01-04-2003 18:36									#61
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

For your Rah rules game it's a good suggestion, since someone will probably start with a hut in their view. In this case Makeo's point about expending resources to find huts is not so compelling. But more generally I'm not so sure.........it may be best just to leave it the way it is now.

	01-04-2003 19:28									#62
	Inflate your Upload Space

As to Makeo's point, there is still the tradeoff of building that extra exploring unit to go after huts instead of a settler, so I also think that it's not so compelling in this isolated instance.

The main reason I brought this up is that it could lead to more balanced starts in terms of terrain. How many times do you start with bad land because you explored in the wrong direction? Knowing where the closest specials are is no guarentee that you will settle better land, but it does improve the odds a bit. Knowing where that closest hut is will also even things out a bit. (granted there will always be hut luck ) The person that finds a hut on their opening screen is more likely to score all four huts in a pattern before someone else even finds a hut. This is usually quite advantagous. If he had to call out the seed number it might even things out a bit.

Just a thought. I appreciate all the discussion.

	01-04-2003 20:01									#63
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Hmmm... I kind of like that idea...

That would even things out if a person with a hut gives its location via king chat so it's a level playing field...

	01-04-2003 20:06									#64
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by Ming Hmmm... I kind of like that idea... That would even things out if a person with a hut gives its location via king chat so it's a level playing field...

Surely you only need the seed number not the specific location?

	01-04-2003 20:30									#65
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I'm sure that what he means, which is why I've asked SG to see if he can include the seed number and use it as a base

	01-04-2003 21:39									#66
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Yes I saw. It does seem to me like a reasonable counterbalance to the precision afforded by hutfinder.

	01-04-2003 22:36									#67
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

If we are going to use it... this sounds reasonable.

And the seed number is a much smarter idea. Now that I think about it, the last thing I would want to do is tell EVERYBODY where (the specific coordinates) the hut is in MY OPENING SCREEN...

(a senior moment, didn't think about that one too much)

	01-04-2003 22:40									#68
	Support Apolyton

quote: Originally posted by Ming (a senior moment, didn't think about that one too much)

Talk about painting a bullseye on your head.

	01-04-2003 22:42									#69
	Increase Your PM Length

hut finders and paper charts
what else do you people use to suck the fun out the game?

	01-04-2003 23:49									#70
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

At least we don't use a second computer named "skill".

But if you really want to suck the fun out, try to calculate the supply and demand commodities on the fly based on the threads in the strat section, or use the science beaker calculator. Hopefully I will never be quite that anal.

	02-04-2003 00:21									#71
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Seems to me that the essence of MP is its interactive nature -- a battle of wits, played in (relatively) real time against human intelligence. insert joke here) The only reasons to agree to use external tools like the hutfinder program would be to assure a level playing field. Pretty much the essence of RAH Rules -- community rules agreement, especially re what's a cheat and what ain't.

Question -- If a player doesn't have Hutfinder (or can't get it to work, or has an iMac...) would that person be within rights to ask others not to use it?

	02-04-2003 00:25									#72
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I don't like this idea. First, huts are luck based and finding one on your opening screen is a blessing..or a curse.

telling everyone the the seeding is removing your advantage/disadvantage.

many times i open huts after building and its barb, barb barb....

IMO, if you get a hut its your secret, just like that opening Gold, or whine etc.

if we tell of opening huts on our screen and give the resource seed out, then i vote to remove all huts from a game and that would suck

we all know the game inside out, and all the little tricks...lets not let the hutfinder completely alter the game ?

	02-04-2003 01:01									#73
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

quote: Originally posted by War4ever IMO, if you get a hut its your secret, just like that opening Gold, or whine etc.

Classic spelling for wine.


At least this time your response addressed the question I asked, Thanks. And you actually provided some rational

I could go either way on this one, which was why I was really interested in others opinions on this one.

	02-04-2003 02:24									#74
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by rah Classic spelling for wine. At least this time your response addressed the question I asked, Thanks. And you actually provided some rational I could go either way on this one, which was why I was really interested in others opinions on this one.

No pun intended

i think i misunderstood the question in my initial response.

I know we have opened up a can of worms with the hut finder especially for MP games, but i think if we continue to make radical changes the game will change too much for our liking.

Think of the great debates we had over Wonders....IMO the only way to counter the hut finder is to remove huts completely and lets be honest, we talked about this before and everyone stated they liked the luck factor.

	02-04-2003 02:36									#75
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

But if SG implemented the change you wouldn't know who had huts on their opening screen, just that someone did.

	02-04-2003 02:49									#76
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by DrSpike But if SG implemented the change you wouldn't know who had huts on their opening screen, just that someone did.

Yes, anonymous king chat. But true to form, the person would forget to turn off the anonymous flag and say something else and everyone would know who it was


And War, yes I'm not interested in removing all huts. But I was looking at this as a possible solution to fairer starts. Yes, quite a stretch.......But I'm never going to recommend premade maps and starting positions. Your opinion is noted. I have been surprised at how differently people have looked at it. Most, not the way I intended.

RAH

	02-04-2003 05:12									#77
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Hmmm.... No huts... No mounted units for War4ever, and no worthless sciences for myself... Hmmmmm...

Nahhhhhhhhhhhhh

	05-04-2003 02:48									#78
	Increase the size of your Attachments

**** me, lately i am getting bullshit out of huts...while the wonder twins roll along

i got three huts the other day,

regardless of your luck, its nice to find a ****ing hut once in awhile

the hut finder lets you know someone has been tresspassing on your lands...

and the hut on the opening is huge, even one three or four turns away is big...b/c if someone has one, they will quickly have 3-4 more and possibly another 3-4 right after that..

paper and graphs.....haha....i use the force to find my huts

	05-04-2003 02:51									#79
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: Originally posted by War4ever regardless of your luck, its nice to find a ****ing hut once in awhile paper and graphs.....haha....i use the force to find my huts

Hmmmm, these statements don't seem very consistent. Or I guess your "force" doesn't always work.

Paper and graphs always do. But it's kinda like Odeo years lists. You have most of them memorized but have to glance every now and then.

RAH

	05-04-2003 03:50									#80
	Full PM-box? Change here!

yup, anyone can memorize the bc years, but i will be dammed if i can remember anything past ad :P especially in the later part of the evening

	05-04-2003 04:38									#81
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

After MANY drinks, even the bc years sometimes get a little foggy

	05-04-2003 05:00									#82
	Got spare money?

Hehe you knows it real bad when you start to question whether its on the year or before the year.

	05-04-2003 05:32									#83
	Full PM-box? Change here!

yeah, but its just 50 or 25....i find that simple...but if its been a heavy night, then yes, all numbers are foggy

	07-04-2003 00:48									#84
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

The numbers got REAL foggy last night... I hate the change to Daylight saving's time. It's much better in the fall when we gain an hour

	07-04-2003 01:29									#85
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

agreed, it was a late night for me, and even later for you guys....

clemens wins again, i come home to watch him give up a three run shot in the 7th....too bad, he pitched so well up to that point, one bad pitch....

2-0 win #295

	07-04-2003 17:27									#86
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Thank god we weren't scheduled to go to the Cubs opener today. 3 inches of new snow on the ground and more expected. They just cancelled the game.
I had one guy that had called in sick miraculously cured. He may be sick tomorrow though.

	07-04-2003 19:47									#88
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by rah They just cancelled the game. I had one guy that had called in sick miraculously cured. He may be sick tomorrow though.

	07-04-2003 22:53									#89
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

The funny thing is that I have a Doctor's appointment tomorrow afternoon that I scheduled saturday. When I told my boss that I was going to the doctor's tomorrow afternoon, he paused, gave me a thoughtful look, and said, "hmmm, you won't be able to play golf so it really must be a doctor's appointment." I do plan on watching the game after the appointment.

RAH

	09-04-2003 03:08									#90
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

so Ming and i were discussing the possibility of setting up games with objectives/point system in mind for our one nighter games....

this has been talked about before, of course the best way to do this is too NOT make it population based at all....and non powergraph based either..kinda goes without saying......

i think we should start a new thread on this subject and see what our other fellow aploytoners think about this.