi's did wasn't out of the ordinary for the times. The problem is the whole thing was just used as a justification for the war against germany AFTER the war. Why didn't anyone step in to stop russia, china etc when they conducted the purges? Do you honestly believe that if china where to conduct another purge today that the US or any other nation would lift a finger to stop it?

	24-06-2002 10:35									#48
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Its really hard to pick between the Nazis and the Soviets as to which were the most evil but I think Hitler's racism probably shades Stalin's paranoia.

	24-06-2002 10:42									#49
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Grandfather on my father's side was on an airplane carrier in the pacific. Nearly went overboard when it got hit by a kamikaze. And I believe my grandfather on my mother's side did something that was somehow related to the Manhattan Project.

	24-06-2002 11:09									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Alexander's Horse Its really hard to pick between the Nazis and the Soviets as to which were the most evil but I think Hitler's racism probably shades Stalin's paranoia.

I am not saying whose more evil. I am saying this thing happened all the time and still does to this day. The british invented concentration camps and organized murder in the 1800's and the chineese in the 60s murdered millions. The usa gave infected blankets to the indians. The spanish in south america etc etc etc.

	24-06-2002 11:41									#51
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Here is my family's military muster:

Josius Brown: Private, George Washington's Army. Revolutionary War. Served in Capt. Peebles company, under Col. James Dunlap Shippenborg.

John Dailey Brown: GAR. Corp., Company "A" of the 116th Ohio Infantry. Fought at 2nd Battle of the Wilderness, Look-out Mountain, Gettysburg and captured at Andersonville.

Lt. John Bassett Arringdale: GAR. 5th USCHA (does this mean Horse or Heavy Artillery? I'd like to know). Wounded during the siege of Vicksburg.

George Givens: Phillipines Spanish American War.

Clifford Bowen: Phillipines Spanish American War.

George Arringdale: France, WWI.

James Wallace Arringdale, WW1, USS Pochahontas.

My biological maternal grandfather (James Wallace Curtis) was a radioman on bombers in WW2.

His brother (grand-uncle) Robert Bruce Curtis was US Army in WW2.

My adoptive maternal grandfather (Joseph Patrick Cleary) was a surgeon stationed in Alaska and treated burn victims there.

Earl Russell Moody: 31 yr. USN career; WWII (USN sub S-32) Korea, Vietnam.

John Bertram Arringdale: USS Pensylvania during kamikaze attacks.

Allan Richard Chadwell: US Army Corps of Engineers, France.

James Clifford Bentley: Artillery Unit, South Pacific.

George Richard Bentley: Clerk typist for Gen. Omar Bradley.

Dale Mielke: served on the USS Parche in WW2.
(Skipper received CMOH for Japanese tonnage sunk on war patrols.)

Loren Dailey Brown- Served in India. Mustered out of US Army as a Colonel.

John Dwight Brown (Loren's brother) USN Lt. in Navy Supply Corps.

James Edwin Brown: US Army, South Pacific

Orrin Geymen: WWII USN, South Pacific.

Stanley Grover Smith: WWII, Army Air Corps.

Allan James Arringdale: WWII, US Army Air Force.

Raymond Eugene Bentley: US Army, Career, Germany, Korea, Vietnam.

Wallace John Arringdale: Surgeon, US Army, Vietnam, Pentagon.

James Michael Smith: Nuclear Subs, one hitch.

Alan Lee Mortinson: USN, one hitch.

William Richard Morrison: USN, one hitch.

Bruce Edward Jurgenson: USN, one hitch.

********
Lot of Navy men in there...I feel like Lt. Dan Taylor...never been in the service...but should have died there!

Any insights into family names/military service that pertains/company badges, insignia, etc. is greatly appreciated...I am getting into the family geneaology a lot these days...Of special interest currently is finding out which Scottish clan tartan applies.

	24-06-2002 11:59									#52
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My father's father lost two brothers in WW I and therefore didn't serve. Anyway, as he was 51 in 1939, he would have drafted only for the Volkssturm where Nazi drafted all men between 14 and 60 years old. Perhaps he also wasn't seen as really reliable. My father just was too young for the Volkssturm (becoming 13 in 1945).
In 1943, when our house in Cologne was bombed to ruins, he had the luck/knowledge (he never said anything, perhaps forbiddenly listening to a british broadcast?) to insist to go to relatives in the near countryside. After that, the family was somewhere, spending some time in Alsace, some other with the relatives near Cologne. (That's also the whereabout of his wife and my father).

My mother's father (He was born 1910 in Lothringen and always felt German, thus he felt his home country stolen by France, consequently being a supporter of Hitler. Until after the war he learned of the holocaust. His wife was not very political). He left Lorraine in order to avoid military servide (consequently France treated him as a traitor of his fatherland). In WW II he served for three days in an artillery regiment where he got serious cardial problems after lifting too heavy boxes with a wrong technique. (Fortunately he lived sufficiently long for me to know him.) After that he joined his family for a while and he worked as a lawyer mainly in Straßburg (nowadays known as Strasbourg). Towards the end of the war, he and his family got separated. I don't know exactly where he worked, my grandmother and my mother/aunts and new-born uncle were in some village in Thüringen (north of the Czech Republic).

quote: I think you'd better brush up on your history, the soviets killed more of their own people in ww2 then the total number of people that died in ww2, in the 1930's they killed 10's of millions. A simple google search will give you more detailed stats.

AFAIK, WW II costed about 54 million lives (not counting holocaust and stalinism). 6 million Germans died from the war, the holocaust killed 7-8 million people, 6 million of them Jews. 13 million Russians died from the war and about the same number from Stalin's prosecutions.

I don't really want to know who of Stalin or Hitler was the worse. Simply because it may be used to whitewash the other. The differences are that Hitler was more predictable in who he was going to threaten. And Stalin knew he was a criminal, Hitler probably thought he was doing the best for humanity (no much differences for the result, though).

	24-06-2002 14:36									#53
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My Hungarian grandfather was a solider in the German army. The reason he was in the German army was because they wanted liaison officers and he spoke both German and Hungarian. He was captured in Stalingrad when the Germans surrendered. They sent him off to the gulag for until Stalin died. Then he went home to Hungary and took part in the 56 revolution against the Russians. My Granddad never did seem to be able to get on with the Russians.

My other grandfather was Irish, so he wasn’t involved in the War. Given that Ireland never got involved.

	24-06-2002 15:25									#54
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croatian side of my family was mostly killed by croatian collaborationists
serbian side - grandfather helped communist resistance movement and was taken to mauthausen camp. he survived 3 yrs and got back with 32kgs
uncle joined communist resistance when he was 17, in 1944.
i almost forgot, grandfather's brother was shot by germans. they also killed his son, for supporting resistance
so, they were all on the right side...and some of them paid dearly...

	24-06-2002 15:30									#55
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quote: Originally posted by markusf I think you'd better brush up on your history, the soviets killed more of their own people in ww2 then the total number of people that died in ww2, in the 1930's they killed 10's of millions. A simple google search will give you more detailed stats. But anyways I don't think you understand my point. What the nazi's did wasn't out of the ordinary for the times. The problem is the whole thing was just used as a justification for the war against germany AFTER the war. Why didn't anyone step in to stop russia, china etc when they conducted the purges? Do you honestly believe that if china where to conduct another purge today that the US or any other nation would lift a finger to stop it?

i reckon you have
a) problem with numbers. a simple google search will also give you a lot of data on area 51, little green men, etc. had russians killed so many people in the 30s,there would be no one to fight the germans. simply compare censi and adjust for population growth rate.
b) because germany decided to purge other countries too.

	24-06-2002 16:04									#56
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Maternal Grandfather: Fought at Gallipoli and in Mesapotamia in WW1 (on the British side).

My father was too young (just) to take part in WW2.

A great-uncle and aunt were interned by the Japanese when Singapore surrendered.

One cousin of my mother's was a Lancaster pilot (KIA), another was an SOE agent (captured and imprisoned in Colditz as a 'special') His wife-to-be was captured at the same time and sent to Ravensbruck. She gave evidence at the Nuremberg trials after the war.

Last edited by redbaron on 24-06-2002 at 16:31

	24-06-2002 16:53									#57
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My grand father was a resistant. He was arrested (16th jully, 1944) with local resistant leaders few days before by father born. He was enjailed in Marseille.

We have few information then. Maybe he escaped from jail with anoher guy and joined resistance mouvment near Marseille (he stole a german truck a fleed away). Or maybe is was free by Allied soldiers.

Then when Allied land off in Provence, he joined the army and was killed few days later (End of august 1944).

His brother was tortured by german. He still alive but has serious psycological problems.

On of my grand-aunt was killed by an Italian Pilot, while she was keeping sheeps (she was less then 12 year old). Maybe the guy was bored, and played to shoot on sheeps....

	24-06-2002 18:16									#58
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My father was in the navy. He was a part of the Normandy invasion and he also served in the Pacific. He joined the Army at first but they booted him out when they found out he lied about his age. He is still alive and in good health.

	24-06-2002 18:26									#59
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Dad was in the U.S. Navy. Onboard first ship that arrived at Tokyo Bay.

	24-06-2002 18:42									#60
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One grandfather was taken from the village by the Italians in 1942 (he wasn't even a soldier, but was trying to run his own business at the time) he was taken to the concentracion camp a week until they got there on cattle train full of people without food like in Schindlers List , where he spent 9-8 months and when allies invaded Italy there was a riot in the camp and he and four of his friends (who wevre taken form the same village) escaped and walked back home on foot with some local Italians helping them and feeding them along the way. All four of them survived and got home.

There is more.. actrually they were kept in the village for three days without food at first threathend to be shot if they try anything and than they were transported. When they were on the train my granfater was on the window and after two or three days on there a passenger train stopped along them and the restauraunt was on the other side and my grandfather made a motion to some german on the window there to give him something and the German gave him half a loaf of bread. My grandfather always cried when he was telling the story... even when he was past 80...

The other grandfather was a partisan fighting the germans and he actually got caught too... before getting caught he spent a night in the moiuntain alone running away after some skirminshh or so,... and got all grey hair in that night (at least what he said) and wh was kept there but got out of prison when germans left...

scary... we don't have a clue how good we are living. One great uncle died in WW1 on Russian fron fighting for Austro - Hungary as he had to, we were on that side. And another one was a partisan in WWII and than after the war imprisoned for 5 years by the new lovely communists that he was fighting with because he was religious ...

Here you go lovley communist ideals...