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War4ever
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I live amongst the Red Sox Nation
Jan 1970
time: 21:22
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quote:
Originally posted by Flatlander Fox
You do realize that many players know the game inside and out, know most of the cheats that exist, and can dissect the game on singular beakers and the tiniest pattern.
These things are all part of the game.
You are obviously too young to remember "playing by mail" but I do, because I used to do it before the wonderful land of the internet.
Many games that I played, required me to roll the dice, write down the result, and then smack a stamp on 'em and send them off to be adjudicated. I won a few games and lost a few playing old games that way. The people that were suspected of cheating weren't invited to play again.
There's a certain honor system here. You read the posts and see us carry on about how vile this person or that person is, but one thing you never see is us questioning each other's honor.
It doesn't happen.
I don't understand why you feel like you have one upped us in some way. I have created a few scenarios in my time, and have enjoyed playing them. I know what I am doing, and know what you have done is not playable. |
If i question someones integrity in this game, they don't play with me again, pure and simple. so people who change rules or cheat, or don't tell about free techs or whatever it is that is unscrupolous can forget about a game with me....
don't be an idiot....and dont try to hide behind your idiocy....its not working
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Nicosar
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Golden Bay, Cali
Sep 2002
time: 21:22
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I am indeed heart-felt and sorrowfully apologetically that my words have caused such scrupples, and if I knew they were stingful as such I would not have thought about even saying them in the first place, since my intent was not to accuse anybody, and certainly not anybody in particular, but to express certain intimate views of mine which felt that my rules would not be accepted, and I expected contradicting arguments long before I thought anybody would think me of accusing them, since that's how innocent was my tone when writing it.
I would not consider any of you honorless, and neither do I actually dislike any of you, even the fervently venerable Ming, even though we argue with such edge some times, but I cannot honestly exclaim after all that I love any of you whole-heartedly and that I would trust you with absolute faith!
I thought I was simply voicing my honest opinions about this and not implying anything lower, but I will try and be careful in the future, not only because it is a touchy sucject, since even if I were accused (which I was), I would try to defend myself first rather than feel insulted (which I never really was), but also I will tread more lightly because I do not want anybody to misinterpret what I said, because if you could take it from the man who wrote it, it was merely a sentiment and not an insult...
I hope that is good enough, I cannot give you a pleadingly obvious and guilty little snippet of complete repention, but I did say I was sorry, and seriously, and so I hope that meets your demands which stated those very two factors as key
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rah
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Apolyton Prince of Moderators, Master of Reason
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Lord of the Ferrets
Jan 1970
time: 23:22
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My first impressions after reading Boann's post was, she makes a good point. But then I started thinking. (yes I know all of you think that's a stretch  )
Boann said, 'he only said that he didn't trust....people he didn't know.'
I've probably hosted around a thousand games with probably close to a 100 different players. I only previously knew 3 in the real world. Everyone else, I met on-line. All of them, were through Apolyton or recommended by people here. EVERY time I played with them the first time, my assumption was, that they were honorably and wouldn't cheat. Maybe a bit naive, but it shows the regard that I have for the community here. And with just a very very few exceptions, my initial assumption was correct. This is an honorable community.
So, yes, I do have a problem when newbs show up and say they don't trust anyone they don't know. To play on-line games with relative strangers you must make that leap of faith if you want to join the community. Those that don't, don't really belong here.
But yes Boann, there's probably some truth on the other points you make about eyes and strat. But neither has ever questioned my honor. I'm also more willing to tolerate their chest thumping and sneering since they are tons more entertaining and don't take 3 pages to do it. They've been around longer too. If nicosar had been around that long, we probably would have cut him a little more slack on his honor comments and subsequent apology. But as it is, he's just been windy brat that doesn't know squat about the game, doesn't entertain me. He just questions my experience and honor.
RAH
Just this man's opinion, but I will respect your's, Boann. 
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-Jrabbit
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of the Electronic Egyptians
Feb 2002
time: 23:22
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I'm with Dr Spike. Would prefer that my pleasure reading continue... And Boann makes good points.
As far as adjudicating whether the punishment fits the crime, my take on it is that Nicosar may have gone over the line, but may be so naive that he didn't know he was doing so. The fact that he addressed the group on the topics of honor and cheating (as opposed to an individual) is the only thing unusual here. Was it an accusation? Well, I don't think it was meant as one, but the bottom line is, it was perceived as one. So the PM of Possible Doom was sent.
On the back end, Ming actually threw out a lifeline -- as he often does. Just settle down, apologize, and you're back in business. But Nicosar pulled his punches in the Abject Apology portion of the program
The judgment is Ming's to make. Caveat emptor to any poster who can't figure that out.
(...and yes, I have gone through that little dance with Ming I unwittingly crossed a 'Poly line, got the PM of Potential Death, and apologized publicly, without conditions or complaints. When a Mod says you're wrong, you're pretty much wrong. It amazes me how many people spend tons of time here yet never figure that out..)
If Nicosar's not man enough to admit he crossed the line and offer an open and sincere apology to the group as requested, well then he's made his own bed and shall lie upon it.
What's done is done, and I'll miss this thread. 
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rah
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Apolyton Prince of Moderators, Master of Reason
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Lord of the Ferrets
Jan 1970
time: 23:22
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quote:
Originally posted by boann
i don't see anything wrong with his comment and did
not take offense to it..
i never trust before playing and knowing .
and if your all honest with yourselves you will know its damn true.....
and he did apologize
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Yes and no. I'll actually will start with the assumption that they are honest. But you are correct, if something strange happens in a game with all regulars, I won't think anything of it. If someone new is in that game, I may start keeping turn by turn saves to check out later.
BUT my initial impression is to trust. And I will never accuse unless I'm 99% positive.
TRUST, but verify
As to the apology, I'm in between your's and Ming's opinion. It is an apology, just not a very good one. And for someone that seems to pride themselves for being eloquent, I think he intended it to be half hearted. I personally probably would have accepted it and not banned him, but I will support Ming's decision.
And Slow, yeah it's a bit over the top but, every arguement he previously brought up was successfully knocked down (at least in my opinion) so he kept changing to new arguements. Once he was left with an empty bag he used the honor card. How else do you do defend against that. I don't think I reacted as strong as Ming did. In review, I think I just called him a jerk.
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19-12-2002 08:34
but i think its pretty extreem for a first time offense and appearance
You pathetic bastards. 
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