28-01-2003 01:15									#31
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Nope, but we think America doesn't either. To the rest of the world it may look like we're Americanised, but many, if not most people in the UK hate America. The trouble is, we seem to hate Europe too We're becoming more isolationist in opinion, or so ti seems. It is just the Government with its grand plan, because foreign policy is much more fun than domestic stuff they know whats best for us

	28-01-2003 01:20									#32
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quote: Originally posted by Drogue Nope, but we think America doesn't either. To the rest of the world it may look like we're Americanised, but many, if not most people in the UK hate America. The trouble is, we seem to hate Europe too We're becoming more isolationist in opinion, or so ti seems. It is just the Government with its grand plan, because foreign policy is much more fun than domestic stuff they know whats best for us

No no....You see, its you whom have been AMERICANIZED. Rebelling against everyone, becoming isolationists.......Its the Americans whom have become BRITISHIZED. Fat, arrogent, stupid.....

See?

	28-01-2003 01:21									#33
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I tried watching the Superbowl last night in order to better understand Americans.

I gave up.

	28-01-2003 01:24									#34
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quote: Originally posted by Tassadar5000 Rebelling against everyone, becoming isolationists.......

Americans have never been isolationist.

	28-01-2003 01:28									#35
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc Americans have never been isolationist.

Pre WW2 maybe? Post cold war maybe?

	28-01-2003 01:31									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Tassadar5000 Pre WW2 maybe? Post cold war maybe?

The answer to both questions is no. Try again.

	28-01-2003 01:33									#37
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quote: Originally posted by Tassadar5000 The fact that the independant option is winning is a sign that the British are still stuck in the past. They all probably think they still have empire!!!

And is having two moronic options a sign of advancment

	28-01-2003 02:11									#38
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc The answer to both questions is no. Try again.

I would have considered pre-WW2 USA to be isolationist. They did not get involved in the War until Pearl Harbour, and were "following a policy of isolationism" as my old history textbook says.

	28-01-2003 02:16									#39
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc The answer to both questions is no. Try again.

Maybe not post cold war, but the United States pre-ww2 was COMPLETLY isolationist

	28-01-2003 02:18									#40
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun So I earned A's in almost all of my history courses in college, got nominated for the All-American Scholar Collegiate Award twice, been on the Dean's List three times, earned an A on my major's capstone research paper, and a Phi Alpha Theta member because of my poor reading comprehension? And it's not difficult to discern your "real subtle" words of Gay bigot against Southerners.

oooh, another masturbation thread? Me next me next!

	28-01-2003 02:19									#41
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quote: Originally posted by Tassadar5000 Maybe not post cold war, but the United States pre-ww2 was COMPLETLY isolationist

I would wager that you don't even know what the word means. That would explain the idiotic overuse of the smilie.

	28-01-2003 02:24									#42
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Maybe not (although I'll wager he does) but that doesn't stop what is a valid point. All you have said is 'no it isn't. Try again.' Why does that make you any more knowledgeable than Tass on this?

	28-01-2003 02:24									#43
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What a nice personal attack. Do you have any more?

	28-01-2003 02:50									#44
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quote: What a nice personal attack. Do you have any more?

Since for some odd reason we seem to be focusing on America's actions prior to WW2, let pluck just a few "isolationist" examples throughout its history prior to WW2:
1) The Lend/Lease Act of 1941
2) Strangling the Japanese war machine with an embargo instituted that same year.
3) The Monroe Doctrine
4) The Quasi-War with France
5) War of 1812
6) Spanish-American War
7) Our "adventures" in the Phillipines
8) "Stealing" Panama from Columbia

I can even find more examples of our "isolationist" bent throughout time if you like. I can also try and explain the meaning of the term "offshore balancer" to you as well, Tass.

	28-01-2003 02:51									#45
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People of Britain: You need no longer worry over political issues. His Toniness can now take care of it for you.

	28-01-2003 02:52									#46
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc quote: What a nice personal attack. Do you have any more? Since for some odd reason we seem to be focusing on America's actions prior to WW2, let pluck just a few "isolationist" examples throughout its history prior to WW2: 1) The Lend/Lease Act of 1941 2) Strangling the Japanese war machine with an embargo instituted that same year. 3) The Monroe Doctrine 4) The Quasi-War with France 5) War of 1812 6) Spanish-American War 7) Our "adventures" in the Phillipines 8) "Stealing" Panama from Columbia I can even find more examples of our "isolationist" bent throughout time if you like. I can also try and explain the meaning of the term "offshore balancer" to you as well, Tass.

I am guessing here that he means immediately pre WW2

as in 1919-1939

Jon Miller

	28-01-2003 02:56									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller I am guessing here that he means immediately pre WW2 as in 1919-1939 Jon Miller

Yep. Up to Pearl Harbor, the US didnt really concern itself all that much with international affairs.

Now on the other hand.....

	28-01-2003 03:05									#48
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Why does that option now 2 to 1?! The UK isn't independant....

	28-01-2003 03:06									#49
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quote: Originally posted by Jon Miller I am guessing here that he means immediately pre WW2

That's not really relevent to this point.

	28-01-2003 03:06									#50
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quote: Originally posted by DinoDoc That's not really relevent to this point.

Go respond to my other thread.

	28-01-2003 04:03									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Tassadar5000 Yep. Up to Pearl Harbor, the US didnt really concern itself all that much with international affairs. Now on the other hand.....

Not true. The Monroe Doctrine and the Polk Doctrine effectively turned the Western hemisphere into an 'American intervention only' reserve. Irrespective of that, America intervened militarily in the Philippines, ostensibly during the Spanish American War of 1898 to 'liberate' the Philippines, then carried on a brutal war of occupation killing Filipinos they were there meant to be liberating. Bizarrely, I believe this is called 'the Filipino Insurrection' in some American history books.

Before World War II, America intervened in:

Cuba, Guam, Puerto Rico, the Philippines, Mexico, Nicaragua (on more than one occasion), Panama, Haiti, Colombia, Peru, the Dominican Republic, Honduras, Costa Rica, China, and Hawaii.

The United States after all, expanded at the expense of France, Spain, Mexico and Great Britain- and the Native Americans of course.

	28-01-2003 04:39									#52
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ooh the chance to become an American...

I'd rather become a Frenchman than be an American.

	28-01-2003 04:44									#53
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But it didnt concern itself with WORLD affairs. That was all under the sort of management of Europe.

IIRC. I know very little American history, so I'll probably lose this debate.

	28-01-2003 04:56									#54
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quote: Originally posted by Tassadar5000 But it didnt concern itself with WORLD affairs. That was all under the sort of management of Europe. IIRC. I know very little American history, so I'll probably lose this debate.

Excuse me? Since when are either the Philippines or China off-shore interests of the United States?

There is no border with Nicaragua, either, and Haiti had been an independent republic in the 18th Century- like the States.

America smoothly slipped into the role of major investor/exploiter in South America that had been Great Britain's, prior to World War I. And the Spanish-American War gave strategic naval bases and opportunities for commercial expansion in the Western Pacific- which to my mind is not naturally an 'American' lake.

Unless you consider Central America and the Caribbean to be legitimately the sole preserve of American financial/military adventurers and not be worthy of self-determination and independence, then they also constitute 'the world' and not just cash cows for Standard Oil, National City Bank and the United Fruit Company.

	28-01-2003 05:42									#55
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If America had been truly isolationist before WWII, Pearl Harbor would never have happened. It was America's attempts to stop Japanese expansion in Asia through economic sanctions that led to war.

	28-01-2003 07:16									#56
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quote: Originally posted by Demerzel ooh the chance to become an American... I'd rather become a Frenchman than be an American.

oww, now that really hurts...

	28-01-2003 07:16									#57
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quote: Originally posted by orange oooh, another masturbation thread? Me next me next!

eh?
No comprende

	28-01-2003 07:26									#58
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Seeing my defeat a few posts away, I'll bow out now.

	28-01-2003 08:07									#59
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quote: Originally posted by molly bloom Not true. The Monroe Doctrine and the Polk Doctrine effectively turned the Western hemisphere into an 'American intervention only' reserve. Irrespective of that, America intervened militarily in the Philippines, ostensibly during the Spanish American War of 1898 to 'liberate' the Philippines, then carried on a brutal war of occupation killing Filipinos they were there meant to be liberating. Bizarrely, I believe this is called 'the Filipino Insurrection' in some American history books. Before World War II, America intervened in: Cuba, Guam, Puerto Rico, the Philippines, Mexico, Nicaragua (on more than one occasion), Panama, Haiti, Colombia, Peru, the Dominican Republic, Honduras, Costa Rica, China, and Hawaii. The United States after all, expanded at the expense of France, Spain, Mexico and Great Britain- and the Native Americans of course.

The Fillipino Inssurection is what is used in rhetorical, feel-good, run-of-the-mill textbooks. But the Inssurection part is really inaccurate, since Filipinos mark their independence year of 1898.

	28-01-2003 08:27									#60
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quote: But the Inssurection part is really inaccurate, since Filipinos mark their independence year of 1898.

What does that have to do with anything? The United States claims to have gained independence in 1776; that doesn't mean that our insurrection against the British Empire never happened...