25-04-2003 23:29									#181
	Tired of ads?

never mind, never mind... let's not get into real world politics here. I thought it was too funny to ignore, but I'm certain Alva, nor myself wanted to upset anyone with our posts.

DeepO

	26-04-2003 00:57									#182
	Remove this text

Nah, the (j/k) was put there on purpose

I initialy wanted to make another joke, but it just fell into place and I couldn't resist it. (sorry, second nature, has got into trouble before )

If I did offend anyone, I apologize

	26-04-2003 04:31									#183
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

I hope everyone here realizes that in MP play and PBEM's that war weariness doesn't happen. Republic doesn't sufffer the same as in a SP game; same goes for a Democracy.

	26-04-2003 18:52									#184
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Hmm, I heard that somwhere. It's a shame, acutally...
Have they weakened the respective govts to compensate?
If not, there must be patch to restore it somewhere?
Or we must make a Mod to do balance govts.

	26-04-2003 22:37									#185
	Inflate your Upload Space

I don't think Firaxis considers it to be a bug, tthis was done intentionally IMO.
Granted, there are a few exploits you could use against Republic or Democracy if WW would excist..still..

	27-04-2003 05:09									#186
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

When AIs are losing, they generally make peace reasonably quickly. Human players who are losing are much more likely to take an attitude of, "If I'm going down, I'm taking you down with me," so it's not hard at all to imagine a human player continuing to fight a hopeless war just to hurt the enemy with war weariness. That makes the way war weariness works in SP far from desirable in MP.

What Firaxis probably really should have done was made a rule, "If you offer peace and click that you accept the other side's offer before sending, war weariness disappears." That would solve the revenge problem while still making war weariness an obstacle to protracted offensive warfare. But considering that I only just now thought of that solution, it's hard to blame the Firaxians if it didn't occur to them.

	27-04-2003 14:26									#187
	Get a bigger avatar today!

quote: Originally posted by nbarclay What Firaxis probably really should have done was made a rule, "If you offer peace and click that you accept the other side's offer before sending, war weariness disappears." That would solve the revenge problem while still making war weariness an obstacle to protracted offensive warfare. But considering that I only just now thought of that solution, it's hard to blame the Firaxians if it didn't occur to them.

You want to spoil my MP warmongering fun?!?!?!

	27-04-2003 16:28									#188
	Put an end to popups!

On further thought, the time when Republic shines most in SP is when you maintain a very small standing military and use the extra gold Republic brings almost entirely for research. To the extent that MP tends to call for larger standing armies, that eats into that advantage and, at the same time, makes the military police bonus for Monarchy more valuable. So the absence of war weariness in MP doesn't unbalance things as much as it might look like it would at first glance, although it does leave Republic with a considerable advantage unless a civ has a lot of very small and/or highly corrupt towns.

	27-04-2003 20:24									#189
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

I really like the nbarclay idea of "peace offer to reduce weariness", but it's hard to implement it, I guess. It would have forced warmongering players to think a bit more about their politics. Eventually, hardliners would have to choose Monarchy or Communism if the idea was implemented. So Master Zen's MP warmongering fun could prevail too.


On the other side, to balance the govts is a fairly easy task. We just have to make a little MOD. For a game without weariness, it would be neccesary to strengthen Communism and Monarchy compared to Democracy and Republic, respectively. Remember that Communism is a late tech, and should be useful for something more than eliminating emotional faces.

	27-04-2003 21:24									#190
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Not that the WW discussion isn't interesting...

But how about a Vox Daily War Report?

	27-04-2003 22:57									#191
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Yeah, who's been killed lately?

And if I was to enter the battle with my secret El Krakén,
would I kill them all?

	28-04-2003 01:46									#192
	Inflate your Upload Space

Just reading the reports now... I guess Trip and I will have to send in our countryman Hans B'Lux.

	28-04-2003 07:52									#193
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Vox Daily War Report for 610BC - From the Voxian Ministry of Information

It was an "interesting" turn. (yes, dear, I love that dress. )

To start with - a number of inferior Voxian units which were positioned as decoys were eliminated as expected by Gathering Storm forces. This allowed General Jon to push south - discovering the city of Tempest. And oh yes - Dissident the Deadly eliminated a veteran pikeman in the process.

It is also now apparent that GS has a navy - although, as it is obvious that the infidels must use women to fight ther land battles, their galleys are manned by children and old men pressed into service by the debased leadership which runs the country.

All in all, Voxian military leaders are not dissatisfied with the progress of the war. Despite some minor losses - major in-roads are being made into Storm territory.

May The One bless the Voxian troops in the field and showthem the path to Victory.

	28-04-2003 09:13									#194
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

It looks like Vox is doing reasonably well with the war of words, anyhow.

	28-04-2003 15:11									#195
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

quote: Originally posted by BetaHound It is also now apparent that GS has a navy - although, as it is obvious that the infidels must use women to fight ther land battles, their galleys are manned by children and old men pressed into service by the debased leadership which runs the country.

Damn, how did you know that?

	28-04-2003 15:12									#196
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Shiber Damn, how did you know that?

Even though our galleys are manned by children and retirees, they still can move faster than the Vox ships. What does that tell ya?

	28-04-2003 15:16									#197
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by asleepathewheel Even though our galleys are manned by children and retirees, they still can move faster than the Vox ships. What does that tell ya?

That we have whips, massive massive whips.

	28-04-2003 15:27									#198
	Increase the size of your Attachments

quote: Originally posted by BetaHound It is also now apparent that GS has a navy - although, as it is obvious that the infidels must use women to fight ther land battles, their galleys are manned by children and old men pressed into service by the debased leadership which runs the country.

And just think what's going to happen when our young, fit men finally get in on the action.

	28-04-2003 18:29									#199
	Support Apolyton

quote: All in all, Voxian military leaders are not dissatisfied with the progress of the war. Despite some minor losses - major in-roads are being made into Storm territory.

Come in, come in! Said the spider to the fly.

-Arrian

	28-04-2003 18:56									#200
	Inflate your Upload Space

Good to see the avatar back, Beta! In coming turns, you might want to keep some of his more colorful phrases in your mind, adapted to fit the game, of course!

Such notable greats as:

The Voxian Armies have the Infidels of GS completely surrounded. They are comitting suicide in large numbers at the ends of our swords.

GS has no army. There is no sign of any armed presence anywhere inside GS borders. Our troops are in no danger whatsoever. God willing, we will be marching through the center of the capitol soon.

And you have to say something about hitting us with shoes....

-=Vel=-

	30-04-2003 07:31									#201
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Vox Daily War Report - From the Voxian Minsitry of Information.

590BC

The Voxian Armies have the Infidels of GS completely surrounded. They are comitting suicide in large numbers at the ends of our swords.

GS has no army. There is no sign of any armed presence anywhere inside GS borders. Our troops are in no danger whatsoever. God willing, we will be marching through the center of the capitol soon.



And we expect there may be a naval battle soon - the world's first - and we are confident that Voxian sailing and warfare skills, to say nothing of the strength of our ships, will prove triumphant. Death to the Infidels. May they prove to be acceptable shark bait.

	30-04-2003 07:34									#202
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Good stuff. Keep up the good work

Very enjoyable

	30-04-2003 07:38									#203
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations

I'm still waiting for Vox to actually attack a city!

	30-04-2003 07:41									#204
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by Panzer32 I'm still waiting for Vox to actually attack a city!

Yeah, was this the turn? The Vox army was in position. Please let us know I can't wait for lego to pass on the save.

	30-04-2003 08:50									#205
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

quote: They are comitting suicide in large numbers at the ends of our swords.

what?

they are comitting suicide by being killed by others??

	30-04-2003 09:51									#206
	Inflate your Upload Space

DATELINE: 5:45AM GREENWICH MEANTIME

By: Rajim al-Abouzeid, Staff Reporter - Al Jazeera

The silence is deafening.

All I can see around me are banana peels... banana peels... and more banana peels.

In a surprise tactic, Gathering Storm Special Forces, specifically the 11th Mountain Brigade (AKA "Aeson's Own") strew banana peels, the new and improved B61 Mark 2 Spotted version, on every mountain passage approaching their cities.

Evidently, the Voxian Republican Guard and fedayeen (the white Toyota pick-up guys) never expected it... many slipped to their deaths.

"I zlipped and fell... I yelled "I've fallen, and I can't get up" but no one listened," said one surrendered Vox combatant.

Major General Arrian of the Department of Storming confirmed that the banana peels were in fact positioned using the G.S. G.P.S. system, and that banana 'slippage' was enhanced with laser triggers from low-flying Catapult UAVs.

"We've never been this good before... we know where they are, we know what assets we have locally, including banana peel booby traps, and we can get to Vox at will." General Arrian also confirmed that Vox' slave workers have been responding very positively to a PsyOps campaign focused on the embarassament of the Immortals' standard uniform, known jokingly as "culottes."

For this reporter, Rajim al-Abouzeid, all I can feel is the tension in the air... something must happen soon... everyone hear feels it, even the old lady who cuts my hair and told me all of her Vox customers have been cheating her of tips...

What new tricks await the Voxians? How many of their troops will stand for the fray? How many valiant GS soldiers are ready to risk life and limb to defeat this scourge, and defend the homeland?

How many banana peels yet remain?

The silence, the silence... The horror, the horror...

	30-04-2003 16:35									#207
	Remove this text

I love the smell of bananas in the morning. It smells like ... victory.

	30-04-2003 16:47									#208
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Vox daily war report - from not quite the Voxian Ministry of Information

Our troops continue advancing, and are now within 1 tile of their capital. Messages smuggled out by carrier chicken indicate that the immortals are expanding the sewer for the capital, and expect to graduate to road building once this job is completed. We are meeting only light resistance, as the soil here is quite loose, and we have been given shovels to dig with. One heroic soilder reports slaying 17 Gathering Storm earthworms in one morning alone.

Further updates as events warrant.

And boy will I look stupid if we open the save to find that Vox have captured one of our cities

	30-04-2003 20:22									#209
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Exactly how many troops does GS have? Hmm...
Look forward to opening the save... just to see there are no units left to move around.

	30-04-2003 20:31									#210
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Fortunately, GS cities can move around and attack.
Don't ask...