04-02-2001 17:00									#31
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Excellent work

There is however a MAJOR bug in this scenario - Amphitheatres does NOT work before you discover Monotheism!

This is sadly an error that is present in many scenarios, but one that is easy to correct (usually).

My suggestion is that you switch the technology slots for Acting(currently Cer) and Monotheism(currently MT) as Cer increase the effect of Temples which would make sense for Monotheism and MT is required in order to make Cathedrals(Amphitheatres) work at all.

More info on the Advance Slot Properties can be found here.
Please note that the claim made in this document that Cathedrals require either Monotheism or Mysticism and Theology to work is false - ONLY Monotheism will allow Cathedrals to function.

Keep up the good work, as the happy owner of ToT it has been a long time since I last played a regular civ scenario

EDIT: Just noticed that Amphitheatres are still using the original sound for Cathedrals, no biggie but I see no reason not to perfect this scenario

[This message has been edited by CyberChrist (edited February 04, 2001).]

	04-02-2001 17:56									#32
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Thanks, for the help, CyberChrist

I´m currently working on the amphitheatre problem, I hope I can post updated rules later this day...

But for the cathedral sound, I was aware of the problem, but I made a stupid mistake: I included another sound, but named it Cathedr.wav, instead of Cathedrl.wav. Simply renaming it to Cathedrl.wav solves the problem.

I´ll include a corrected wav file in the update

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Civ2000

	04-02-2001 18:40									#33
	Inflate your Upload Space

He there,
your scenario finally made me post here! Keep up the good work and keep us updated on any newer versions!

	04-02-2001 19:02									#34
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

Ok as you are going to change the rules.txt you might as well fix these small hick-ups.

Cities require a Deep Well to increase beyond size 8 and not 10 as the description says.

Likewise, cities require an Aqueduct to increase beyond size 12 and not 16 as the description says.

	04-02-2001 19:28									#35
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I uploaded a little update (see first post for the links)

It includes changed rules, pedia and a correct Cathedrl.wav. I tested it, and I think it works fine, but since there are several different rules I can´t test the entire research process in this short time.

I´ll continue testing, meanwhile I recommend to backup all older rules before installing the new files...


Ceteram: you are welcome!

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Civ2000

	04-02-2001 21:34									#36
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Didn't you correct the amphitheatre problem during playtesting?

	04-02-2001 21:46									#37
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Yes, I thought I did, after we discussed this. Maybe that I used an older version of the rules after I played around with some values during my own tests and forgot to incorporate some of the newer changes...

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Civ2000

	05-02-2001 10:24									#38
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This is a very hard scenario BeBro or atleast on deity. I got as far south as Capua and as far north as Mediolum, i couldn't ever take Paestum adn Tartem after 75years of fighting i still couldn't take them and soon some war elephants showed up and kicked my butt all the way back to rome. :\

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http://www.civfanatics.com Staff


Bah! Can't use my sig

	05-02-2001 00:11									#39
	Put an end to popups!

Fellow Patricians,
The fight for the glory of the Res Publica is an arduous one.
During my assignment in Capua, I learned about dispear-the carthaginian naval siege has been ongoing for over thirty years now.
My missions in Rhaetia, Pannonia and Dalmatia only brought the rich city of Tragurion under the eagles protective wings.
The 3rd siege of Massilia is progressing no better than its predecessors but war engines are being assembled now.
News from Assyria and Mesopotamia continuously mention the glory of the Macedonian Armies, apparently manyfold as strong as the mighty Carthaginian! What yet unknown ordeals will the SPQR have to go through?

Roman Cities (178BC):
Rome (Marius'), Clusium, Ravenna, Mediolanum, Nicae, Opitergium, Antium (founded in 253BC), Cumae (founded 196BC), Capua, Paestum, Tragurion and Tarent.

	05-02-2001 00:34									#40
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Salve Ceteram! How was Hannibal?

Some advice for the first part:

-research priority: better government, manipel tactics, then...
-you can conquer the first cities pretty fast, use terrain to move your Legions (hills), then attack with several Legions at the same turn...
-the Legions given with events are non vets, initiate low risk combats to make them veterans before you let themattack cities
-later, you need siege engines

My first move: fortifying a vet Legion on the mined square near Rome to prevent that the mine is pillaged.

I wonder if one has played as Macedonians. It´s recommended that you attack Persia as soon as the Phillip/Alexander events give you some nice units...



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Civ2000

	05-02-2001 02:01									#41
	Full PM-box? Change here!

uh, sorry...
[This message has been edited by Ceteram (edited February 04, 2001).]

	05-02-2001 02:02									#42
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Hail BeBro.
Being Proconsul, I must point out that your advice were welcome, but have been part of our war rites since wolf visited the Seven Hills...

Letter to Consul Sagitta:
Ave Sagitta,
matters about the senates decisions concerning the military leadership in Alpes Maritimae seem dangerous to me...this city should be under ius romanum for nearly a century now!
I suggest that politics change...otherwise this Sulla-guy might grasp the chance of dictatorship and that I cannot admit...
Now, our Greek enemy is weakened by servile revolts in Sicilia...we should hit there next and leave Gaul for later. This rich island shall fall just like their Calabrian friends...

Ceteram

Roman Cities (133BC):
Rome (Marius'), Clusium, Ravenna, Mediolanum, Nicae, Opitergium, Antium, Cumae, Capua, Paestum, Tragurion, Tarent, Kroton, Rhegion and Apollonia.

I expected something coming stomping through the Alps, but finally no Olifant hit Med.???? So Hannibal wasn't much of a threat besides the fact that I had to withdraw my troops besieging Massilia and lost most of them annihilitating H's army.
gruss
[This message has been edited by Ceteram (edited February 04, 2001).]

	05-02-2001 02:13									#43
	Put an end to popups!

Hint: You will never capture Massila without the use of Siege Towers...

Edit: I put "with" instead of "without".
[This message has been edited by Shadowstrike (edited February 04, 2001).]

	05-02-2001 02:25									#44
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

I believe my comments on this scenario will pretty much sum things up for us:

Nice. Nice. Nice. Best damn scenario in this time period made.

	05-02-2001 02:31									#45
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Ave, Inventor Optime! Et Ave, primi virii civesque!

I regret to inform you that in my version the Marius Army Reform doesn't work. I even used the cheat menu to make adavances one at time, but no upgrade was done. I hope you will be able to fix it, because this is a truly excellent scenario.

Farewell!
[This message has been edited by jeibel (edited February 04, 2001).]

	05-02-2001 02:40									#46
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Thanks George!

Shadowstrike, with (?) siege towers?

And Ceteram, Hannibal lost all his Elephants during his march trough the Alpes, therefore I didn´t include them in the event. However, you´ll encounter them in North Africa...
But you should double the efforts of your Legions, or the other civs may "oversettle" you, especially in the east. As Shadowstrike said earlier, don´t waste too much time (and brave men) on cities that give fierce resistance. Encircle them, then move further, you can take them later with better armed forces.

Boost up the procuctivity in Italy with mines and improvements to mass produce units...

SPQR

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Civ2000

	05-02-2001 02:46									#47
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I mean siege engines, the ones that look like siege towers...

	05-02-2001 03:18									#48
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Shadowstrike, perhaps I missunderstood you, I was only surprised that you had said "never capture Massila with the use of Siege Towers", I thought you mean "without"...however

jeibel, thanks for the hint, please download again the English Update2_1 in the first post of this thread. It contains now three corrected Roman rules files, so Marius should work now better. It was a simple, but stupid error, maybe for the same reason as the amphitheatre thing, related to the role-settings of the three types of Legions, so that they weren´t updated, other units (e.g. settlers to engineers) worked.
Should be solved now. Thanks again.

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Civ2000
[This message has been edited by BeBro (edited February 04, 2001).]

	05-02-2001 03:38									#49
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Bah, I just saw that I put with instead of without..... sorry, about that

	05-02-2001 04:36									#50
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80BC:
hmmm...I didn't enjoy the sight of Ptolmehs map when it appeared. You are right, I am being oversettled bigtime by the Macs.
3 civs are already wiped out: the Persians by the Macs, Egypt by the joined forces of Macs & Carths and the Greek by Mighty Rome!
Rome and its provinces now reach from Narbonnensis to Pannonia and fom the Akropolis to Sardinia.
Carthago is "deleted" and my main thrust goes towards Byzanz (tomorrow evening hopefully).
The raids into northern Italy cost me Meridiolanum for quite a few turns.

Roman Cities :
Rome (Marius'), Clusium, Ravenna, Mediolanum, Nicae, Opitergium, Antium, Cumae, Capua, Paestum, Tragurion, Raphia, Tarent, Kroton, Rhegion, Apollonia, Epidamnos, Argos, Theben, Corinth, Sparta, Athens, Syracusae, Panormus, Caralis, Massilia, Issos and Gergovia.

	05-02-2001 05:04									#51
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Wow its here and it looks great. Theres one thing missing from the english file, the city graphic..
Just replace the city.gif in your main civ2 directory "make sure you backup the old city.gif" Just save picture at bottom of this post.
This scenario is amazing from the start. Its extremly hard too. Its 311 B.C. and I've only captured Capua, Clusium and Ravenna. I've been besieging Paestum for at least 50 years now and lost about 28 legions in 3 main assaults. I now have Consular Legions but not much difference. There here to stay it seems. Mediolanlum and Opitergium are also besieged by me. But soon they will be in my hands. I traveled abit and have uncovered alot of Wooden Castles. Great job Bebro.

	06-02-2001 10:16									#53
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Hmm, I´ve read somewhere that all Elephants were lost before Hannibal reached Northern Italy...Seems that I have to research that again

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Civ2000
[This message has been edited by BeBro (edited February 05, 2001).]

	05-02-2001 23:35									#55
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Ok. Due to my inexperience in res publicae, I restarted the scenario....
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234 BC (consul level):
----------------------

I remember Thukydides describing our people as fine and ferocious civilisation at the same time.
Even though 2 years of strife and civil war brought misery and empty villages to Rome and its provinces, I can loudly state that it was for the best!
The new Triumvirate clearly permits a better control of this empire that already reaches from the Alps to the Black Sea.
The Gods seem to be favoring us and Alexanders Empire, ruined by his own children, lays before us, just like an overripe honeymelon...

Roman Cities:
Rome (Marius', Ostia on its way), Medio., Ravenna, Clusium, Antium (founded), Cumae (founded), Capua, Paestum, Rhegion, Kroton, Tarent, Epidamnos, Apollonia, Theben, Pella (destroyed and rebuilt), Abdera, Byzanz, Abydos (destroyed and rebuilt) and Herakleia.

I think I definetly stopped the macs from becoming huge-Thukydides described them as puny I think!
mfg

	06-02-2001 00:11									#56
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cpoulos, thanks for the info, yes I checked the hanninbal thing again, and found also other sources that say the same about the elephants

And, yes, Marius should upgrade the Legions, have you downloaded the update 2.1 again (link in the first posts)? I changed it again, so Marius should work now.

But what means "Also, their is to much copy in some of the wonder descriptions"? What is wrong?

Ceteram, the Senate gives you the new name Ceteram Macedonicus!

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Civ2000

	06-02-2001 01:01									#58
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Ah, I understand. Hmm, another player has reported the same from the German version, but I´m unsure about the reason. On my screen, all is visible. But I run civ under a resolution of 1152x864, so I thought the problem appears if one uses a smaller resolution. But this guy replied that he had the same problem in 1200x1024...

I can make a civilopedia with shorter descriptions to solve the thing, but not before the weekend, please tell me, which other wonders or governments, except Marius, have also too much text?

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Civ2000

	06-02-2001 01:18									#59
	Increase Your PM Length

Besides Marius, the ones that are chopped are: Alexander's Army, Civil Right, Hadrian's Wall, Nabatean Treasury, Oracle of Delphi, Pyramides, and Titus' Arch. Tower of Babel is in German. Is this a joke? All the rest are readable.

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All knowledge begins with the phrase: I don't know.

	06-02-2001 02:26									#60
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Sorry for the Tower of Babel thing. That´s the problem when you make the English and the German version at the same time - I´ll correct it until the weekend.



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Civ2000