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MichaeltheGreat
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Apolyton Grand Executioner
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mooning the house that Ruth built.
Oct 1999
time: 21:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Patroklos
Jesus people, you basically ran out all those who were having (except for a few rants) a rather good discussion, and turned it into a pissing contest over one of the most stupid things I have yet to read on these forums. I used to think the liberals I argue against were the most ignorant people around. I stand corrected.
You both seem to agree that you are adults, so how about after this post we just don't here anything else from either of you. Unless is is OT  |
The simple procedure for reasonable folks who like to have reasonable discussions that stay OT is to hit that complaint button when the thread starts to go off course. That way we can clean it up before it gets out of hand. When the first complaint I see is someone whining about someone else's signature, and the off the topic pissing match is already going full bore, then it's a little late.
At this point, talking about Bush's reelection chances is absurdly premature, even if Bush had support numbers in the Gray Davis range. There is no recall, so you have the full 16 months to go, which is virtual eternity in electoral politics. You'd be hard pressed to make intelligent predictions six months from now, and you're on pretty shaky ground right up until next summer, at least.
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gopher
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I eat my own poop
Dec 1999
time: 00:29
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Springer for Senate!
Edit: Jerry! Jerry!
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MichaeltheGreat
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Apolyton Grand Executioner
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mooning the house that Ruth built.
Oct 1999
time: 21:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Patroklos
Bieng one of those serviceman, you are hard pressed to find any who think Bush's war policy is wrong. |
Currently serving, or former?
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We all knew we would be there longer than he said because we know how this works, the comments were for civilian armchair generals who think everything is life is easy and free.
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Actually, they're called taxpayers, and we/they foot the bills. We/they also deal with the results of overcommitment of forces, excessive focus on threats of limited immediate potential (i.e. Iraq should come behind the DPRK)
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If we doing the dying can handle the casualties (not that we like it, but some things are worth dying for, and if you are not in the service don't bother adding your two cents to that comment because you have no right to. No matter how much you think you do trunst me you don't. Free speech says you can say what you want, not that you should) so can you. If we think Bush is handling things IN THIS ASSPECT of his presidency well, then you should take our enlightended word for it.
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Maybe you're an O9 in CentCom, or work at ISE-McPherson, so you have a more enlightened view, but the average 11-Bravo, 11-Mike, 12-Bravo, 33, etc. on the ground has a worm's eye view at best.
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You actually attacked Bush for personally going to a returning ship to welcome the boys home and give them a job well done.
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On the drive home, I can generally see returning CV's when they're flying off planes and getting ready to come into port at North Island. They don't normally hang around within sight of shore (or at least elevated points on the Mexican side, so they weren't readily visible from Mt. Soledad or elevated shoreline sites in San Diego) for 3-4 days to handle all their pre-docking stuff. It's usually about 2 days, tops.
Bush could have "welcomed the boys home" in any number of ways, in any number of places, far less obtrusive (and delaying of family reunions, etc.) than a stunt landing on a carrier deck, to use it as the backdrop for a political speech. If Bush's daddy had done it, it would at least have a tinge more credibility, Bush sr. earned naval aviator's wings, but if Bush's real goal was to welcome the troops, he had dozens of other opportunities which presented at least less nominal risk to the Commander in Chief, which cost less taxpayer money, and which were less promoted as publicity seeking stunts. It's not as low as Clinton going to Walter Reed to try to get photo-ops with wounded Rangers, I'll hand you that, but it's still not particularly appropriate top-level leadership.
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Because of course the leader of the nation and our Commander and Chief has no buisness doing that, right? |
Considering the cost of carrier flight ops, the cost of getting the President to the opposite coast with his entourage and both security and secure Comms/CP, etc., while the budget is ass over teakettle and people are out of jobs, Bush could pick more appropriate leadership style.
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That in itself is why the Bush will win, because all his opponents have a nasty habit of shooting themselves in the head. |
They do that, but Bush has an as-yet untapped ability to screw up as well. The rough, tough, Sheriff George act will only take him so far. Let's see how those deficit and employment numbers shape up with the "the world is a safer place because I dusted Saddam" rhetoric.
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chegitz guevara
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Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Dissident
but the democrats threw away all the military votes- most of whom voted for Bush |
Actually, they didn't. As soon as the Republicans started bleating about how the Dem's were trying to take away military votes, the Dem's stopped challenging the thousands of illegal absentee ballots that were coming in after the election. They were neither signed, nor witnessed, nor were they post-marked before the election. They never should have been counted. This is another place where the Republicans broke the law and the Democrats let them.
Meanwhile, 90,000 legal voters were declared ineligible by Bush, simply because they shared some data in common with a felon, including some for crimes that were aparently committed in the future.
There was nothing fair and square about it. I got stamped with the approval of SCOTUS and Congress, so it's legal, but it sure as hell shouldn't have been.
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MichaeltheGreat
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Apolyton Grand Executioner
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mooning the house that Ruth built.
Oct 1999
time: 21:29
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara
Actually, they didn't. As soon as the Republicans started bleating about how the Dem's were trying to take away military votes, the Dem's stopped challenging the thousands of illegal absentee ballots that were coming in after the election. They were neither signed, nor witnessed, nor were they post-marked before the election. They never should have been counted. This is another place where the Republicans broke the law and the Democrats let them.
Meanwhile, 90,000 legal voters were declared ineligible by Bush, simply because they shared some data in common with a felon, including some for crimes that were aparently committed in the future.
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Somebody must have done a good job mummifying this horse, for it to hold up under this much beating this long after it's dead.
Voter eligibility and registration is preliminarily handled at the county level, and you have county administrators and state officials of both parties playing games all the time, all over the country, to further the interest of their own political parties. The Democrat Cali SecState just got handslapped by an appellate court for foot-dragging and scoping games on counting whether there are enough valid signatures to recall Davis. A month or so of delay, and Davis can duck the issue until the March primary, when the liberal Dems in the state would be out in force.
Instead of *****ing past tense ad nauseum (and turning off a large portion of the electorate who is more interested in real issues than one-trick pony carping about an election which is now irrelevant), what happened to any concerted movement to enforce minimum standards for conduct of Federal elections?  Why fix a problem, when it's so much easier to just ***** about it, right?
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There was nothing fair and square about it. I got stamped with the approval of SCOTUS and Congress, so it's legal, but it sure as hell shouldn't have been. |
The fact it's legal makes it fair and square. If you don't like the results the law allows, change the laws.
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chegitz guevara
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Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:29
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quote:
Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat
Voter eligibility and registration is preliminarily handled at the county level, and you have county administrators and state officials of both parties playing games all the time, all over the country, to further the interest of their own political parties. |
This is true, but here in Florida, the county administrators were told by the Sec of State they could not do this under the law and had to accept the scrubbed lists they were handed by the contractor. Meanwhile, the State told the contract to use as wide a net as possible on the names (despite the law saying it must be as narrow as possible) telling them that the counties will fix the lists. As the same people did the communicating to both the contactor and the counties, it's not a matter of one hand not being aware of the other hand.
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The Democrat Cali SecState just got handslapped by an appellate court for foot-dragging and scoping games on counting whether there are enough valid signatures to recall Davis. |
At least he got handslapped before he got away with it. Despite the unethical nature of the recall campaign, it is legal and legitimate.
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Instead of *****ing past tense ad nauseum (and turning off a large portion of the electorate who is more interested in real issues than one-trick pony carping about an election which is now irrelevant), what happened to any concerted movement to enforce minimum standards for conduct of Federal elections? |
I'm absolutely in agreement, and I want to start a campaign here in Florida to fix out elections. I am, however, in the wrong part of the state to easily build a critical mass towards getting the necessary amendments on the ballot. But *****ing is often a necessary precursor to doing. After all, if people don't know what went wrong, they aren't apt to change it. Right now people assume it was incompetence rather than malfeasence.
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The fact it's legal makes it fair and square. If you don't like the results the law allows, change the laws. |
What happened in Florida was illegal under the laws of Florida. That makes it, by definition, not fair and square. However, the gutless Dems refused to challange what they did know was going wrong (the stuff about the list scrubbing didn't come out until the following February, when it was too late to do anything but drag Jeb and Kate Harris to jail).
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Mordoch
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Denver, Colorado
Jan 2002
time: 05:29
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quote:
Originally posted by Kidicious
Might be enough to win if the election was today, but it has dropped tremendously and hardly anyone even knows who the challengers are. |
Actually a far more significant poll number is that in a recent Zogby poll, "For the first time, more likely voters (47%) say it's time for someone new in the White House, compared to 46% who said the President deserves to be re-elected. "
http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=721
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gopher
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I eat my own poop
Dec 1999
time: 00:29
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REMF: Rear Echilon Mother F**kers
A nice way of saying Brass, Stateside, or civillian.
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Apolyton Time is 00:29. |
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21-07-2003 04:57
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