02-05-2003 08:04									#61
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quote: Originally posted by Agathon Have you all considered that reforming the system to make it more intrusive and less prone to abuse might make it cost more than the original abused system.

Exactly right.

And no matter what, there will always be abuse to any system.

There is no evidence that welfare in Canada is excessively abused, at least not to my knowledge.

The big problem is people who don't understand the system, like people who complain about a grandmother getting money from her family while collecting unemployment insurance

UI, or employment insurance as the Libs now call it, is an insurance system. It doesn't matter whether your family gives you money. You're still entitled to the insurance payments that you paid for.

As for street people, some of them choose to live on the streets. Others will refuse help because of various illnesses that affect their abilities to think rationally. And others are simply to proud to ask for help. There are no easy solutions and blaming the government won't help.

	02-05-2003 08:32									#62
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quote: Originally posted by Tingkai The big problem is people who don't understand the system, like people who complain about a grandmother getting money from her family while collecting unemployment insurance UI, or employment insurance as the Libs now call it, is an insurance system. It doesn't matter whether your family gives you money. You're still entitled to the insurance payments that you paid for.

The example I gave of the grandmother is of welfare. It is a documented abuse that takes place 6 times more often in South and East Asian Canadian families than the percentage of the national population they make up

This cultural link had no place in my original post; only as I wonder... Any particular reason you're so quick to defend this absurd trend?

	02-05-2003 08:38									#63
	Re: What degree is welfare fraud? Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

This is the problem with these types of complaints. People mix up welfare and unemployment insurance which are two very different things.

This is what you wrote:

quote: Originally posted by Zylka Of a 50 year old grandmother collecting $45,000 from family ties a year who also recieves full unemployment benefits.

Then you wrote:

quote: Originally posted by Zylka The example I gave of the grandmother is of welfare.

Now you claim:

quote: Originally posted by Zylka It is a documented abuse that takes place 6 times more often in South and East Asian Canadian families than the percentage of the national population they make up

Sorry, but your statements are not credible. You need to provide proof to back up your claim.

	02-05-2003 08:41									#64
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Yeah I did mix up UI and welfare in my first post, but it was flat out welfare.

What isn't so credible in my eyes is that the only people who defend this kind of bullsh*t always happen to be the same ethnicity as those involved. Moneky see, monkey defend - right?

Just a suggestion.

	02-05-2003 08:44									#65
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Originally posted by Zylka Yeah I did mix up UI and welfare in my first post, but it was flat out welfare. What isn't so credible in my eyes is that the only people who defend this kind of bullsh*t always happen to be the same ethnicity as those involved. Moneky see, monkey defend - right? Just a suggestion.

It's not nice to refer to East Asians as "monkeys". People might get the wrong impression about you.

I am insufferable tonight.

	02-05-2003 08:45									#66
	Put an end to popups!

OH REALLY AND WHAT IF I MYSELF AM 50% VIETNAMESE

*SOB*

	02-05-2003 08:51									#67
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quote: Originally posted by Zylka Yeah I did mix up UI and welfare in my first post, but it was flat out welfare.

Provide the proof to back up your claim. I suspect that this is just your typical racist BS.

quote: Originally posted by Zylka What isn't so credible in my eyes is that the only people who defend this kind of bullsh*t always happen to be the same ethnicity as those involved. Moneky see, monkey defend - right?

Zylka, you really need to work on your trolling.

As you mentioned earlier, you did not mention the grandmother's race. Now you're claiming that Agathon, myself and others defended her actions because we're the same race even though we didn't know her racial background. Yup, that makes a lot of sense.

Pathetic, really pathetic.

	02-05-2003 08:53									#68
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

quote: Originally posted by Dr Strangelove It's not nice to refer to East Asians as "monkeys". People might get the wrong impression about you.

I think Zylka's statement gave us the right impression of him.

	02-05-2003 08:53									#69
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i wish floyd would come back...it's not like him to abandon an argument on welfare.

	02-05-2003 08:55									#70
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And Zylka, I'll give you a chance to apologise before I ask the Mods to ban you.

	02-05-2003 08:56									#71
	Suffering from ads?

No I won't be quiet. I am sick and tired of you Scando-Arabs messing up my country.

"Blablabla oh SARS didn't come from India"
"Yarhablabla these aren't real Mangoes!!!"
"The heroin my USUAL guy provides doesn't usually have pubic hair in it!"

It's all a game to milk the PCs, ain't it?

	02-05-2003 08:57									#72
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote: Originally posted by Zylka OH REALLY AND WHAT IF I MYSELF AM 50% VIETNAMESE *SOB*

Stuff like that has been known to happen. Surrounded by a sea of white eyes you begin to identify with the majority. Perhaps you are some sort of "Uncle Diem" who has turned against his own people and become the white man's puppet. You remember what happened to Diem don't you?

	02-05-2003 08:58									#73
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quote: Originally posted by Tingkai And Zylka, I'll give you a chance to apologise before I ask the Mods to ban you.

Apologise for your mother raking in BAGS of money around the pow-wow fire??? I think not, now please identify yourself before I smack that white Irish luck clean off your smarmy blimey

	02-05-2003 09:01									#74
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Ah, the old "Make racist comments, and then act crazy" strategy. Well, who knows what the mods will make up it, but I still think we shouldn't have to put up with this racist crap.

	02-05-2003 09:02									#75
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I make good foo fo yew

	02-05-2003 09:08									#76
	Inflate your Upload Space

quote: Ah, the old "Make racist comments, and then act crazy" strategy.

Act?

	02-05-2003 09:15									#77
	Got spare money?

Alright, that was a bit too much, even for me

I am sorry TAI GUY, you must realize by now that I'll say anything to hurt someone who disagrees with my vision of Utopia

Much Love,
Canadian Bacon

	02-05-2003 10:23									#78
	Tired of ads?

yavoon is basically correct in his basic statement that the minimum wage is welfare. There is no doubt that without the minimum wage, wages would fall (duh). As minimum wage rises, those business either lay off workers or simply make their workers part-time (or make less hours). There are most definetly costs involved with raising the minimum wage (of course those could come in the form of more payments to unemployed.. ie, the cost is increasing other welfare).

That doesn't mean it is bad, however. Just you gotta be careful, because if you raise it too high (just like with regular and corporate welfare) there will exist many adverse effects.

	02-05-2003 11:07									#79
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quote: Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui yavoon is basically correct in his basic statement that the minimum wage is welfare. There is no doubt that without the minimum wage, wages would fall (duh). As minimum wage rises, those business either lay off workers or simply make their workers part-time (or make less hours). There are most definetly costs involved with raising the minimum wage (of course those could come in the form of more payments to unemployed.. ie, the cost is increasing other welfare). That doesn't mean it is bad, however. Just you gotta be careful, because if you raise it too high (just like with regular and corporate welfare) there will exist many adverse effects.

Welfare is where one group gives a subsidy to another. No one is paying a subsidy. There is no welfare.