23-08-2002 00:52									#31
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

I must say I'm afraid that Germany might culture-flip it. However, II is just too close to Norwick and would be a bad choice if we are to ally with Greece against England later. IMHO site 1 will give us an easier-to-defend front. We should send a few swordsmen there as soon as possible as well as garrison it with two or three pikemen once we have Feudalism.
(I hope I'm not repeating somebody else's suggestions. If so, I apologize)

	23-08-2002 00:53									#32
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber Panag, I see you still don't understand the idea of the settler hop. This is basically how this will work: Galley A is an empty galley. Galley B is loaded with a settler. Both begin in the coastal tile SouthEast of Apolyton. Phase 1: Galley A travels two tiles SE and ends the turn with a 50% chance of sinking. Phase 2: If galley A sinks we will build a new galley, probably in Apolyton, and then try again. Otherwise, Galley B will travel one tile SE. The settler on galley B will move to galley A (one tile SE). Galley B will return to shore and end its turn safely while galley A, now carrying the settler will move 3 tiles SE and also end the turn safely. This is the best possible plan. The only risk involved is a 50% chance that an empy galley would sink (not two galleys Panag, just one), while your plan (just send a galley with a settler) has a bigger risk: a 50% chance that both a galley and a settler would sink. If you have a better idea please suggest it instead of making general and vague statements.

hi ,

Shiber , one can see that you go true great lenghts to explain certain things , now maybe those people allready have experience with that , ...

and there is no need to try to "explain" everything to the same couple of persons over and over and over again , ....

as for the plan in your own words "its just a suggestion"

if you have better ideas why dont YOU run for every post there is and get all the jobs , so that you can control the whole game , only the way YOU see it , ....

we are a democrazy form of state ( ) , in where everyone , again in your own words can post his and her ideas , ....there is again no need to always take a couple people and break down their views and ideas , ...
those people dont do it with you , so please dont do it to others , ....

now , if you really want to find out how many tiles and moves there are ,

> make a map that is the same of the area in Q , (in the editor) , place the units and play the moves , ....

you shall find that its nearly impossible to tell when and when not a ship shall sink , .....

have a nice day

	23-08-2002 01:30									#33
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Heh.
Panag, I was pointing out your mistakes and the superiority of the current plan over your suggestion. I was debating, not enforcing. Isn't debating what you do in a democracy after all?
As for repeating the plan, I was repeating it for you (only because you obviously don't bother to read threads, you just read the last two posts and write something vague). I wasn't suggesting it over again and trying to claim the credit as you were implying.
As for the rest of your post, I'm afraid I cannot relate to it because I simply didn't understand most of what you were trying to say. Most of your sentences don't connect and you use Hebrew grammer and Hebrew forms of speech too much and it gets confusing. Putting sarcasm aside, you should really try to improve your English. I mean it.

	23-08-2002 01:33									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber Heh. Panag, I was pointing out your mistakes and the superiority of the current plan over your suggestion. I was debating, not enforcing. Isn't debating what you do in a democracy after all? As for repeating the plan, I was repeating it for you (only because you obviously don't bother to read threads, you just read the last two posts and write something vague). I wasn't suggesting it over again and trying to claim the credit as you were implying. As for the rest of your post, I'm afraid I cannot relate to it because I simply didn't understand most of what you were trying to say. Most of your sentences don't connect and you use Hebrew grammer and Hebrew forms of speech too much and it gets confusing. Putting sarcasm aside, you should really try to improve your English. I mean it.

	23-08-2002 01:38									#35
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber Heh. Panag, I was pointing out your mistakes and the superiority of the current plan over your suggestion. I was debating, not enforcing. Isn't debating what you do in a democracy after all? As for repeating the plan, I was repeating it for you (only because you obviously don't bother to read threads, you just read the last two posts and write something vague). I wasn't suggesting it over again and trying to claim the credit as you were implying. As for the rest of your post, I'm afraid I cannot relate to it because I simply didn't understand most of what you were trying to say. Most of your sentences don't connect and you use Hebrew grammer and Hebrew forms of speech too much and it gets confusing. Putting sarcasm aside, you should really try to improve your English. I mean it.

hi ,

stop it , drop it and stay on topic , please

have a nice night

	23-08-2002 01:40									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Vlad Antlerkov ...and of course, it helps if I attach the damn thing... Apologies for the low quality, but you get the idea.

hi ,

quality is okay Vlad

the pic is a real help

site one seems the most logical one

have a nice day

	23-08-2002 01:44									#37
	Full PM-box? Change here!

site 1 defn. is better

	23-08-2002 23:31									#38
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I LOVE the idea of the city at the inland sea. Lets separate England and Germany. Buying a temple in that city would be worthwhile as well.

	23-08-2002 23:39									#39
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Kickbooti I LOVE the idea of the city at the inland sea. Lets separate England and Germany. Buying a temple in that city would be worthwhile as well.

hi ,

first a temple , then a courthouse , a lib , a barracks , ...

yeah , it can be a strategic town after a while , ...

have a nice day

	23-08-2002 23:59									#40
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Yeah, a temple in that city is imperative. In addition to making it somewhat more difficult to flip, it'd push against Norwich's borders, eventually allowing us to flip Norwich over to our side.

The first cultural expansion would put Norwich right on our border, so if we wished to take it by force, we could. We'd get it by the second expansion of the borders there (and probably the iron next to Hamburg, too).

How soon will we get around to building a temple in Napoleton, out of curiosity?

	24-08-2002 00:12									#41
	Increase Your PM Length

No, barracks should come before the courthouse. The city will be horribly corrupted and a courthouse would take 80 turns. We need the barracks as soon as possible to help defend against attacks.

	24-08-2002 00:30									#42
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

AFAIK the temple was supposed to be pop-rushed the previous turn. I don't know what happened. Perhaps the city planner prefers to build up population in Napoleton.
Btw, I love your new avatar.

	25-08-2002 18:57									#43
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

hi ,

what ever we are going to build there , a temple would be good , in the mean time the city shall grow , ...

but with the help of some workers it shall grow faster , that is what we need

the courthouse , well it helps fight corruption , so we loose less shields , ...

have a nice day

	25-08-2002 21:48									#44
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I prefer the site where the settler is going (II) mainly because we will get a larger radius and it is less likely to get flipped, Norwich is only a size one city, so if we build a few cultural improvments we will get the upper hand or we may even flip it, in that case we could simply disband it, get some workers and then our city will have more room to grow, wheras, at the other site, Berlin is closer and it will be harder to flip Norwich from that position. If we do go to war with England we wil be closer for our preliminary attack and they will have less time to respond, we could hide our units in the cities (does the AI see how may units there are, even if they are in cities? Or do they react at all to the amount of units on their borders?). I believe that site II would be best, I could put it to a poll if you want, but only if there is sufficient interest!

	25-08-2002 21:54									#45
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Uhh... I guess now we'll have to cancel this plan. The only way to assure the safely of this town is to send two veteran spearmen along with the settler, and we just can't spare a single unit right now.

	25-08-2002 22:38									#46
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There is no choice now, site I is now under stuttgart borders.

	25-08-2002 22:42									#47
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Will: so are we going to site 1 or not?
I sure do hope not because I have no idea how we're going to defend that site, now that we need every spearman we can produce.

	25-08-2002 23:20									#48
	Put an end to popups!

hi ,

why dont we pull back the settler for now , ....

the two spear man on a mountain could stop and see the invaders who come that way

have a nice day

	26-08-2002 04:00									#49
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Now, this is a tricky situation, I will look at the save and report back tommorow, however, it depends on how commited the SMC is on the war on France, and if we are able to support the city, if not I suggest that we use the galleys to get to uber isle.

	26-08-2002 04:19									#50
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quote: Originally posted by Shiber Heh. Panag, I was pointing out your mistakes and the superiority of the current plan over your suggestion. I was debating, not enforcing. Isn't debating what you do in a democracy after all? As for repeating the plan, I was repeating it for you (only because you obviously don't bother to read threads, you just read the last two posts and write something vague). I wasn't suggesting it over again and trying to claim the credit as you were implying. As for the rest of your post, I'm afraid I cannot relate to it because I simply didn't understand most of what you were trying to say. Most of your sentences don't connect and you use Hebrew grammer and Hebrew forms of speech too much and it gets confusing. Putting sarcasm aside, you should really try to improve your English. I mean it.

I am sorry Shiber, but a personal attack is not part of a democracy, if you wanted to complain at Pang's English then you could have offered suggestions, or if you wanted to criticise or ask for clarification you should have sent a PM.
Winston Churchill did make a personal attack in the House of Commons when he was drunk in the following dialogue:

MP: "Winston Churchill, you are horribly drunk!"
Winston: "Yes, but at least in the morning I will be sober but you will still be ugly"

Although this is quite amusing, this is not a way to run a democracy, there should at least be an apology . (Anyway, I understood most, if not all, of Pang's post)

	26-08-2002 15:13									#51
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hi ,

Will 5001 , thanks , the problem is "solved" , lets hope it stays that way (!)

now , back to topic ;

if we look at the picture very good we can see mountains and hills , the city has to be near the water that is for sure , ...now , since we are at war with germany we could even settle inside thier land , .....

so we could even have more options , ....

the best would be to place the city at site 1 , for more details look at Aro's picture

for now we should wait with the settler , move the units forward or let them stay with the settler , ....

we should just wait on the next moves from germany in that area , ....

one thing that we may not forget is that because of the level we are the AI has extra starting units , and some of those shall be still around , .....

the two units (spearman) should stay on high ground , even if the germans try to break true near there we shall have plenty of time to react in that corner , ...

why , well we just use the terrain to our advantage , .... (!)

have a nice day

	26-08-2002 15:28									#52
	Increase Your PM Length

Settling in sites 1 or 2 are bad ideas.
How do you suppose we can protect it? We're already occupied in 3 fronts.

	26-08-2002 15:39									#53
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In response to Will 5001:
I sent him a few PMs and he responded sarcastically and then called me a troll.
It appears that Panag is not familiar with the basics of proper debate. I once explained to him why we can't switch to Republic yet because of the upkeep and he said that I want to enforce my opinion over his and control the game and said something sarcastic like "why don't you run in all the elections and control the game yourself?".
I'm afraid I don't see any proper reason in Panag's actions, nor do I want to continue to spam other people's threads with our arguments, which seem to be going in circles anyway. Therefore I ask of Panag not to reply to this post (if he wants to do so) on this thread but with a PM.
Thank you.

Last edited by Shiber on 26-08-2002 at 15:51

	26-08-2002 15:49									#54
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Shiber I sent him a few PMs and he responded sarcastically and then called me a troll. I once explained to him why we can't switch to Republic yet because of the upkeep and said that I want to enforce my opinion over his and control the game and said something sarcastic like "why don't you run in all the elections and control the game yourself?". If this is the kind of response that Panag gives to people who show their disagreement with his suggestions then he is obviously not familiar with the basics of proper debate. I'm afraid I don't see any proper reason in Panag's actions, nor do I want to continue to spam other people's threads with our arguments. Therefore I ask of Panag not to reply to this post, if he wants to do so, on this thread but with a PM. Thank you.

hi ,

you just cant stop it can you , ......

do the words 'the problem is solved' and lets hope it stays that way mean anything at all , ......

only a couple lines above your post , .....

now , drop it stop it and keep it that way , ....

and that goes for the others to !

stay on topic

now , since you start to post again , you want not a repley in the thread but with pm , ....yet you can post in thread , ....very funny , .....

and there is one think you can respect , what is in a PM goes never in a thread , ....

now , you know the thruth as you are the one who start to make fun out of other people , ...and not alone 'panag' , ....

now , it was all forgotten and put in the past , but dont start again , ....

you can use pm or go to the OT , but stop this flaming , both in this thread and in each other thread

have a nice day

	26-08-2002 15:56									#55
	Got spare money?

Okay, whatever. I honestly don't care what the "outcome" of this so-called flame war is as long as it stops (you can say I'm suffering from "war weariness", lol).
If it helps:
Let it be known throughout the jungle-ridden land of Apolytonia that Panag and Shiber have signed a truce. Let it be known that Shiber will never again reply to Panag's post or criticize his ideas in order not to trigger a response from Panag.

Thank you.

	26-08-2002 16:29									#56
	Tired of ads?

quote: Originally posted by Shiber Okay, whatever. I honestly don't care what the "outcome" of this so-called flame war is as long as it stops (you can say I'm suffering from "war weariness", lol). If it helps: Let it be known throughout the jungle-ridden land of Apolytonia that Panag and Shiber have signed a truce. Let it be known that Shiber will never again reply to Panag's post or criticize his ideas in order not to trigger a response from Panag. Thank you.

You just could not leave it , you had to post .

Imagine when some people start to jump on your back because you make a small error in your grammar .

If you are going to start to criticize everyone on this site on how poor their english is then you are in for a long ride .
Their are people from all over the world who come to meet and talk on this site .

No where did any-one posted a post that was in any way "sarcastically" to you .

Yet you post above such a type of answer .

No where did any-one called you a troll .

Since you came to this site you have insulted and responded "sarcastically" to other poster's .

Like panag say's ; "drop it and stop it"

On a couple occasion's panag wrote that in the last couple of weeks . However you feel the need to start it again .

Why ?

As Will5001 wrote in his post a non "sarcastically" apology to the people you have insulted would be in his proper place here .

As mentioned before by panag and me there is room to express your feelings true either a Private Message or you could use the Off Topic thread to a certain extention .

One thing that is off limits on this site and it's thread's is the posting of the content of a PM .

And if you find that you are suffering from "war weariness" then you should not have started the war or continued it .

NOW END IT

	26-08-2002 19:52									#57
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Panag, I PM'ed you my cellphone number. We can talk on the phone.
I believe this would be the best way to resolve this dispute without bothering other people.
Sabra: you can have my cellphone number too if you'd like to talk. Just PM me or Panag for the number.

	26-08-2002 22:54									#58
	Suffering from ads?

It seems that both of you have lowered yourselves to petty squabbling. I hope that this can be resolved. As a native speaker of English (as can be seen from the flag!!), I am impressed at how many people can speak English well enough to participate here, in my opinion, any person who can debate in this manner using a foreign language is doing very well (I don't think I know anyone who could participate in a French or Spanish debate of this kind!!).
Now, about the game, I have asked Aggie if a city site at the site I would be feasible, if not then we will set sail for Uber Isle, Hooray!!!

	26-08-2002 23:08									#59
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Okay, let's get one fact straight: I did not criticize Panag's English the way he puts it.
I was answering a PM that Panag sent me when I came across two sentences which I simply could not understand. At the bottom of my reply to his PM I said that I couldn't make out the meaning of some of what he said and I suggested that he tries to improve his English in the future. I'm afraid Panag has blown this way out of proportion.
Panag: I apologize if my words were misleading. I hope you'll understand that I did not mean to hurt your feelings. I happen to know a great deal of people who are much smarter than me and have poor English so I don't judge people according to how good their grammar and punctuation are.
Now if you call the number I PM'ed you we could set everything straight. I'm sure it's just a big misunderstanding and that we can bridge all the gaps.

	26-08-2002 23:13									#60
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Correction: I have just reread one of the PMs I sent Panag from my sent items folder and I realized I did criticize his English in an inappropriate way. I apologize for doing so.
I must have a selective memory!