17-02-2003 00:33									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Mongoose BTW, fanatic bonus does not count against native life forms, I don't know if it applies if a defending unit is equipped with Psi armour...I suspect not.

Confirmed, Mimi's fanatacism bonus only applies against non-psi opponents, though given that all psi combat gives +50% to the attacker, this isn't the worst thing in the world.

	17-02-2003 00:39									#32
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Slightly innacurate, CEO. LAND Psi combat has basic odds of 3:2. (before morale/life cycle effects, any applicable SPs and the ATTACKER'S (only) PLANET rating)

SEA Psi combat has basic odds of 1:1 before modification. This applies to air attacks on IoDs...base 1:1. I do not recall if basic air - air combat odds depend on whether the underlying terrain is land or water...they may.

Remember also, that Mim has an innate -1 PLANET.

	17-02-2003 14:57									#33
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quote: Originally posted by zsozso I just hate Miriam. Period. And don't give me that momentum crap. .....................................................................

Well played by human and having human opponents around tends to lead to massive trade och techs all around. Miriam is almost in pair with most other factions. Pick a good moment and start a massive war. Tech is levelled but mirima has an advantage. In this case being zak & co won't do much however Yang, Morgan and Domai would make good opponents with their industry and/or income.

	19-02-2003 10:43									#34
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Ideologically, I hate the Morganites, Believers and the Cult equally.

In terms of gameplay however, I dislike the Morganites as both the negative support and inability to grow bases past size 4 without hab complexes are vices that I have too much difficulty overcoming. Sure, I like the challenge of vices difficult to master, like the Spartans -2 Industry or the Hive's -2 Economy, but there is a limit.

I also dislike the Peacekeepers in terms of gameplay, since they are way too easy to master, and have no extremes. The few vices they have are no challenge at all to overcome.

Can't comment on the gameplay aspects of the SMAX factions, since I don't have it.

	19-02-2003 22:19									#35
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In terms of philosophy: Morgan.
In terms of gameplay: Miriam

	20-02-2003 01:57									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Mongoose Slightly innacurate, CEO. LAND Psi combat has basic odds of 3:2. (before morale/life cycle effects, any applicable SPs and the ATTACKER'S (only) PLANET rating)

I always thought the 3:2 attack ratio gave a +50% bonus to the attacker. My logic being:

3:2 - time 100 to numerator and denominator gives:
300:200 - dividing top & bottom by 2 gives:
150:100 - which looks like +50% to base attack to me

Can someone elaborate on whether my math is good or bad?

	20-02-2003 02:59									#37
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Nothing wrong with your math...it's your reading comprehension that needs work.

CEO stated "though given that all psi combat gives +50% to the attacker..." (emphasis added, for the reading impaired)

I corrected him because his statement is not true in cases of SEA psi combat.

	20-02-2003 03:19									#38
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My mistake. Thanks for clearing that up.

	21-02-2003 12:44									#39
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Morgan, I don't like his poplimit...

	21-02-2003 20:34									#40
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Peace Keepers.

Sure they are supposed to be a decent faction, but I just hate their background. Stupid goody-two-shoes Peacekeepers. I also prefer more interesting and pronounced advantages and disadvantages.

And I prefer to annihilate all in an unstoppable wall of hovertanks and infantry, rather than pussyfooting around other factions.

Having the Hive as my favorite faction probably has something to do with it too though.

	22-02-2003 01:10									#41
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I echo for Miriam, because she usually dominates the other AI players in an SP game. The last 3 out 4 games I've played, Miriam has eradicated 2 or 3 factions and rolled over a huge continent.

I like to keep as many factions alive in the game for as long as possible, even offering remote/sea bases. But Miriam just fouls everything up.

	22-02-2003 03:20									#42
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quote: Originally posted by waab Morgan, I don't like his poplimit...

Yes, the population limit for Morgan is their biggest weakness, though not in the way most players might think. The -3 population before hab complexes is actually pretty trivial, since any player worth their salt will be expanding thin then pop booming up to their hab limits. Its the pre-dome limit of 11 that really stinks for Morgan, those extra 3 population actually can add up to a lot of votes, energy and tech.

On a separate note, poor Mimi, she just seems to have no end to her detractors. Ah well.

	24-02-2003 05:43									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Dranthar Peace Keepers. Sure they are supposed to be a decent faction, but I just hate their background. Stupid goody-two-shoes Peacekeepers. I also prefer more interesting and pronounced advantages and disadvantages. And I prefer to annihilate all in an unstoppable wall of hovertanks and infantry, rather than pussyfooting around other factions. Having the HIVE as my favorite faction probably has something to do with it too though.

	27-02-2003 18:06									#44
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Gee, no one hates the Cybernetic Consciousness?

Well, they do rock... but I really think the University is better. They get free Network Nodes, can pick Centauri Ecology as a starting tech and don't have that icky -1 Growth. Granted, the +2 Efficiency is nice, but I usually run Demo/Green with Zak, so the difference is minimal. Great for early game though.

	27-02-2003 18:56									#45
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quote: Originally posted by Ivellios Gee, no one hates the Cybernetic Consciousness?

Well, Aki-Zeta looks very 'nice' () to me... Even if somewhat pale. Hmm, I wonder how it would be...

	27-02-2003 21:22									#46
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Honestly, I'm not suprised Aki doesn't have any detractors, her only drawback is the inability to POP boom, which I personally don't like, but she's hardly the only faction with that restriction.

	27-02-2003 22:35									#47
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True, she doesn't have the dismal Probe modifier of Zakharov and those drones can be very annoying. I suppose Zakharov really needs to secure the Virtual World and the Hunter-Seeker Algorithm to solve his problems, while Aki-Zeta's problems can be easily offset by running Democracy and/or Planned. And there's always the Cloning Vats for popbooming

I suppose Zak's pros are more significant, but so are his cons.

	28-02-2003 02:30									#48
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Having to rely on the Cloning Vats for your pop booming _is_ a huge disadvantage, IMO. If you can pop by running either Demo-Planned or Demo/FM, then you can get your faction up to its hab limits just after you get Tree Farms. The Cloning Vats come _much_ later, and if my population is twice yours due to an early pop boom, there's no guarantee you're getting them at all.

That being said, its not impossible for Aki to pop boom, just expensive. You need to run Demo/Planned/Wealth and allocate 30-40% to Psych, and it won't hurt to have the Human Genome in the mix as well.

	28-02-2003 04:25									#49
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Aki's big advantage is, like Morgan, being able to run FM while also having +4 effic. +3 economy allocated to 100% labs or 100% energy really helps in getting those secret projects.

Edit: Morgan can't run FM and be at +4 effic, but he can have that magical +2 econ with +4 effic.

Last edited by Chaos Theory on 03-03-2003 at 22:35

	02-03-2003 11:14									#50
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I will NEVER play the Commie Bastard Hive--end of story.
The Believers kick ass as a faction.
Morgan can't fight to save his life.

	03-03-2003 22:16									#51
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Morgie can be extremely kick ass if played correctly.

Fundy/green/wealth - Good probe rating, great energy for probe actions, can be a green warrior with worms to help offset some of his support issues.

Running Fundy/wealth he can build a creches and with command centere/bioenhancement facs and (high morale or a monolith upgrade) can pump out elites like mad.

True I do like the believers, and they rock if on land and playing spoils on, but don't discount Morgie as a capitalist warrior.

	06-03-2003 11:11									#52
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I actually think the Believers are abusively good. But only with the cheap strategy I use.

You know how they have +2 support? In the beginning, dump all your energy into economy since you don't get any reseach points anyways. You can switch once you actually start research.

Then get formers as fast as possible. 4 free units... droolz. The trick is to mass formers and population boom with planned, and children's creche.

At sufficient size, switch to green and behold!

You will soon have so much tech that the University will look like... like the Believers!


And Morganites actually can turn their weakness into an advantage. Not having more than 4 pop seems like a very bad thing. However... supply crawlers build much faster than population can grow in the early game. If you build many cities, you will overcome the voting by population difficulty. Planetary Transit...

If you don't have a huge pop/base, you don't have to build anything to make your citizen happy. No big population/city means no drone problems. And you don't even have to pay the 2 energy a turn for hab complex. Mines and Boreholes to get a super mineral advantage. Use formers to make forest and solar collectors. Place crawlers everywhere. No need to waste time getting too many farms because you only have 4 pop/city. Just mine/forest/collector. And if you have crawlers on forest/mines already, you will pump out crawlers so fast. Overcome the pop disadvantage with Athestic Virtues.

The only difficulty is that crawlers can only extract 1 type of thing and citizens can extract 3. Overcome this by having wide borders in which you can mine. Note that supply crawlers can be armored... They can have trance to stop worms... When you decide to switch to Free Market, you will have so many armored crawlers protecting your bases. You are practically invincible. Notice also that crawlers cost nothing to support. Early clean defense! Alternatively, you could go Green because your pop has been stuck at 4/6 and growth doesn't really matter since you get all your energy from crawlers anyway.

Alternatively, notice that you can sell hab complex after the population has grown above 4...

	06-03-2003 14:56									#53
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Someone please tell me who invented the Cult of Planet

	06-03-2003 18:54									#54
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That's a good strategy for Believers, H32. I'll have to try that out.

	10-03-2003 15:22									#55
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I just hate the Drones and Believers, both are like somekind of cancer in the game

	11-03-2003 00:08									#56
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Miriam is just not as much fun to play by us builders. The Aliens are too strong and should not be played.

	12-03-2003 03:21									#57
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Harvester32: That is PRECISELY the strategy I use playing the Believers. Crank out scounts and colonies until tech restriction is lifted, then grab Centauri Ecology asap. Use 4 support to build 3 formers per base, terraform like mad, and roll research toward Planetary Networks. Once PN is bought, its time to send out probes and tech-rape all your neighbors. If done correctly, your extra growth and vast t-forming power will allow you to outgrow your competition, while maintaining technological parity with your rivals.

	12-03-2003 08:37									#58
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The Believes is definitely the worst faction to play.

	12-03-2003 08:40									#59
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quote: Originally posted by DetroitDave I echo for Miriam, because she usually dominates the other AI players in an SP game. The last 3 out 4 games I've played, Miriam has eradicated 2 or 3 factions and rolled over a huge continent. I like to keep as many factions alive in the game for as long as possible, even offering remote/sea bases. But Miriam just fouls everything up.

Then use Probe Team to free the captured faction leaders. In this way you can get a bunch of submissive allies almost for free.

	12-03-2003 10:06									#60
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Wow, threads like these never die....nor fade away.