04-11-2003 02:51									#1
	Tools for documentation and development Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

A lot of different people are bringing forth a lot of different tools and sites we could use for the documentation and further development of the source code. Right now a lot of people are just playing around a bit with the code, which I think is fine for the moment. But soon we'll want to seriously get organised.

I'd like to use this thread to discuss which tools, standards and other aids are out there that could help us in our process, and which ones we actually want to use (since a lot of those tools do the same things).

For now I mostly want to hear suggestions on what tools/websites/standards/etc are out there. I've already heard things like Sourceforge, Modzilla, doxygen and various CVS tools, but I'm sure there are others as well.

Please list any tools you think might be useful. Make sure you include links, brief descriptions of what they are/do (a lot of people here only program as a hobby and are not familiar with what kind of tools are out there) and what makes your tools so good, what sets them apart from similar tools. This info doesn't have to be extremely detailed (maybe 3 or 4 lines would suffice), but it should be enough to give us an idea of what's out there, to help us decide what to use.

For many tools I could probably post all this data myself, but I'd like to spend the little time that I have on more useful things. If you don't care enough to write down a few lines on why your favourite tool is so great, I doubt it is

	04-11-2003 02:53									#2
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Oh, I suppose this could be both for specific programs (e.g. Bugzilla) or for general tools (e.g. 'some kind of CVS server').

	04-11-2003 23:48									#3
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Bumping my own thread.

I've been in email contact with Activision and I have some good news: we are allowed not only to use CVS, but we're also allowed to use it an external server for it (i.e. we're not restricted to Apolyton). I won't repeat everything I was told, but basically we can do with the source code whatever we want, as long as one condition applies: everyone who has access to the code must have agreed to the EULA. As Activision puts it: "If the material is available outside of the downloaded file [i.e. the exe installer, LOQ] then the EULA will need to be part of the page that requires someone to agree to the EULA before accessing the source code". I think for most tools and sites we might want to use this could be arranged...

Now the first tool I'd like to suggest for use in this project is obviously CVS.

Name: (Win)CVS
URL: http://www.cvshome.org
Description: A CVS server (CVS = Concurrent Versions
System) is a server used to synchronise the work of several people working on the same project. Basically it keeps a copy of the source code from which
people download files to work on and to which they can upload updates of those files when they're done with them. With CVS all programmers (and others involved) will always have access to the latest version of the source code, as long as they have an Internet connection. It's designed to prevent conflicts when several people work on the same file: when several different versions of the same file are submitted, it will when it's (savely) possible try merge them. CVS software is available on most platforms, so Linux/Mac developers can use it as well.

One note with CVS is that you need to set up a server for it. One option would be to use Apolyton for this, another to use some external server (e.g. sourceforge or other). The possibility of using Apolyton as a CVS server is currently being considered by the administration, but I have no final info on that yet. For the time being assume that Apolyton and external server are equally viable options. Which would we prefer?

	04-11-2003 23:59									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

I suspect external servers (especially sourceforge) would have a problem with our requiring a EULA agreement prior to download, so I think using Apolyton as a server would probably be administratively easier.

	05-11-2003 00:55									#5
	Suffering from ads?

quote: Originally posted by Locutus "If the material is available outside of the downloaded file [i.e. the exe installer, LOQ] then the EULA will need to be part of the page that requires someone to agree to the EULA before accessing the source code".

If I understand this correctly, attaching some source files is not quite ok, could it be arragened so that if you download an attachment in this forum that you have to aggree to the EULA before you can download the attachments?

-Martin

	05-11-2003 00:58									#6
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

This is indeed great news. I have a feeling that someone inside Activision actively supports our efforts here.

Great news, Locutus.

Asmodean

	05-11-2003 02:57									#7
	Full PM-box? Change here!

im very glad that we can use CVS but ill leave it to someone else to ague its usefullness and just assume that we will use it.

I do want to put a good word in for Bugzilla http://www.bugzilla.org
Bugzilla is a database for storing and managing known bugs, it is very usefull for tracking what bugs are still unresolved, who is working on a specific issue and what solution was found to a fixed bug (including what part of the code it involved). Best of all: it integrates with CVS.

I hope this is what you wanted Locotus

klaus

	05-11-2003 03:14									#8
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

That's about what I was thinking of kaan

However, briefly reading through the website, it seems to be written in Perl. I'm not sure if it'll be possible to run it in on Apolyton then, as we do everything in PHP these days...

	05-11-2003 03:42									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I just read the terms of use on Souceforge and i have bad news.
They only host for projects that operate with an OSI approved Open Source license and that pretty much leaves us out in the cold. All hope is not lost however, they have a rubber paragraph just after that allows them to take in projects that they deem worthy. That would mean that we would have to apply for a review of the activision license to be approved on Sourceforge.

I thought you would want to know

klaus

	05-11-2003 05:34									#10
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

Well, that certainly is bad news. For the time being I think that rules out Sourceforge...

	07-11-2003 21:04									#11
	Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

Sooner or later we will have to make some kind of design drawing, be it UML or whatever.
For this purpose i recommend the program Dia.
http://www.lysator.liu.se/~alla/dia/

Dia is a technical drawing program designed to make any tecnical drawing imagineable. For our needs this program is basicly everything we could wish for:
Its very usefull for this kind of work.
Its very easy to use.
Its free software (both as in speech and as in beer).
Its a small download.
Its available for both linux and windows (and i guess Mac osX too).

kaan

	07-11-2003 23:21									#12
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

To use CVS in windows i suggest the following client.
http://www.wincvs.org/

It has a good GUI for getting and updating files on a cvs server.

kaan

	10-11-2003 20:43									#13
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

I would like to suggest Dev-C++ as the future development platform on Windows.
it is a IDE for GCC on windows that rocks.

Easy to install, easy to use and its free software.

http://www.bloodshed.net/devcpp.html

Ironically its written in Delphi