19-11-2003 01:25									#1
	Can this game be salvaged? Support Apolyton

This is my first 'epic' game of C3C. Obviously, my PTW strategies are not working. I'm in need of a paradigm shift. Can anyone help me out? Am I as bad-off as it seems? Can this game be salvaged?


I'm playing as the Maya, small map, 3 other civs (I wanted a quick game after my 10 hour 'Mesopetamian Conquest'), Monarch level.

I'm horribly behind in techs and I have no money for research. I am gaining realestate and overcomming a very bad starting position, but I need some help.

Here's a screenshot:



Thank you.

	19-11-2003 01:40									#2
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

The other 3 civs are:
Aztec/Green - currently Industrial Age and seem to be winning.
Byzantine/Red - behind Aztecs but still ahead of me
America/Cyan - My personal punching bag.

Just some thoughts that I had:
1. Possibly build some Trebuchets and bombard the 2 Musket-Fortefied Aztec cities on 'My Continent' then take them w/ my Ancient Cav Armies. Hopefully the Aztecs will have a dificult time landing troops to counter-atack and will (after awhile) trade me some techs for peace.

2. I will probably wait until my peace treaty w/ the Americans runs-out and take Chicago--hopfully gaining the Knights Templar Wonder. This is about the only fighting force the Americans have so far because they have no iron.

I thought about taking Washington DC (city just south of "Used to be Philly"/near the volcano) and put my FP in it. The only problem w/ this is that they have Temple of Artemis (and it won't be long before I get Education) and Copernicus' (and I don't have Astronomy). So both Wonders would probably be useless.

Anyway, any suggestions on how I should proceed?

P.S. How can I attatch the savegame file? So far what I've tried doesn't seem to work, but here's a link to it (I think): http://apolyton.net/upload/files/steven8r/savegame.zip

Last edited by steven8r on 19-11-2003 at 01:49

	19-11-2003 01:47									#3
	Something else I've noticed.... Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Apparently the 'Republic' form of government in C3C is NOT the same as in PTW. (just read the thread about govs).

Perhaps that is the key to my money issue. Do I need to switch back to 'Despotism'?

Has anyone tried 'Feudalism'? That's the only other gov't form that I know in this game.

-Steven8r

	19-11-2003 02:24									#4
	Put an end to popups!

Hi there,

Thought I'd comment on a couple of observations based on looking at your screenshot.

It seems that most of your cities are building temples and it's 560AD. Does that mean that you haven't built much marketplaces or libraries. Until those cities are size 6 or greater and have marketplaces and libraries in them it's usually best to stay in despotism. You got city size almost covered but what about the city improvements?

Looks like you got a sizeable army. Where are all your workers? Clear some of those jungles and forests and either irrigate or mine them. I think you still have a chance here because you've got iron. Can you beat up the americans a little? Grab a few of their cities but don't fight a prolonged war.

If the maya are religious ( I can't remember ) switch back to despotism or monarchy if you have it. You really have to have a lot of things setup right in order to make republic usefull.

Just my 2cents. Good luck!

	19-11-2003 02:32									#5
	Put an end to popups!

Yes there are changes to Republic. The support for troops as been changed to 1/3/4 for town/city/metro. After that it is 2 gold for all non free units. If you have towns and not cities, it will be expensive to have lots of troops.

	19-11-2003 02:34									#6
	Increase Your PM Length

Cookie Monster,

Due to bad terrain, my cities haven't been able to grow. Even with the Agricultural trait, I can't do much in the desert w/o fresh water to irrigate. BTW: Maya are Ag/Ind. My Capital was in a GREAT spot--even got Ivory which got me Zeus.

With the small city sizes, it's taken me this long to even build a Temple. Actually, those cities building Temples are fairly new. Trying to claw my way out of the Desert/Forest/Jungle hampered my REXing ability.

All of my (Slave) workers are currently down South West clearing the jungles next to San Francisco, but it takes 24 turns. I lost all of MY workers due to budget shortages. The only workers that I currently have are American or Barbarian Slaves captured by my Jav Throwers (and a few American city razings).

As far as my military, it's apparently too big. It's costing me a fortune--even with the Ancient Cavelry produced by Zeus. Fortunately, I have Iron and the Americans don't. They are my current 'Punching Bag'. Every 20 turns or so, I get as many techs as I can for a peace treaty w/ them.

	19-11-2003 02:37									#7
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I see a few towns that are not growing, that should have been addressed. Two of them are coastal, so you could have built a harbor and got them going again.
Takai is not growing and is on wealth. Wealth is for points in the game when the city is large and totally corrupt (yes a few others).
You need the land that the others have, so it should be doing something to promote that.

	19-11-2003 02:40									#8
	Got spare money?

steven8r:

The americans don't have iron and you have a monster military!?!?! Keep going man don't give up! Btw can you damage the aztecs? Grab those cities and force them off your continent, then ask for peace. Do they have musketmen? If so use brute force and smash through their defenses and bring trebuchets if you have them.

I agree with vmxa1 you have to put some harbours in those towns.

	19-11-2003 20:34									#9
	Tired of ads?

I agree with Cookie Monster, take the whole continent from the Americans. If you need to get techs from them you might save one useless city to negotiate a peace deal for techs but that would be about it.