16-01-2000 23:18									#31
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

You people will never stop calling me temba will you? ah well....

JP - Dost mine ears decieve me? A ww2 nazi scenario that starts out with short turns? That could be really good! I don't mind long turns at all, Red Front had really long turns too...espescially with all those generated german units...frikakfakffjkkj

I think what Darthveda meant by "no mercy" was that he would take points away where they were deserved and not give a high score simply because they like the scenario author. For instance if the sceanario deserves a 4/10 in playability he'll give it a 4/10 in playability and so will I. I don't mince my words in reviews and neither should anyone else. Of course If it turns out I do hate this scenario and can't play more than a few turns of it of course I won't review it because you really have to play the whole scenario to reveal it.

I will continue to express my opinions of this scenario when the information is available. If you don't want opinions, don't post on forums.

------------------
My life has no purpose...My life has no direction...No Aim...No Meaning...And yet I'm Happy...I can't figure it out...What am I doing right? -Snoopy-

	17-01-2000 00:06									#32
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Yes Temba, er ah phoenix (however you spell it no offense), this scenario will start off with very short turns. How?

Well it starts off in 1939, so basically the only 3 AI players who will have movable units are Germany, Russia, and the Poles *barbarians*, so basically, you finish the turn as fast as you want to. If you are into micromanagement, you can micromanage on the first turn, but I will do my best to make sure that you are producing what you should be to save some time.

The turns only really start to heat up in April of '40 with the invasion of Norway, and then the next month's invasion of France, but, again, I will take away movement capabilities of the Red Army so that only the Allies (UK and France combined), and Germany can move. It should help to shorten turns.

The longest turns kick in after June of '41 since Germany, Russia, and the Allies will all have movable units non-stop for the rest of the scenario, but hopefully some interesting events will keep you interested after that time.

So basically I aim to hook you early with easy fun conquests, and then drag you into the death ride with the faint hope that you can prevent total catastrophe! (very slim chance)...

Thank you,

------------------
John Petroski
JPski7@aol.com

	17-01-2000 00:27									#33
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Nick, sure you're computer won't suddenly lose all it's data again?

Anyway, Nick's just set up a safety net if the scenario gets a bad review, he now has the option of blaming it on personal hatred rather than the scenario's quality. Now, Nick, don't get me wrong, I personally don't hate you and I don't think everyone here does either.

I would offer to review the scenario since I don't have any personal hatred towards any of you, but I'd be biased as I personally love WWII history.

	17-01-2000 01:51									#34
	Increase the size of your Attachments

Woohoo! We actually get to attack Norway? YES! Who controls Norway? I think making the Poles Barbarians is the best choice, can they move thier units on the first few turns? I'm assuming that Germany and Russia will be allied in the beginning so Germany can't smash em up while they're immobile. But what about the Poles attacking Russia? (If they're barbarians they will).

Will there be any house rules (other than don't sell solar plants)? In Antstieg I thought there were too many house rules to really remember while playing. And the micromanagement is rather critical to set up at first because ww2 scenarios should be more oriented towards fighting than building infrastructure.

Mao, LOL!

	17-01-2000 02:00									#35
	Suffering from ads?

Phoenix, Here is roughly who can move at what time periods to help you understand this abit:

Sep 1939: Germany, Barbarians, Russia
Oct 1939- April 1940: Germany
April 1940-June 1941: Germany, Allies
June 1941- May 1945: Germany, Allies, Russia

Norway is under the control of a new country called "Beneluxdenor" 0r Belgium, Netherlands, Luxembourg, Denmark, and Norway. Since this country should be erradicated in 8 turns (2 month period), it is allright to include them all in the same country. The only house rule is to not attack the lowlands till may of 1940, only Denmark and Norway before that.

The Polish barbarians also include the Baltic states, for Russia to take over. Germany can only take over so many cities that are barbarian without going to a premature war with russia, so beware! (and in this scenario, you start off with very innadequate units, you need to builed up your army before france!)

Germany and Russia start off as allies, but certain "what if circumstances" can alter this prematurely of June 22 1941 when the alliance is automatically broken.

This scenario will introduce a few new key features to WW2 scenarios as Germany. Mainly, you dont start off the game with enough units to conquer more than Poland. You must builed (and recieve a few through events), enough infantry, tanks, AT Guns, fighters, bombers, and ships to win the game. If you go for all out tanks, you will lose. If you go for all out planes, you will lose. If you go for all out Ships, you will lose. You need to balance your forces that you are creating, or, lose.

Should be fun fer some of ya!

Thanks,


------------------
John Petroski
JPski7@aol.com

	17-01-2000 03:30									#36
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

No, no, Mao, I think you DO hate me personally, since you always direct all attention to me by flaming...

	17-01-2000 03:37									#37
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

And, no, only if its reviewed by DarthVeda, my *absent-minded* friend.

	17-01-2000 05:15									#38
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

That's flaming? Really? I think I can do a lot better than that. Nick, I'm sorry, but you can't just go around saying things like that and setting up a safety net for yourself. And I don't hate you. Whether or not you think I do is immaterial, as I'm the only one that can decide that. I personally hate very few people if any at all. And you've frankly done nothing bad enough to incur my hate.

	17-01-2000 06:49									#39
	Increase Your PM Length

New units by Allard Hoffelt and myself, new fall and spring terrains by Captain Nemo, new innovations in scenario making.. What else could you want?

(can anyone else tell that my last two posts have been desperately trying to change the "flamer" subject and get the thread back on to the scenario or am i the only one?)

Thank you,


------------------
John Petroski
JPski7@aol.com

	17-01-2000 08:45									#40
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Nope, I'm oblvious Sorry. I apologize for adding to this subject. Anyway, will there be much action in the North Africa Theatre? Are there personalized units? (i.e. Von Paulus, Zhukov, Rommel)

	17-01-2000 11:32									#41
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Only Nick Clark would start a thead about a subject and then try to ruin it. Mao and DarthVeda just ignore him like the rest of us do, this scenario might be worthwhile even if they let him help with it!

JP - I have some questsions...are there specific objects? Like CONQUER OSLO BY TURN 20 and such? Or is it just YOU CAN ATTACK NORWAY ANY TIME BEGIN NOW, something like that? Is the objectives system used or is there a victory system per cities conquered or what?

Is research going to be through actual science or turn based or conquest based events (which would keep it accurate, I suppose), Is allied and russian reseach going to get boosts from the events if you start pulling ahead of them (a la Aufstieg)? How many units slots are used in this game? You will have batch files, right? Is there going to be new sound? And I would also like to know about unique units and quests and such?

	17-01-2000 14:11									#42
	Put an end to popups!

Don't you mean Anstieg, (New temba nickname !) Penix.

	17-01-2000 21:09									#43
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Which brings another question. Will there be like infinite Russian and allied units coming at you via events? Like in Red Front, when you killed one wermacht, like 5 appeared, or are you depending on the AI to produce units?

	17-01-2000 21:19									#44
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Please don't let the AI build their own units!! They're too stupid!

And I think we're asking to many questions for a scenario that, I think, is still in the early stages...

------------------
President of the Apolyton Workers' Union

"Workers of All the World, Unite!!"

	17-01-2000 23:31									#45
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Not sure, I think John was planning on that though, it would be pretty cool to have mass number of weak troops try to thwart your attacks.

And the sound is going great! I have made a few infantry sounds, now I am hunting for speeches and music-type sounds. This will be fun.

	17-01-2000 23:36									#46
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

I've got a couple of Stalin speaches downloaded if that would be of any help...

	18-01-2000 00:18									#47
	Support Apolyton

You know, there are many different ways that "Fast Eddie" could be interperted

And yes I do think we are asking too many questions about a scenario that is still just being built. It sounds great, though!

------------------
I got mushrooms, I got acid, I got bags of asprin tablets, I'm your brother when you need some more weed to set you free. You know me, I'm your friend when you need a mini thin... Eminem

	18-01-2000 02:00									#48
	Support Apolyton

Well, Phoenix, to answer your question regarding Norway and how it will be brought up, it will go something like this:

I still need to figure out how i will have the events run. I dont know which of the 3 is the best way to do it, so I will leave it up to you fellas.

Choice 1: You are the top Field Marschall of the German Armed Forces, you and you alone plan and direct the attacks on certain objectives which the Fuhrer orders you to attack. "Congratulations, your Panzers are doing very well on the first day of the assault on Poland".

Choice 2: Events are real-time, as in you get "News flashes" and magazine reports such as in "Signal". "Today at 4:15am the German army stormed Poland"

Choice 3: Narrative POV: "September 1st, 1939: At 4:15am the German army launched the invasion of Poland, thus starting WW2".

I personally prefer choice 3. The others are really really weird.

As for special units: No, there are no Zhukov's, Paulus, or Rommel's. there is not enough units space to do so.

As for how many units that will be used throughout the scenario, well over 200. This is considering that each unit upgrades as time goes on, and that each unit has a winter, and summer "skin".

The AI will get a tremoundous advantage in units from december of '41 onwards. You can expect the Russians to have masses of troops that you can not deal with, and so many tanks and warplanes that you have no real choice but to go on the defensive around '43.

Russia will require 75% of your units that you produce just to hold the front, and once the Americans and Brits open up a 2nd front in Italy, and then a 3rd in Normandy, you are in for alot of trouble, especially since the American forces will be just as numerous as the Russians.

All in all, win early, plan defense even earlier. Or lose everything.

Thank you,

------------------
John Petroski
JPski7@aol.com

	18-01-2000 02:07									#49
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Are the Germans going to be able to see all the map? Please say they won't...

And I like choice 3, as well.
[This message has been edited by Djugashvili (edited January 17, 2000).]

	18-01-2000 04:32									#50
	Got spare money?

DJug,
I have not really thought about that yet... It would help me decide if you told me why they should not have complete view of the map.

Thanks,


------------------
John Petroski
JPski7@aol.com

	18-01-2000 05:19									#51
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Yes, but none more creative, Phoe .

I'm actually surprised this got to 50 posts...

	18-01-2000 20:32									#52
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

sorry hit tab then enter, my bad.

JP
[This message has been edited by JPetroski (edited January 18, 2000).]

	18-01-2000 20:34									#53
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Well,
Im not too sure on what the map situation so far as fog of war will be.. I dont see it as neccesary personally since barely any civs will be able to move units, there should not be that large of turns unless you have "show enemy moves" on...

What does the Civ2 community think?

	18-01-2000 23:51									#54
	Got spare money?

I think you should reveal the whole map to the germans, but not using the "reveal whole map" command, but with placing 2 view units and then destroying them. This works out better. I also think choice three is the best, even if it might be innacurate in terms of the scenario (say I invade in 1938 instead of 37, ya know?).

	19-01-2000 00:00									#55
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

Unfortunately, you wont really have too much of a choice Phoenix as to when you invade. Basically, you can only attack Poland in 1939, Norway and France in 1940, and so on. Of course, what cities you take and when, especially in the Russian front is all your choice.

Thank you,

------------------
John Petroski
JPski7@aol.com

	19-01-2000 04:07									#56
	Increase Your PM Length

so you can't make peace at all?

	19-01-2000 04:21									#57
	Increase Your PM Length

Nope, unfortuantely, you are doomed right from the start to have to play the scenario constantly at war with no hope of getting out of it unless you prove to be victorious.

Thanks,

------------------
John Petroski
JPski7@aol.com