14-08-2003 19:59									#31
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quote: Originally posted by JohnT So, if somebody pours sugar in your gas tank, that is the fault of the manufacturer?

It is if there are 50 holes leading to your gas tank, each larger than the last and prefitted with a funnel.

	14-08-2003 20:08									#32
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quote: Originally posted by geeslaka It is if there are 50 holes leading to your gas tank, each larger than the last and prefitted with a funnel.

More like finding an obscure way when shaking the car violently at a certain angle, it can pop open your gas tank cover and you could then poor sugar in it.

And even then, what if the manufacturer fixes it free of charge a month earlier before someone attempts it?

	14-08-2003 20:13									#33
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Quick Question. How many possible ports are there anyway?

	14-08-2003 20:16									#34
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In all or NetBios? NetBios has five: 135, 137-139 and SSL 445. In all there are 65536 ports.

	14-08-2003 20:44									#35
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quote: Originally posted by JohnT So, if somebody pours sugar in your gas tank, that is the fault of the manufacturer?

You think that analogy is appropiate?

Really, John, if car makers make their products as crappy as MS software, there would be huge riots on the streets.

	14-08-2003 20:55									#36
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger You think that analogy is appropiate? Really, John, if car makers make their products as crappy as MS software, there would be huge riots on the streets.

Not really. All the rioters would be busy restarting their cars all the time, and would probably have dead batteries. The cars would so continually try to "help" them that they'd probably never manage to drive them even if they had sufficient juice-they'd be too busy trying to keep the radio from giving them advice. And they certainly couldn't carry a gun, crowbar or even a molotov in their cars, since said cars would instantly destroy any product not manufactured by Ford that entered their domain...

	14-08-2003 20:56									#37
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quote: Really, John, if car makers make their products as crappy as MS software, there would be huge riots on the streets.

Where's the riots?

	14-08-2003 20:59									#38
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger You think that analogy is appropiate? Really, John, if car makers make their products as crappy as MS software, there would be huge riots on the streets.

Yes, I do. It is irrelevant whether somebody purposely destroys a "quality" product or a "bad" product - pour sugar into a Porsche or a Ford Pinto, it doesn't matter which, and you're going to have seriously pissed off owners either way. The issue here is not the quality of the MS product, but the quality of the people who purposely destroy others work/info because they are mad at somebody else. You think it is ok take a bat to your Honda motorcycle because I happen to feel that Honda makes crap product? Is that what you kids now mean by "standing by your principles"?

Such a position strikes me as, at best, morally vacuous. Really, now... didn't your parents train you better than that?

	14-08-2003 21:00									#39
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quote: Originally posted by Elok Not really. All the rioters would be busy restarting their cars all the time, and would probably have dead batteries. The cars would so continually try to "help" them that they'd probably never manage to drive them even if they had sufficient juice-they'd be too busy trying to keep the radio from giving them advice. And they certainly couldn't carry a gun, crowbar or even a molotov in their cars, since said cars would instantly destroy any product not manufactured by Ford that entered their domain...

Did you copy that from somewhere? Good one though

	14-08-2003 21:01									#40
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Yeah John, It's the MS bug and that stupid filipino teenager who wrote the worm that have ruined my last coulpe of days

	14-08-2003 21:09									#41
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quote: Originally posted by JohnT Yes, I do. It is irrelevant whether somebody purposely destroys a "quality" product or a "bad" product - pour sugar into a Porsche or a Ford Pinto, it doesn't matter which, and you're going to have seriously pissed off owners either way. The issue here is not the quality of the MS product, but the quality of the people who purposely destroy others work/info because they are mad at somebody else. You think it is ok take a bat to a Honda motorcycle because I happen to feel that Honda makes crap product?

I am surprised that you can miss the central issue so utterly.

The central issue is not about people who purposefully vandal, but about manufacters who sell people products without the testing and quality assurance that should go with consumer products. If your car stalls and dies when somebody hits it with a pea, what would you think?

quote: Originally posted by JohnT Such a position strikes me as, at best, morally vacuous. Really, now... didn't your parents train you better than that?

Personal attack eh? Talking about speaking out from both sides of your mouth.

	14-08-2003 21:16									#42
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger I am surprised that you can miss the central issue so utterly. The central issue is not about people who purposefully vandal, but about manufacters who sell people products without the testing and quality assurance that should go with consumer products. If your car stalls and dies when somebody hits it with a pea, what would you think?

Surely you know better than this.

Do you know how utterly impossible it is to test every possible scenerio for every line of a 40M line operating system, on every possible configuration of hardware?

You're lost in space, man.

And since when do "consumer products" demand perfection that you imply here?

And your pea analogy is just bad, a more proper analogy is if somebody clogs your exhaust pipe and it screws up, what would you think.

	14-08-2003 22:32									#43
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger I am surprised that you can miss the central issue so utterly. The central issue is not about people who purposefully vandal, but about manufacters who sell people products without the testing and quality assurance that should go with consumer products. If your car stalls and dies when somebody hits it with a pea, what would you think?

And it is obvious that YOU are missing the central issue here - somebody is destroying other peoples property because of their anger at a third party. This is so blatant that I can't believe we're having this discussion - your argument boils down to "MS makes shabby products so it is OK to randomly destroy computers that use them."

My God.

Personal attack? Your position is offensive, so yeah, I took a walk on the wild side. Deal with it.

	14-08-2003 22:39									#44
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Let's say that you own a Dodge, and someone feels that Dodges are lame and decides to go around put sugar in all Dodge's gas tanks. Yet, Dodge finds out about this plan so the go around to all the Dodge's first and place a lockable gas cap on each of your dashes saying use this gas cap so that you won't get hit. However, because you are to lazy to do so you are hit by this vandal... Who's fault is it?

I say yours, they did everything to help prevent it, just that nobody listened.

	14-08-2003 22:44									#45
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I know I'm a bit behind, but is this the virus that Asher posted about a month or so ago? Or do I need to update again?

	14-08-2003 22:58									#46
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Goodonya Asher, thanks to you my machine was patched a month ago.

	15-08-2003 00:30									#47
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger Did you copy that from somewhere? Good one though

Nope, I was just in a sarcastic mood, as happens frequently. I figured this thread could use some levity...anyway, thanks.

	15-08-2003 12:34									#48
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quote: That is an important semantic game that MS is playing now, if things are not default activated, even if they are remote root compromises, they are not critical. At best, you can call this splitting hairs. I just put in my first Windows 2003 server Tuesday morning, having set it up over the weekend. The first thing it does is present you with a wizard to turn these things back on, the server is utterly useless without them. How useless? Well, there is no file sharing, printer sharing, web servers, directory, or anything else by on by default. It is a really expensive XP console with "Professional" replaced by Server on the start menu. So, the first thing you do is activate the services you need, so the box can, oh, I don't know, do anything. Hours later, you are 0wn3d by a worm, and life gets fun, and cleanup is a *****. Remember, because you were dumb enough to turn on something as obviously dangerous a file sharing on a server, it is your problem, not MS's. Why should they rate things like that critical, it is purely optional.

This is great.

The whole thing here.

	15-08-2003 13:09									#49
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The problem with any popular OS is that it will be used by idiots who think that the monitor is the entire computer and the large metal thing next to their feet is something to kick when they get bored.

	15-08-2003 13:47									#50
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quote: Originally posted by geeslaka The problem with any popular OS is that it will be used by idiots who think that the monitor is the entire computer and the large metal thing next to their feet is something to kick when they get bored.

I have to disagree with you. Normally, an idiot drives a car but the manufacturere has a responsibility for the product (car). Nobody gives you a car which has a serious security problem and then you go to... the trees. And then say "it's alright, i am an idiot"!
Microsoft has great problems with this HIJACK attack (not virus). Two days I was trying to solve the problem, I had 5 times make format to my HD, I have make 5 NEW installs with OS (EWindows 2000) but the problem remained. Because this 'hijack' was hiding into DOS install information!
So the solution wasn't the new 'updates' from McAfee, Symantec and Sophos: these things DOESN'T work! You have to download the NEW Service Pack 4 from Microsoft (don't try tosearch it on WindowsUpdate, go direct to the first page of Microsoft.com).

	15-08-2003 14:50									#51
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Government officials said quickly ruled out the "Blaster" computer worm as a cause. The worm was spreading from computer to computer Wednesday and was initially considered a potential cause.

The outage did slow the Internet, however, because Web sites powered from servers in affected cities were unable to respond to requests to view the pages. Also, experts said, the Internet may be trying to reroute itself to cover for unresponsive servers.

	15-08-2003 15:24									#52
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quote: the Internet may be trying to reroute itself

Moronic news services!
Sorry folks, the Internet has no power to reroute itself. However, it may be rerouted by people changing the computers.

	15-08-2003 16:37									#53
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M$

	15-08-2003 21:26									#54
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LOL: The domain name msblast.com is up for sale on eBay. Current bid is $1.04

Asmodean

	15-08-2003 23:15									#55
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Hot damn. It's up to $10.50

Asmodean