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Kaak
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from the TWO other threads on the subject, this is what really happened :
Okay, this is how i see it after the second time watching it.
There is no matrix within a matrix. This is blatantly obvious. The only way they could make the matrix work, according to the architect, was to give humans the choice of whether or not to accept it, atleast on the most fundamental level. Zion is real, and filled with real people that are not plugged in to a matrix. It is necessary. The people who do not accept the matrix must be taken out to avoid the snowball effect. The matrix was designed to allow this, thus the ability to get in/out of the matrix. Once zion grew too large, it must be irradicated, and replanted. This goes back to what agent smith said in the first one about humans infecting an area and over running it.
The function of the one is to basically reboot the system, or atleast do a "system restore." This keeps the matrix in the desired time frame. "The matrix is older than you believe." They cannot allow humans to reach the point where they develop AI inside the matrix, as this could be catostrophic.
Now, on to specific characters.
The architect: He was not deceiving. I believe him to be incapable of it. His fundamental guiding principles are rooted in perfection, and perfection completely governs his thought process. He is exacting, and this leaves no room for the ability to lie. Things are as he said because a) he cannot lie, b) he has no reason to.
The oracle: She hinted at where she fell. She said that humans and machines needed each other. Her sole goal is to perpetuate the cycle of "reloading" by guiding the one to the source, and thereby restarting the matrix, and allowing humans and machines to coexist. She is neither for or against Neo, and as her programming, though intuitive, is no less rooted in logic.
The agents: I think they are victims of partial revelation. Just like a computer system will not give complete access to programs running inside of it, the agents operate on the information they are given. They serve the function of identifying the one, and that function alone. They probably are unaware that there have been 5 previous "ones."
Agent smithin the matrix) Agent smith is now free from the system. He said he gained something from neo, and I think we were given some foreshadowing on this as well. In the first movie, when smith was interogating morpheus, he said humans were viruses, reproducing until they overwhelm an ecosystem. What else is the matrix but an ecosystem of programs?
smith gained the virul trait, and choice from neo. This gave him power, and as the oracle said, he wanted what all men with power want, more power. He truly thinks of himself as a diety in the matrix. One quote went man:"oh god" smith:"Smith will suffice."
He is trying to take over.
Smith outside the matrix: He has infected a freed human with his "virus." The thing i think is most important here is that the title of the movie suggests repeated action. "Reloaded." As the architect suggests, this is just one more time around. This time, however, things are going differently than they ever have before. An "agent" has made it to the real world, Neo expresses choice, possibly forsaking humanity. As for smith being in the "real world" I believe this gives Neo a tie to the machines. In "destroying" Smith, Smith gained from neo, but as the merovingian said, every action has an equal and opposite reaction. Neo also gained from smith. And with smith in the "real" neo, who can control things in the matrix, is a part of something wholy of the matrix in the real world, thus his sudden connection to the machines.
The most perturbing thing about the movie to me is that this is going to end up being another one of those love conquers all things, like harry potter. I think so many people dislike this movie, as MRT said, because they don't understand what is going on. There is a lot more happening on a lot more levels. In the first matrix, they basically came out and stated everything truly philosophical in the movie. in reloaded, you must truly read into the movie, and pay attention to the finer points.
With all of this said, I'm sure that even after the seconjd time, there is a lot i missed. The rewatchability factor on this one is huge, because there is always more to catch.
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Kaak
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no, the architect specifies that he would select people from the matrix.
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Kaak
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yessssss......."It was he that freed the first of us"
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Bereta_Eder
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Come on.
The whoel thing was presented very awkwarly and all of that could be shown in 20 minutes.
Also why would the architect have no reason to lie?
what is the point of giving neo a choice between 2 doors? whereas he knew the result and could manipulate and define everything?
how did neo understand that the oracle was an AI?
since according to the architect the existance of neo is but a safety valve which needs to function and make his way to the matrix in order for the circle to start again why are the agents out to destroy him?
how come in 1st matrix neo was able to shatter smith apart, but in the 2nd he falls back on beating him?
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Bereta_Eder
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whereas he could just fly away.
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Bereta_Eder
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exactly, miss a greak fight scene, hence pleonasm. whereas every figth scene in the 1st matrix blened and linked perfectly with the plot.
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Bereta_Eder
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as said also, in the real world, neo stopped sentinels with a wave of his hands.
not to mention that smith taking over and transfering himself into zion into the brain of a human being makes no sense at all.
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Bereta_Eder
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but one of the biggest antithesis is simply this: you cant be a fully integrated matrix having a split perosnality and having on theone hand the architect wishing neo to complete the circle and break into the source whilst atthe same time have matrix agents trying to kill him.
the only schizophrenia that makes sense is that of the old renegade AI programs. and even those are very very far fetched in a matrix which was designed to this detail and control everything digital. also the oracle cannot just run around where she has such a quadressential role in the making of matrix. not to say about smith infesting the whole place like 1000 carcinomas and the matrix just going about buziness as usual, schizophrenic as it is too.
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Bereta_Eder
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also why is the keymaster so important isone thing but theres no explanation as to why the narvigians or whats their name have him and guard him. they shoudl ahve said something, like for example it is to maintain insurance that our deletion will notbe done or ANYTHINg, but nothing.
nto to mention that the agents should be all over the place trying to hunt the narvigonians or whats their name down.
and whats that about persephone wanting just ot getsome in order to help them, tottally arbitrary.
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22-05-2003 02:20
i didn't feel trip's rebuttal held water, so I didn't address it in the other thread. If the entirety of zion was wiped out, how would anyone know what had happened before?
and a "choice" between the life of someoen (again)
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