21-06-2003 02:54									#31
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quote: Originally posted by Asher Well, that's definitely your problem. This is an AGP Radeon 9700, right? If so, it looks like a bug of some kind that you'd need to deal with ATI to solve.

It's deffinately AGP. Is there even a PCI version?

	21-06-2003 03:16									#32
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Use Defrag, if that doesn't work, mess with the settings in the last picture (the ones with the microchips by them).

	21-06-2003 04:05									#33
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quote: It's deffinately AGP. Is there even a PCI version?

Doubt it very much.
-
Zylka, you should be fine, just add a little memory and drop some the whistles and bells (and -restore point- which is very resource heavy, don't really need it, XP is good )

	21-06-2003 04:40									#34
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--" I have had a huge performance hit, particularily (and I think this is the source of the problem) when loading textures."

Slowdowns when loading things from the hard drive, then?

Probably a PIO/DMA issue then. Windows (NT, 2k, XP) likes to set drives to PIO when they can use DMA for some reason. Make sure all your drives are set to use DMA if possible.

Wraith
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	21-06-2003 05:58									#35
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For those who followed my advice regarding Q811493, I checked MS's tech support site and they CLAIM to have fixed the problem and have released a revised version of the update. It is up to the individual to decide whether there's any change.

	21-06-2003 06:42									#36
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One other thing it could be is the AGP driver not liking the combination of Nforce2 chipset, Radeon 9700 and WindowsXP... which would the the motherboard maker's problem, not ATI. So check wth them too (ASUS).

Apparently lots of people are having problems with this combination - found a FAQ thread that might help (probably not yet, but if they find an answer it should turn up here).

That forum link - click me

EDIT: Also check your RAM... this motherboard hates RAM made with Infineon chips, although I suppose you'd have noticed than on Win98.

EDIT2: According to this site , there is a bug in WinXP. This guy also supplies a driver fix, but use at your own risk (I have no intention of upgrading to XP till it's been fumigated).

Last edited by Cruddy on 21-06-2003 at 17:29

	21-06-2003 09:04									#37
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A couple of things. Check for any BIOS and/or driver updates for your mobo. Also, remove the display card to have Windows recognise it again.

	21-06-2003 18:47									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger Also, remove the display card to have Windows recognise it again.

I was going to do that, but then realised that without it I wouldn't be able to connect my monitor...

	21-06-2003 18:47									#39
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?????

	21-06-2003 18:58									#40
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quote: I was going to do that, but then realised that without it I wouldn't be able to connect my monitor...

	21-06-2003 19:03									#41
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quote: Originally posted by alva ?????

You know, remove my video card and reboot without it. But my motherboard doesn't have onboard video, so I couldn't do that.

I tried uninstalling the secondary driver through the device manager but windows just puts it back in after it reboots. It detects two devices after unistalling the drivers, aswell. Damned if I know why.



Ha, there's another thing that I'm having problems with, but it started just recently and I'm not sure if it's related. Everytime I start windows, there is about a minute-long delay before any of the systerm processes (or whatever) start working. I can't log onto the internet, lookthrough device manager, ect... for a minute. I can still use windows explorer and run a few simple programs, though.

You know, I always seem to have inexplicable computer problems that no one can fix... I had a problem with my old computer, I built a new one, and had the same damn problem. I upgrade to windows XP, it was fixed, but now I have new problems. I think I'm just cursed.

	21-06-2003 19:03									#42
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I think UR meant you to reconnect it again, just to have a clean set-up?!


Am I missing something?

	21-06-2003 19:11									#43
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quote: Originally posted by alva I think UR meant you to reconnect it again, just to have a clean set-up?!

I did take it out but, as I said, realised I wouldn't be able to see what was happening so just put it back in. Taking it out and puting it back in isn't going to do a whole lot of good when the computer isn't on to know you did that.

	21-06-2003 19:35									#44
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Uninstall all the video drivers before taking it out. Putting it back in forces window to reinstall everything (but from a clean sheat).

And if you want, you can start your PC without a monitor or video-card, let it go into windows and turn it off. (not the best to do though)
If your PC doesn't want turn off, keep the power button pressed for a couple of seconds.
(I can turn my PC off blindfolded, since I put one of my mouse button to terminate programs (mainly to close windows and pop-ups). So all I have to is double-click it on the desktop and press enter.)

	21-06-2003 19:48									#45
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quote: Originally posted by alva Uninstall all the video drivers before taking it out. Putting it back in forces window to reinstall everything (but from a clean sheat).

I have. I even followed the "overly anal method of unistalling drivers guide" at Rage3d, too. I don't see how taking it out and puting it back in while the computer is off is going to make any difference. And it didn't.

	21-06-2003 20:10									#46
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Have you tried that Omega site link I posted?

The guy who runs it also has a setup like yours... which leads me to think his driver is worth trying.

Connecting a video card and powering up does no harm. The BIOS realises there is no video and usually beeps a few tirmes and closes down.

When you power up again with the video card, the BIOS recognizes something's been added and has a shot at firing up - sometimes there's no point fiddling around with Windows, you have to go all the way back to the BIOS settings.

Pain in the arse, I know.

	21-06-2003 20:19									#47
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quote: I have. I even followed the "overly anal method of unistalling drivers guide" at Rage3d, too. I don't see how taking it out and puting it back in while the computer is off is going to make any difference. And it didn't.

As long as your PC is plugged in, there is some currenrt on your MB
Therefore taking the graph card and reinstalling it might have some results.

	21-06-2003 22:11									#48
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quote: Originally posted by Osweld I was going to do that, but then realised that without it I wouldn't be able to connect my monitor...

Are there any drivers that come with the mobos you need to install? Are there any BIOS upgrades?

BTW, what I meant was removing the card from the device manager, as alva said. But nevermind.

	22-06-2003 09:43									#49
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Xp has a habit of keeping old driver info, at a glance you have the common 2 video bill gates inc flaw. Best way to get rid of that is a fresh install. Go NTFS this time.

Three things to correct your problem, make sure you have the latest bios flash to enable 400mhz fsb. Next dump the ati on that mother board go nvidia after all that is the chipset and what it was designed to use.

Next dump the 2700 grab the pc3200 I think the last point is never upgrade always do a full install.

If your local store put this machine together for you, go back to them and ask them to make the changes, nicely

If they do not give you similar and or better parts for not cost to you what so ever, complain to the manager.
Please email me for the exact reasons these changes to your machine should be done.

I will personally contact them at that point and ask them to do it for you.

The combination of these parts should never have been done in the first place. That goes for win98se or xp or what ever. The board with the video card let alone the 2700 ram is simply all mismatched.

	23-06-2003 05:10									#50
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Well, I was going to try updating my BIOS today, but ca't figure out what PCB my motherboard is. I am told that it is supposed to say the version number by the ASUS logo on the motherboard.... but I do not see it.

I did a bench mark with the performance test that comes with Norton Systemworks and my lowest scores where with the disk drive... which brings me to something I should maybe of mentioned before, I have a SATA hard drive. (Sea Gate Baracuda ST380023AS)

	23-06-2003 07:12									#51
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quote: Originally posted by Osweld Well, I was going to try updating my BIOS today, but...

Best of luck with that.

And HAVE YOU TRIED THAT OMEGA DRIVER YET?

FOR THE 2ND TIME OF ASKING?

You could at least tell me it was a crock... but judging from the write ups I've seen, it does actually sort out a lot of problems with XP, Radeon 9700 and your motherboard.

	23-06-2003 07:30									#52
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quote: Originally posted by Cruddy Best of luck with that. And HAVE YOU TRIED THAT OMEGA DRIVER YET? FOR THE 2ND TIME OF ASKING? You could at least tell me it was a crock... but judging from the write ups I've seen, it does actually sort out a lot of problems with XP, Radeon 9700 and your motherboard.

heh, no. The website looked dodgy. If haven't said I've done something, assume I haven't.



Maybe I will try that tommorow.

	23-06-2003 07:36									#53
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Omega drivers are just hacked ATI drivers, but they do ridiculous things like default the LOD bias to -3 under the impression that it increases image quality, when in reality it introduces texture aliasing...

	23-06-2003 07:39									#54
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I plan on trying a partition and new install of winXp tommorow, too.

	23-06-2003 07:42									#55
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quote: Originally posted by Asher Omega drivers are just hacked ATI drivers, but they do ridiculous things like default the LOD bias to -3 under the impression that it increases image quality, when in reality it introduces texture aliasing...

Maybe, but if it works what is the issue?

At least somebody is actually trying to find a away round the XP deficiency rather than sitting on the arse waiting for MS to do it.

	23-06-2003 07:46									#56
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quote: Originally posted by Cruddy Maybe, but if it works what is the issue? At least somebody is actually trying to find a away round the XP deficiency rather than sitting on the arse waiting for MS to do it.

Um.
If a new driver fixes the problem, why is it an XP deficiency rather than a driver deficiency?

And from what I've heard, Omega drivers cause more problems than they solve.

	23-06-2003 07:58									#57
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quote: Originally posted by Asher Um. If a new driver fixes the problem, why is it an XP deficiency rather than a driver deficiency?

Because it happens under XP but not under 98?

quote: Originally posted by Asher And from what I've heard, Omega drivers cause more problems than they solve.

Well, do tell. I'm pretty sure I made it clear that any 3rd party drivers are used at your own risk... But like I said before, if they work, what is the issue?

	23-06-2003 08:16									#58
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quote: Originally posted by Cruddy Because it happens under XP but not under 98?

Do you realize that Win2K/XP and Win98 have entirely different drivers?

Just because it's not a bug with the 98 drivers but is with the XP drivers doesn't mean it's an XP problem. It means the XP driver has a bug...which isn't exactly a rare thing for ATI drivers.

quote: Well, do tell. I'm pretty sure I made it clear that any 3rd party drivers are used at your own risk... But like I said before, if they work, what is the issue?

If they work, there is no issue. They're just stupid drivers some geeks with too much spare time did with stock ATI drivers and tweaking settings.

They're a waste of time IMO, which is why no one takes them seriously in the 3D graphics communities.

	23-06-2003 08:27									#59
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quote: Originally posted by Asher Do you realize that Win2K/XP and Win98 have entirely different drivers? Just because it's not a bug with the 98 drivers but is with the XP drivers doesn't mean it's an XP problem. It means the XP driver has a bug...which isn't exactly a rare thing for ATI drivers.

I suggest you go back to the start of this thread and read. Osweld's problems do not occur on 98. They happen on XP. I suggest you READ the Omega site before dismissing it.

Do the words "overly protective" or "precious" mean anything to you, Mr "Sieg Heil Bill"?

quote: Originally posted by Asher If they work, there is no issue. They're just stupid drivers some geeks with too much spare time did with stock ATI drivers and tweaking settings. They're a waste of time IMO, which is why no one takes them seriously in the 3D graphics communities.

The 3D graphics communities? The mind boggles. Do these communities take the issue of a nice set of hardware being a COMPLETE PILE OF JUNK UNDER XP?

Sounds like a screwed up set of priorities to me.

Maybe it will work, maybe it won't. It's Osweld's call. By the way Osweld, if they don't work you were going to do a reformat and reinstall anyway... So where is the harm in trying them?

	23-06-2003 08:34									#60
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quote: Originally posted by Cruddy I suggest you go back to the start of this thread and read. Osweld's problems do not occur on 98. They happen on XP. I suggest you READ the Omega site before dismissing it.

I understand that.

What you do not seem to understand is that XP and 98 are entirely different codebases, and XP drivers and 98 drivers are entirely different codebases.

So when upgrading from 98 to XP, and you run into problems, it's not an XP problem by default. In this case, ATI's XP drivers or the motherboard's XP drivers are clearly to blame.

You're making a ridiculous conclusion that it's an XP flaw. What's even more ridiculous is you say yourself that frequently using a new driver fixes the problem, but you still insist this is an XP flaw.

Why don't you think about that a bit before replying again to save me time and you further embarassment?

quote: The 3D graphics communities? The mind boggles. Do these communities take the issue of a nice set of hardware being a COMPLETE PILE OF JUNK UNDER XP? Sounds like a screwed up set of priorities to me.

Man, you're losing it...

It's not the 3D graphics communities problem if ATI/motherboard drivers have bugs.

You're welcome to come join Beyond3D to discuss this further with me. ATI, Nvidia, Matrox, etc. all have driver developers who post there, like feedback, and help out. There's also a bunch of game developers and hardware reviewers from many sites that post regularly there.

They'll just tell you what I've been saying.

And go ahead and ask them what they think of the Omega drivers.