26-09-2002 22:11									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Sardaukar So its the job of a university to take our large amounts of money and "re-indoctrinate" us? I spend a lot of money and should take what I think is important for me, not what some university thinks I should know that 's completely irrelevant to what im studying. It's a form of PC, liberal agenda, forced indoctrination.

The purpose of University and college is to provide you with a well rounded education that allows you to interact with the whole world, not so that you can be a narrow-minded parochial twit. If you don't want to know about anything, don't go on to higher education. If you do, take the advice of people who know a hell of a lot more than you that this stuff's important.

Hell, it's not like you don't have a zillion other mandatory classes, like art and music appreciation and science and math.

	26-09-2002 22:16									#32
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara The purpose of University and college is to provide you with a well rounded education that allows you to interact with the whole world, not so that you can be a narrow-minded parochial twit. If you don't want to know about anything, don't go on to higher education. If you do, take the advice of people who know a hell of a lot more than you that this stuff's important. Hell, it's not like you don't have a zillion other mandatory classes, like art and music appreciation and science and math.

The chilling thing is that Che accepts the manatory indoctrination of the liberal education system but would reject out of hand religious fundamentalist instruction.

The basic concept is the same; only the material is different.

	26-09-2002 22:17									#33
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The difference of course, is one deals with real human beings, and the other deals with imaginary friends.

	26-09-2002 22:19									#34
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quote: Originally posted by chegitz guevara The difference of course, is one deals with real human beings, and the other deals with imaginary friends.

But Che, thats what you have been taught to say.

	26-09-2002 22:22									#35
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Sardwhatever ( ):

It is the job of lower education, not colleges, to teahc geography- Now, I on't know what school you went to, but good ol' me, ni the Left-leaning NYC system never had any pc classes. If you cant place Iraq ona map, maybe you shouldn't be in colege- a nice job in the exciting world of fast food retail sales is what you need!

Po quiz, geography master: name all of Iraq's neighbors, without looking at a map, assuming you would know which one was Iraq.

	26-09-2002 22:25									#36
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Iran, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait. Hmm, Turkey. Jordan?

And maybe several somethingistans. Not Pakistan though.

	26-09-2002 22:26									#37
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Let's see, Iran, Kuwait, Saudi Arabia,...Syria....is that it?

	26-09-2002 22:30									#38
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Ah, JT beat me. I forgot about the Turks and Jordan.

	26-09-2002 22:30									#39
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quote: The purpose of University and college is to provide you with a well rounded education that allows you to interact with the whole world, not so that you can be a narrow-minded parochial twit. If you don't want to know about anything, don't go on to higher education. If you do, take the advice of people who know a hell of a lot more than you that this stuff's important

So I am supposed to blindly follow the advice of people that know a "hell of a lot more" than I do in deciding what constitutes a well rounded education? Chilling....

These people who "know a hell of a lot more than I do" apparently feel that the hard-core basics of philosophy and critical thinking cant be bothered with when compared to blather I'm forced to take. And you can forget about offering a dissenting opinion against anything these profs shove down your throat. Watch your grade go bye-bye.

Lefties scare me

	26-09-2002 22:36									#40
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Lefties should scare you. Lefties are the new priesthood and would rule you as cruelly as the papists if they could. Thank God for people like Reagan and Bush who stand against the evil within.

	26-09-2002 22:38									#41
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lefties have by no means the monopoly on stupid ideas about education. For the lower grades I would say that rightwingers are much worse. Saying that lefties scare you is dumping the complex problems of reality on some group, like the jews... Even Hitler did that!

This post is brought to you by the Herta foundation. Have a ugly german day.

	26-09-2002 22:41									#42
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Righties should scare you. Righties are the new priesthood and would rule you as cruelly as the papists if they could. Thank God for people like Chomsky who stand against the evil within.

	26-09-2002 22:45									#43
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Comparing anyone with the papists is just sooo 17th century, the Hitler-approach is just so much more modern!

	26-09-2002 22:46									#44
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quote: Saying that lefties scare you is dumping the complex problems of reality on some group, like the jews... Even Hitler did that!

I think it's the liberal agenda in higher ed that's dumping the complex problems of reality, and replacing it instead with groupthink.

	26-09-2002 22:52									#45
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Thank God I didn't ask for Iran's neighbors......

US education in the basic social sciences, History and geography, is an utter joke. Mainly, I think, because Americans don't give adamn about the past, or about the world. not a great combination long term, though it wrs just fine in making money and new ideas. Some balance would be nice, though.

Oh, and JT and Monkspider combined did get them all right.

	26-09-2002 22:56									#46
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And when we're at it: Don't forget that ignorance is strengh!

	26-09-2002 23:10									#47
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Maybe there are so many lefties with PhDs because they're... well... smarter?

Just a thought.

	26-09-2002 23:25									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Sardaukar So its the job of a university to take our large amounts of money and "re-indoctrinate" us? I spend a lot of money and should take what I think is important for me, not what some university thinks I should know that 's completely irrelevant to what im studying. It's a form of PC, liberal agenda, forced indoctrination.

I'm forced to take large amounts of science and math courses, yet I'm majoring in the Humanities and the Arts...wouldn't the 'liberal agenda' elminate the requirement of math for me?

No wonder conservatives repeat the mistakes of history...they don't think its necessary.

	26-09-2002 23:29									#49
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quote: Originally posted by Kepler Maybe there are so many lefties with PhDs because they're... well... smarter? Just a thought.

	26-09-2002 23:43									#50
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quote: I'm forced to take large amounts of science and math courses, yet I'm majoring in the Humanities and the Arts...wouldn't the 'liberal agenda' elminate the requirement of math for me?

Consider yourself lucky then. Science and math is good for you. Puts hair on your chest and promotes critical thinking and logic skills. Plus science and math arent used to promote unneeded and unwanted political agendas.

Im not referring to individual cases like yours. I'm referring to wholesale efforts by the liberal agenda to bully its views in and out of the classroom. And stifle free speech to boot.

quote: No wonder conservatives repeat the mistakes of history...they don't think its necessary

Not the kind of history that blames the "oppressive white male power heirarchy".

	26-09-2002 23:49									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Sardaukar Consider yourself lucky then. Science and math is good for you. Puts hair on your chest and promotes critical thinking and logic skills. Plus science and math arent used to promote unneeded and unwanted political agendas.

Oxford Biochemistry graduate here and that lack of 'pushing unwanted political agendas' hasn't stopped me from possessing a highly developed and thought out political opinion. Try your reasoning again...

	26-09-2002 23:51									#52
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quote: Maybe there are so many lefties with PhDs because they're... well... smarter?

Or rather, too stupid to get a real job?

	26-09-2002 23:56									#53
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It's no secret that the humanities and social scienese are overwhelmingly leftist. I suspect it would be even higher % of leftists if you excluded economics departments.

"Maybe because all those right-wing high school and primary school teachers couldn't figure north and south on the map!"

All of my high school teachers were leftists, in fact my World History teacher was a socialist. The key is just to filter out their bias in their subjects and do what you need to get a good grade in the course. Most teachers, however, it seems are tolerant of students having views that disagree with their own.

	27-09-2002 00:05									#54
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First lesson in Apolyton: never assume the other posters are stupid, unless you know they are.

So many good conservatives graduate from top flight universities, that either those indoctrination classes are failing, or the professors aren't trying to indocrinate at all. I agree that most Social science profs' are leftists, specially on social issues. I did get to meet lenty of more center- or rightwing guys at my universty though- not all in the crypto-fasicst ( ) econ department though.

The only universities that in my opinion actively seek to indoctrinate are those that accuse al other universities of doing that and style themselves as 'fair minded' and 'independent', and 60-70% of the time, they are conservative Universities.

	27-09-2002 02:24									#55
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quote: I spend a lot of money and should take what I think is important for me, not what some university thinks I should know that 's completely irrelevant to what im studying.

Ah, a voice crying out for education!

Why are more teachers lefties? It's not obvious? Because teaching is, by definition, a job for those who care about people more than money. Not many righties pass that filter.

	27-09-2002 02:41									#56
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quote: Originally posted by Sardaukar Consider yourself lucky then. Science and math is good for you. Puts hair on your chest and promotes critical thinking and logic skills.

Another one confusing personal viewpoint and tastes with objectivity. Don't see much of the criticial thinking in that. A university student myself I can trash most science-students when it comes to that departement.

You know there's a 1984-word for that as well, doublethink. If courses you dislike is forced on you, the courses that you likes that is forced on others is equally bad. I think there's a gap in your logical skills.

	27-09-2002 02:47									#57
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Let's see now... There are several million "right wingers" feeding the poor of the world and caring for the orphans of the world and caring for the sick and diseased people of the world. Maybe they are too busy to sit in an ivory tower and spew out the glories of socialism??

	27-09-2002 03:50									#58
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quote: If courses you dislike is forced on you, the courses that you likes that is forced on others is equally bad. I think there's a gap in your logical skills.

My logic is fine. im talking about courses that provide a well-rounded liberal arts education- science and math fit that bill. Some courses should be required along the way as long as they dont politicize or offer liberal fluff like intro to feminism or some other leo buscaglia crap. I could be taking something more substantive for the money I'm spending.

	27-09-2002 04:59									#59
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So go to Bob Jones, whiner boy. You voluntarily attend a university with multicultural requirements. The choice is yours, shut up and stop being a whiner-boy or go someplaces else. It's your money after all. You agreed to go there, knowing they had requirements. You agreed to take the classes. It's too bad that they challenge your conservative indoctrination with history about someone besides you.

	27-09-2002 05:24									#60
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I think you are whining about the "whiner boy"