22-03-2003 19:54									#31
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quote: Originally posted by alva What if we can get Lego into this....

Good point... if Lego sees that GoW is fighting a losing war with ND and RP, then they might be tempted to take a bite of GoW's behind as well. Then we'd have Lego on Bob as well, which could hold off ND for a while.

	22-03-2003 19:57									#32
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They are going to settle on the hill,aren't they..., please tell me they are going to settle on that hill....

	22-03-2003 19:57									#33
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We could also continue our building efforts- GoW wouldn't take on Vox on their homeland, not with ND waiting for their chance...

But, i think this is an opportunity for us- like FP said- a series of clashes in which Vox loses its offensive punch, and GoW doesn't lose much, leaves us an easy target.

Taking vox's Iron is surely tempting- they have numerous warriors they can upgrade. In fact, even if we don't take the source itself, we can cut off their road with our warrior.

	22-03-2003 20:01									#34
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If we are not going to intervaein, I don't think we want to cut their iron...

The free tech for one.

	22-03-2003 20:03									#35
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quote: They are going to settle on the hill,aren't they..., please tell me they are going to settle on that hill....

alva- they probably believe its a waste to make so close to wittlich...

*sigh*

	22-03-2003 20:06									#36
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The only Voxian on is Beta..

Did GoW already have contact with Vox?

	22-03-2003 20:08									#37
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quote: Originally posted by zeit In fact, even if we don't take the source itself, we can cut off their road with our warrior.

Ahh, how convenient.

	22-03-2003 20:09									#38
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I also don't think we should intervene, not on GoW's terms, and not before we're ready for this. I don't mind so much about one free tech- techs are getting cheaper. Anyhow, i doubt we'll have a needed army before we reach the medieval ages.

I suggest we just warn Vox of the great risk of claiming land for themselves on Bob right now, with a bit of threat/scolding from us.

	22-03-2003 20:12									#39
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Here's a possibility: we could tell GoW that we can cut off Vox's supply of iron before they upgrade the rest of their warriors (mentioning that we can see several ones) in turn 80, for an appropriate price.
Though I would be against it, because any payment from GoW would hardly make up for the lost free tech, if we decide to declare war on Vox then this would be a smart thing to do IMHO.

	22-03-2003 20:14									#40
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I hope, they can hold on to it.

IIRC Aeson was talking 'bout a plan to use our GA to expand onto BOB, this Voxian city could be quite usefull.

	22-03-2003 20:18									#41
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I think we should send Vox a somewhat friendly warning that their settling on BOB will almost surely lead to war with GoW. Then just let them do it if they want to.

GoW has so much to lose from a concerted attack on Vox, and unless they get a Leader to rush the FP with and Vox just rolls over and lets them have their cities, they have almost nothing to gain from it. If Vox fights back, Immortals in hilly terrain are going to waste Horsemen, especially considering they will have the initiative until GoW gets a coastal city. At the very least Vox can disband cities before they lose them, and GoW ends up with nothing except more empty terrain that they can't claim yet.

ND isn't likely to gain a whole lot from hitting GoW, they will probably lose ground compared to us, Lego, and RP even if they should win. Swords vs Horses usually favors the Horses on terrain like GoW has.

	22-03-2003 20:38									#42
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If we choose to side with Vox, then let's not forget to suggest to Vox that if they want to keep their beachhead, settling on the hill would be the best choice for them. A fortified spearman behind city walls would have 4.5 defense: enough to waste any GoW horseman or ND swordsman that tries to overtake it.

	22-03-2003 20:39									#43
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With GoW busy on Vox- i'm sure ND's military power won't have a hard time hitting GoW and causing very serious damage, especially if the aim at their core, or sticking to the central high grounds.

	22-03-2003 23:44									#44
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Okay, Vox are as of now officially BRAIN DEAD. Or they're playing dumb, and I mean REALLY dumb.

They mean to say that they seriously didn't realize the consequences of their actions? Pathetic.

	23-03-2003 00:03									#45
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It sounds like they are being attacked.

	23-03-2003 00:17									#46
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From the same thread:

quote: Originally posted by Darekill As i remember we would have given you our map. So don't tell me you are only going to explore the terrain. I remember such words that you are using now. It reminds me of a long gone Nation that once settled the very territory you try to occupie now. You know what happened to them? Do you want to share their fate? Don't try to argue with us. Don't try to take our warnings lightly. We are not the best of friends with Glory of War but in this case we would strike as one! I've heard nothing from RP so far but i think the'd be on our side too. So i beg you again leave! Leave or we will make you leave.

Vox has a map from ND? We didn't know that.
Is there any way we can get it from them?

	23-03-2003 00:19									#47
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Chat! Join!
#beachhead

	23-03-2003 00:21									#48
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There's another chat going on at #bob, but apparently we're not invited (the channel is password-protected). In it are Togas and Darekill.
Do we see collaboration? Or are they just trying to fool each other, and actually preparing on attacking each other while they are busy with Vox?

	23-03-2003 00:28									#49
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Private chat with Jon Miller. Times are GMT+2:00.

quote: [21:31] Jon_Miller: so whot is GS thinging? [21:32] Jon_Miller: we are just trying to see our world [21:32] Jon_Miller: and we get set upon [21:32] Shiber: We're surprised by your actions [21:32] Jon_Miller: we are exploring? [21:32] Shiber: Don't even try, we know you're not there for exploration [21:32] Jon_Miller: yes we are [21:32] Shiber: you've taken a settler with you [21:32] Shiber: and immortals [21:32] Jon_Miller: (We have a settler to build if there is room) [21:32] Jon_Miller: all we ahve are immortals [21:32] Jon_Miller: int he north [21:32] Shiber: no, you have recently upgraded them [21:33] Jon_Miller: (we4 have kept our south free of them for you) [21:33] Shiber: if you wanted to explore, you would send warriors [21:33] Jon_Miller: we upgraded them when we found out how weak our military was [21:33] Jon_Miller: than we decided to explre [21:33] Jon_Miller: we didn't have any warriors ready to do so [21:33] Shiber: anyway, i feel some sympathy to your team, so i'm going to give you some advice [21:33] Jon_Miller: ok [21:34] Jon_Miller: BTW [21:34] Jon_Miller: we and GS need to talk about tech [21:34] Shiber: should you choose to stay, settle the hill tile south-east of where your settler is currently stationed [21:34] Shiber: the hill would give you a great defense bonus [21:34] Jon_Miller: why do you know so much? [21:34] Shiber: if you build a wall there, you should be able to hold that city, even from a combined GoW/ND force [21:34] Jon_Miller: yes, that is where we were thinking of cuilidng [21:34] Jon_Miller: but there was some debate [21:35] Shiber: oh, regarding tech, [21:35] Shiber: what is your team researching at the moment? [21:35] Jon_Miller: I am not sure [21:35] Shiber: could you check? [21:35] Jon_Miller: but we have arranged, or almost arranged, tech deals for a bunch of techs [21:35] Jon_Miller: (if this doesn't screw the deals up) [21:35] Shiber: can i hear some details please? [21:36] Shiber: btw, we will supply you with construction, currency and the republic soon [21:36] Jon_Miller: I didn't handle the details [21:36] Jon_Miller: ah

	23-03-2003 00:39									#50
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This game is getting really funny.

Vox should sit in their corner and be nice wimps. If they don't, all the bullies are going to gang up on them. Man. Someone is bluffing. Or, if they are not...

How long will it be before this 'triple alliance of Bob' is directed at us?

	23-03-2003 00:44									#51
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Oh, btw. The expectation of GoW that we would threaten Vox for them is crap.

Say that succeeds and Vox leave. Where do you think they would then send those Immortals?

The diplomacy (or the sorry excuse for it) in this game is starting to bug me.

'We want your maps.'
Sorry, we don;t give them out.
'You must be our enemy then.'

Call their bluffs and cease to respond when they get silly. Let them know that we are happy to speak with reasonable people. So far, GoW is seeming less reasonable than Vox was. That's scary.

	23-03-2003 00:54									#52
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Currently chatting on #bob (a locked channel):
Jon Miller
Mrmitchell
BetaHound
Togas
Darekill

	23-03-2003 01:24									#53
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Vox and the Bobians are reaching an agreement.

Last edited by Shiber on 23-03-2003 at 01:32

	23-03-2003 02:49									#54
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I must agree with NYE- although HotE and UnO seem to be interested in diplomacy- real talks and an attempt to reach an understanding- it seems like the one who's calling the shots is GF, who's idea of diplomacy is somewhat limited, like NYE pointed out.

Shiber- how do yo know they're reaching an agreement? maybe it's a combined verbal lynch on Beta and Jon...

	23-03-2003 04:58									#55
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After thinking things over for a bit, I conclude that this tiff between GoW, ND and Vox is a very bad omen.

From what we know, Bob is large. Far larger proportionally for 3 civs than our land is for 2. This means that all three Bobian civs can be expected to outstrip us in population and productive capacity as time goes on.

Fortunately, the 3 Bobians may have just tipped their hands. All that talk of war should now be treated as propaganda. 3 civs near each other's throats would not have reacted to Vox the way things went today.

Where to from here? Well, off the top of my head, we must prepare for war soonest. It is clear that the threat from Bob is large and growing. I suggest we strongly examine the possibility of allying with Vox to eliminate the nearest Bob civ in the event that war does break out on Bob. It is clear that the 3 intend to cooperate at least enough to eliminate all other teams from gaining in power.

Also, given their... approaches, I would not be surprised to see RP gallies with settlers off our coast sooner rather than later. Or a combined RP, GoW invasion of Vox.

Last thought, or question rather. Could we find out from Vox just what the heck happened from their point of view? What was agreed to earlier today? I can chat with Jon, but not until later (several hours from now).

	23-03-2003 05:03									#56
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My thoughts exactly, us non-Bobians need to stick together.
We need Lego in this ASAP.

	23-03-2003 05:09									#57
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We must be very careful about how we proceed.

We are unprepared, the Bobians are. Any notiion that they get that we may be thinking along these lines may instigate hostilities prior to a time of our choosing.

Rather, we should steer conversatations towards our goals without ever saying so, even in private chats.

I fear that some of our own communications have been too direct and not oblique enough. I am certainly not happy with the course of our conversations with GoW re Vox. We practically wrote them a blank cheque with the result that Vox got trashed.

I am not criticising for the sake of criticism. I am pointing out that being blunt and too open can have nasty consequences. We hung Vox out to dry, and they almost got baked.

	23-03-2003 10:49									#58
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On the other hand, the Voxidiots asked for it.

This whole turn of affairs is a joke... I really am ROTFLMAO.

Stay the course: Balance. Production power. Appropriate defense.

After the political insanity and rapid tech development, watch what happens when we claim our leading role on the world stage... who will scamper to be our friends?

A Bobian alliance? HAH! HAH HAH! A tripod is the least stable of structures...

	23-03-2003 15:43									#59
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About production and population- it will take some them some time to really beat us- after the pyramids are done we'll have a decent breathing room. Allying with Vox now is IMHO wrong- this will surely put the "Bobian alliance" at a test, and might actually make it real. We can't ally with them, not diplomatically nor militarily, not towards the outside at least. We could offer them aid, in discrete ways. Our interest, at this point, would be to make sure Vox breathes, enough to make sure it weakens, economically and militarily, someone on Bob. Meanwhile, we shift more production towards military build up. After we're ready- we'll weigh our option- siding with Vox, or moping them out.