28-11-2003 04:01									#1
	GoW/ND/Lego Chat Log Support Apolyton

Since no-one but me was in the chat today, I shall post the log, some military options and diplomacy was discussed

quote: Start of #gow_cofa buffer: Thu Nov 27 17:00:01 2003 [11:17] * Now talking in #gow_cofa [11:17] * services.apolyton.net changes topic to 'The Glory of Diplomacy' [11:17] * ChanServ sets mode: +ntr [13:13] * vondrack has joined #gow_cofa [13:13] [vondrack] heya, MZ! [13:13] [vondrack] national holiday again? [13:13] [MasterZen] heeeeey [13:13] [MasterZen] not this time [13:13] [vondrack] ah [13:14] [MasterZen] so, what's new? [13:15] [vondrack] well... seems GS left their rear uncovered [13:15] [vondrack] our knights cannot see any GS units [13:15] [vondrack] means the coastal mountain is not occupied [13:15] [vondrack] we'll be wiser next turn [13:15] [MasterZen] I haven't been really active as of late [13:16] [vondrack] hmmm... I can't afford to be "not really active" in Lego ) [13:16] [MasterZen] I really have no clue as to what's going on militarily, although I do want to end the GS "diplomatic question" as soon as possible [13:16] [vondrack] Lego would become "not very active" [13:16] [MasterZen] hehe [13:16] [vondrack] yes, that would be nice [13:16] [vondrack] they keep bugging us [13:16] [vondrack] about our "support" and such [13:16] [MasterZen] should we perhaps issue a joint declaration or something of the sort? [13:17] [vondrack] humm... Aggie mentioned that [13:17] [vondrack] but my take is [13:17] [vondrack] that we should not use any joint declarations [13:17] [MasterZen] something like "All your base are belong to GoW/ND/Lego. You have no chance to survive make your time. Ha Ha Ha." [13:17] [vondrack] GS folks are sensitive to "gang-up" and "anti GS conspiracy" behaviour [13:18] [MasterZen] true, very true, although the current GS leadership I don't think so, I know Theseus and he's not that kind of guy [13:18] [vondrack] yes [13:18] [MasterZen] but I do concurr completely [13:18] [vondrack] we did tell GS we would do zilch until you say "ok, deal is to backstab ND" [13:18] [vondrack] but they keep getting back to us and ask about if we talked about the plan with you... [13:18] [vondrack] bleh [13:18] [MasterZen] hehehe [13:18] [vondrack] as if they had something to offer to you [13:19] [MasterZen] they are desperate [13:19] [vondrack] something more than ND offered [13:19] [vondrack] yeah [13:19] [vondrack] rightfully, I would say [13:19] [vondrack] they are losing the game - and they are good enough to be realizing it [13:20] [vondrack] they've lost the game through extremely bad diplomacy [13:20] [vondrack] high level decisions [13:20] [MasterZen] it's not so much that they are offering more or less than ND, its just that you don't turn on your ally like that. They are asking of us what they couldn't do themselves to RP even in a much lesser degree [13:20] [vondrack] true [13:20] [MasterZen] and "honor code" that's bullshit [13:20] [MasterZen] you win or you win, period [13:20] [vondrack] I believe they still do not get the true nature of your (and our, for that matter) alliance [13:21] [vondrack] they still believe you just have "a contract to remove RP" [13:21] [vondrack] that's where they come from [13:21] [MasterZen] we have of course done all we can to feed that idea [13:21] [vondrack] hehe [13:21] [vondrack] but you are still going to tell them to stuff it... [13:21] [vondrack] albeit politely [13:21] [vondrack] I hope [13:21] [MasterZen] very politely [13:22] [MasterZen] I actually like the GS guys which are active nowadays, they are cool guys, unlike some of their more pricky predecessors [13:22] [vondrack] very true [13:22] [MasterZen] if they had done GS diplomacy from day 1 things would be very different now [13:23] [vondrack] agreed [13:23] [MasterZen] but c'est la vie, we've all made mistakes [13:24] [vondrack] ah... wanna tell me about yours? [13:24] [MasterZen] nah [13:24] [vondrack] cool... I was afraid I would be supposed to tell you about mine [13:25] * MasterZen wonders what big mistake Lego could have possibly made... [13:25] [vondrack] ah, I was just kidding... I do not think we've made any major mistakes so far [13:26] [vondrack] but I will grant you we have had it easy [13:26] [vondrack] being isolated, with land enough [13:27] [MasterZen] yeah, you guys got lucky [13:28] [MasterZen] although of course luck means nothing if you don't have skill to complement it, and Lego has shown it [13:29] * vondrack bows to MZ, thanking for the compliment [13:32] * MasterZen wonders where everyone else is [13:33] [vondrack] it's too early [13:33] [MasterZen] ah yes, it's at 2pm here now, no daylight savings anymore [13:33] [vondrack] the chat will start in 30 minutes [13:33] [vondrack] the beginning was shifted an hour later about two or three weeks ago [13:33] [MasterZen] ah, I thought it was because of the time change [13:33] [vondrack] I believe it was Zayxus asking for it [13:34] [vondrack] now it starts at 9pm Central European [13:50] [MasterZen] btw, have you noticed the "Chat Topic warz GoW and Lego have been having since yesterday"? [13:51] [vondrack] nope!? [13:51] [MasterZen] when you use the /list command you can see the lego chatroom and how many people are in it [13:51] [vondrack] I did notice an unusual topic in our chatroom today, though [13:51] [MasterZen] so yesterday, over 5 GoWers showed up (miraculously) [13:51] [MasterZen] we changed our topic to "More people than the Lego chat!" [13:52] [vondrack] hehe [13:52] [vondrack] do we have that many people in the chat usually? [13:52] [MasterZen] then when some people left we made DLs to keep the number up, don't know if you guys noticed [13:52] [MasterZen] usually there's no-one, or just Panzer and myself [13:53] [MasterZen] yesterday everyone showed up for no apparent reason, everyone except UnO and Aggie * Retrieving #gow_cofa info... [13:54] [vondrack] I see [13:54] [vondrack] I am not as active as I used to be [13:54] [vondrack] no time [14:02] [MasterZen] hey vond, on average, how much does broadband cost over there in Czech Rep? [14:02] * Zayxus has joined #gow_cofa [14:02] [Zayxus] hi! [14:02] [vondrack] hi, Zayxus! [14:03] [MasterZen] heeey [14:03] [vondrack] @MZ: I am paying 1900 CZK (about $67) for a bundle of the cable TV (HBO incl.) and internet [14:03] [vondrack] internet is about $40-45, I think [14:03] [MasterZen] hmm, that's more or less what I'll have to pay... [14:04] [vondrack] we are more or less a normal country by now... [14:04] [MasterZen] I'm thinking about getting it in january since I am moving and will live with a roommate [14:04] [vondrack] definitely, go for it! broadband is great [14:04] [MasterZen] I just think it's a lot since in the US it can be cheaper [14:05] [vondrack] ah, yes, in the US... things are different [14:05] [MasterZen] yes, the cable company charges about $15 for the cable and $50 for the broadband [14:05] [MasterZen] its 384kps [14:05] [vondrack] mine is 600/256 [14:05] [vondrack] way more than I need [14:05] [vondrack] 256/64 was just fine [14:06] [vondrack] but they raised it on their own, same price [14:06] [vondrack] I did not complain [14:07] [MasterZen] I have a feeling prices will drop in the next year or two here [14:08] [vondrack] no such feelings here [14:08] [vondrack] [14:09] [MasterZen] the problem right now is lack of options, there are really only two very big broadband providers, one is from Telmex the phone co., it is ASDL and costs $50, the other is from one of the cable companies, it has both $30 and $50 prices but the $30 is a rip-off since its only 54kpbs [14:09] [MasterZen] *64kps [14:09] [Zayxus] In Germany : $50 for internet DSL / month *and* $10 for Megabytes or Time online [14:10] [Zayxus] ($1 ~ EURO 1) [14:10] * vondrack chuckles [14:10] [MasterZen] hopefully the other cable companies will wisen up and see that if they don't jump in the broadband business that one company will end up on top [14:13] [Zayxus] in advertising it is only mentioned the $10 / M and cost for DSL-Modem, but only in little letters about DSL-costs itself [14:14] [vondrack] yeah, the art of fineprint... [14:14] [MasterZen] hehehehe, typical [14:14] [vondrack] Zayxus - have you discussed our gold/lux proposal? [14:14] [Zayxus] DSL itself is provided by another company - without costs for being online [14:15] [Zayxus] there was a discussion, moment i look [14:15] [MasterZen] btw, Zayxus, do you know if feanor0815 is still active in GWT? It's been over a month since I last heard from them [14:16] [Zayxus] @ proposal: it was welcome [14:17] [Zayxus] @ feanor0815: I look, moment... [14:17] [vondrack] cool - we are currently polling over it, but out of 4 people voting, 4 voted in favour [14:17] [vondrack] one more and it's a go [14:17] [vondrack] (actually, it's as good as accepted, I'd say) [14:18] [vondrack] we have sent all our money this turn [14:18] [vondrack] and will send as much next turn [14:19] [Zayxus] thank you [14:21] [Zayxus] Members of my team are preparing the moves to attack Pamplona, since I was absent for one turn last week. [14:23] [Zayxus] For doing the turn I would have to sit a longer time to consider details with including to buy units [14:25] [Zayxus] MasterZen, as Member of GOW and holding Alamo, what do you think of moving with 5 Catapults and about 6 defenders to Pamplona and also using Ansars somehow to attack? [14:26] [vondrack] MZ is a diplomat, no soldier [14:26] [vondrack] he uses his pen where others use their sabres... [14:26] [MasterZen] exactly [14:26] [MasterZen] well, if you've PBEMed with me you'd see I'd much rather use the sabre than the pen [14:27] [vondrack] lol [14:27] [vondrack] why do you stick with the FAM depts then? [14:27] [MasterZen] because diplomacy is more fun with demo games [14:28] [Zayxus] I will tell the others in my forum [14:28] [MasterZen] yes, please tell GWT too :P [14:28] [vondrack] lol [14:29] [MasterZen] I don't know, I think Aggie should deal with the military stuff since I haven't really been active in the war discussion [14:29] [MasterZen] but where is Aggie the world wonders? [14:30] [vondrack] I thought Darekill would show up, too... [14:31] [Zayxus] MasterZen, I agree, to contact Aggie, maybe tomorrow and at weekend. [14:31] [MasterZen] I haven't seen Darekill in a looong time [14:32] [vondrack] he dropped in last week, I think [14:32] [Zayxus] Darekill was in forum 3 hours ago... [14:32] [vondrack] anyway, for me... there was not that much to discuss [14:32] [vondrack] as for GoW: we are ready to move our knights onto the coastal tiles [14:32] [vondrack] the mountain and the hill SW of it [14:33] [vondrack] on this (upcoming) turn [14:33] [vondrack] unless told otherwise, we will do so [14:33] [vondrack] LEF5 landed this turn - if you have specific instruction regarding its route, PM me, please [14:33] [vondrack] *instructions [14:34] [vondrack] as for ND: I am almost sure our gold/lux deal will go through [14:34] [vondrack] golhalf the gold already on its way [14:34] [vondrack] the other half immediately afterwards [14:34] [MasterZen] I'm checking the forum to see if there's anything urgent... [14:34] [vondrack] LEF4 lands this (upcoming) turn [14:35] [vondrack] if you have specific instructions regarding its route, PM me, please [14:36] [vondrack] oh, and... GoW, we would REALLY appreciate if you tell GoW your final word [14:36] [MasterZen] you mean GS? [14:36] [vondrack] sure [14:36] [MasterZen] yeah, I'll think of another "Manifesto"... err... not [14:36] [vondrack] sheesh [14:38] [vondrack] guess that would be all from my side [14:38] [MasterZen] gimme a sec, looking at the GoW turnthread... [14:38] [vondrack] k [14:38] [Zayxus] There may be some delay doing the turn by ND [14:40] [MasterZen] ok, apparently moving the Lego troops to the mountain was part of the plan [14:40] [MasterZen] no word about what to do at Alamo [14:40] [Zayxus] I have to discuss with the members how to realize the idea of approaching Pamplona [14:41] [vondrack] re: the mountain... Aggie consulted with me about the rout of LEF1+2+3 and when I came with this idea, he thought it was ok [14:41] [MasterZen] I think I'm going to ditch the ISDG for the next week or two and concentrate on the PTWDG [14:41] [vondrack] I believe that preventing GS from reinforcing their stack is crucial now [14:41] [vondrack] their stack, as-is, is too weak to do real harm to you [14:41] [Zayxus] which stack? [14:42] [MasterZen] we actually WANT them to attack [14:42] [vondrack] the one near Yellowknife [14:42] [MasterZen] the stack which invaded us [14:42] [vondrack] yeah, I know [14:42] [Zayxus] clear [14:42] [vondrack] actually, the best thing they can do is to sit where they are... [14:42] [vondrack] they attack, they are toast [14:42] [vondrack] they move, they are toast [14:43] [MasterZen] too bad Civ3 doesn't have supply rules, that way we could just let them stand and die on that hill [14:43] [vondrack] hehe, true [14:43] [MasterZen] like in REAL wargames :P [14:43] [Zayxus] [14:44] [vondrack] there are other games than civ??? [14:45] [MasterZen] actually, yes [14:45] [vondrack] oh... many of them? [14:46] [vondrack] just kidding... I myself relax over HoMaM 3 last weeks [14:46] [MasterZen] actually I haven't played anything other than civ in 2003 :P [14:46] [MasterZen] but I used to do wargames and flight sims [14:46] [vondrack] civ has become more of a job for me because of the DGs, so I need something to have a break from it [14:47] [vondrack] ...and my gf has recently fell in love with Emperor: RotMK [14:47] [Zayxus] @MasterZen: the last post of feanor0815 was 10th November 2003 [14:47] [vondrack] hm, that might explain his... low... responsiveness... [14:47] [MasterZen] hmmm [14:48] [vondrack] anyone else to contact, Zayxus? (in GWT) [14:48] [MasterZen] no wonder GWT never answers us :P [14:49] [Zayxus] moment... [14:55] [Zayxus] @MasterZen, excuse me, but last days I was to busy to think about ND, I do not know about Intersite/GWT, just try to mail to anyone of GWT, please.. [14:55] [MasterZen] ok, don't worry [14:56] [Zayxus] For example, I found Darekill in the Intersite Game. [14:57] [Zayxus] @vondrack, how critical is the situation at Yellowstone? [14:58] [vondrack] not critical - it's fun, I would say [14:58] [vondrack] we are trying to pull a trap on GS [14:58] [vondrack] cutting them from reinforcements [14:58] [MasterZen] yeah it's like we're saying "Ooh don't attack us please Mr. GS Knight" so that they do attack us [14:58] [vondrack] lol [14:58] [vondrack] right [14:59] [Zayxus] What do you think of attacking with catapults and Defending units, or would you only wait...? [15:00] [vondrack] attacking what? the GS stack near Yellowknife? [15:00] [Zayxus] yes [15:00] [MasterZen] nah, I think we better wait until they either 1) move 2) attack us first [15:01] [Zayxus] ...waiting for a fatal mistake like naer Alamo - east? [15:02] [vondrack] sort of [15:05] [MasterZen] the thing is I can't picture them actually doing anything that won't be a mistake, there's not much room to maneouver [15:06] [Zayxus] seems reasonable to me, while I have to convince other of my team, who would like to attack anything somehow bloody-minded [15:07] [vondrack] MZ put it right... whatever they do, it will weaken their position [15:07] [vondrack] may be that the appearance of Lego units will shake them... provoking them to do something hasty [15:08] [MasterZen] like piss in their pants [15:08] [vondrack] I said Hasty, not Nasty [15:12] [Zayxus] are the Knights of GS at Y. on a hill? [15:12] [vondrack] yes [15:12] [vondrack] plus few pikes (3? 4?) [15:12] [Zayxus] are they in range of a city of GOW? [15:12] [MasterZen] 4 pikes [15:12] [MasterZen] no, not in range [15:12] [Zayxus] ah interesting [15:12] [vondrack] the knights are in the range, aren't they? [15:13] [MasterZen] let me check the map again... [15:13] [MasterZen] ah yes [15:14] [MasterZen] they are 3-3 from Yellowknife [15:14] [vondrack] Zayxus, if you need to know something about the GoW military, you better ask me [15:14] * MasterZen runs over vondrack with President Fox's tractor! [15:14] * MasterZen slaps vondrack around a bit with a trade barrier! [15:15] [MasterZen] hehe, my custom slaps [15:15] [vondrack] Fox is your Pres? [15:15] [vondrack] Vicente? [15:15] [MasterZen] yep that one [15:15] [vondrack] heard the name [15:15] [vondrack] though only the name, I think [15:15] [MasterZen] doing a crappy job IMO [15:16] [vondrack] like every other one [15:16] [MasterZen] yeah, it looks like streak [15:16] [MasterZen] going on since 1800.... HAHAHA [15:16] [vondrack] lol [15:17] [Zayxus] MasterTen, as GS I would move more units towards Alamo .... would you move more units to Alamo, maybe Catapults or Riders? [15:17] [vondrack] though I did not mean Mexican Presidents only... [15:17] [MasterZen] let's see, GS has currently 19 knights and 1 pike around alamo [15:17] [vondrack] 1 pike? [15:18] [vondrack] what's that good for? [15:18] [MasterZen] I dunno :P [15:18] [MasterZen] we have considerably more than that... [15:18] [Zayxus] As GS, where would you move your units? North or south? Yellowknife or Alamo? [15:18] [MasterZen] If I were GS, probably Yellowknife [15:18] [vondrack] agreed [15:19] [MasterZen] they must KNOW that Alamo is defended like crazy [15:19] [MasterZen] they might think that our north is weak and that attacking Yellownife might be less costly [15:19] [vondrack] that would be cool (if they thought that) [15:19] [MasterZen] that being said, I doubt, should they attack Yellowknife, they have the balls to attack Almamo also [15:20] [vondrack] hm, if they did that, it would indicate they have balls only... [15:20] [MasterZen] If I were GS, I'd move the knight stack 1 so it blocks the road and forces us to attack, or simply stay put [15:20] [MasterZen] at Alamo [15:21] [Zayxus] Would GS like to move to Merida again? [15:24] [MasterZen] maybe, although switching their axis of attack so much is counterproductive [15:25] [MasterZen] espeically since if they abandon the Alamo area, it leaves us free to attack Pamplona [15:26] [MasterZen] how many Ansars can ND gather up for an offensive? [15:27] [Zayxus] twentyfive [15:29] [MasterZen] we have 23 down south IIRC [15:29] [Zayxus] the nearest trend is to move about six defensive units arround the mountain east, south-east of FortLoewenmut [15:29] [Zayxus] together with five catapults [15:30] [Zayxus] with option to bomb the Knights or Pamplona [15:31] [Zayxus] ...Pamplona 1 turn later [15:34] [MasterZen] where your muskets are? [15:34] [Zayxus] some are on the mountain at SE, SE of FortL [15:35] [Zayxus] some two are south of Alamo, one turn away from the mountains [15:36] [Zayxus] some two are near FortL. [15:36] [Zayxus] GOW could see them by the riders near FortL [15:36] [Zayxus] some are still in Merida [15:38] [MasterZen] GS's knight stack is at 3/4 [15:39] [MasterZen] all of them [15:39] [Zayxus] 7 of 7 are at 3/4? [15:39] [MasterZen] the stack 8 from Alamo [15:42] [MasterZen] if they stick on that mountain perhaps a few catapult rounds might make them retreat [15:42] [MasterZen] and there really isn't many places they can retreat safely

	28-11-2003 04:03									#2
	Remove this text

Part II

quote: [15:42] [Zayxus] Would GS build a city near Yellowknife? (A member of us asked me) [15:42] [MasterZen] that is a possibility [15:42] [MasterZen] which is why we definitely need to destroy any reinforcements [15:45] [Zayxus] how? [15:45] [MasterZen] that's what Lego is here for [15:45] [vondrack] yup [15:45] [vondrack] perhaps even better than destroying is blocking them from landing... [15:46] [vondrack] that's what we try to pull by our manoeuver [15:46] [MasterZen] we have to inflict casualties, but we must choose when and where to do so, and hopefully by making THEM attack not us [15:48] [MasterZen] I have an idea... [15:48] [MasterZen] it might be stupid but I'll say it anyway [15:49] [MasterZen] regarding GS's knights, it is possible that they may retreat 9-9 or 6 [15:49] [MasterZen] *GS's knights 8 of Alamo [15:50] [MasterZen] do you think that is possible? 9-9? [15:50] [Zayxus] 9-9 or 6? [15:50] [MasterZen] 9-9 is what I have on my mind [15:51] [MasterZen] If they move there, Ansars can hit the stack and retreat to the mountain [15:53] [Zayxus] I try to understand '9-9' meaning [15:53] [MasterZen] ne, ne [15:55] [Zayxus] understand, are you sure, ater attack ansars reach a mountain? [15:56] [MasterZen] yes, if they are at Fort Lowenmut, they would move se, then e, attack then move sw [15:56] [Zayxus] thank you I got it [15:56] [MasterZen] since the first move is on your road, it doesn't really count [15:57] [Zayxus] this idea is in case, GS moves ne, ne, we will see, if ist happens [15:58] [MasterZen] yes, obviously [15:59] [MasterZen] if they move east to the forest perhaps GoW can attack them, those Riders can move back to Alamo anyway [16:04] [MasterZen] I've been looking now at the Yellowknife stack... [16:04] [MasterZen] if I were GS I would do one of two things [16:04] [MasterZen] If I had a second wave of troops coming, with a settler, I would build the city 3-3-3 of Yellowknife [16:04] [Zayxus] if ND stands with only 5 Musket at Pamplona and there are 10 Catapults in P. would ND lose 1 Point at each Musketman? [16:05] [MasterZen] yes perhaps, 50% odds, cats attack 4, muskets defend 4 [16:08] [MasterZen] anway, back to the north, if GS builds a city there, they can move a knight stack to the hill between Yellowknife and Port Isolation, threan them both on the same turn [16:09] [Zayxus] I need to think more about. *it is late in the evening here* [16:09] [Zayxus] that depends on a city? why? [16:10] [MasterZen] ? [16:13] [Zayxus] if they build a city they can move to the north? [16:15] [MasterZen] knights could [16:16] [Zayxus] A city can built a wall , that impoves defense to factor 2, that is what I see as problem about the city. [16:16] [Zayxus] ... on a hill [16:16] [MasterZen] it's the 4 pikes which are affecting their mobility right now, I would have rather brought 4 more knights if I had them [16:16] [MasterZen] yes, that is why we can't allow them to build a city [16:16] [MasterZen] especially a city on the coast [16:17] [Zayxus] on the coast with resupply... by sea... [16:20] [MasterZen] plus, I'm trying to think why they would stay on that hill instead of moving to the other one (6-9) from Yellowknife, it is much more strategic [16:20] [MasterZen] they had one turn for a cease fire they could have moved on the plain last turn [16:20] [MasterZen] unless.... that stack is waiting for reinforcements (or they're just plain stupid) [16:21] [Zayxus] could that north hill be occupied by defenders of GOW? [16:23] [MasterZen] well, once lego is on the mountain, perhaps we can move our rider stack there and "trap" GS, forcing to attack one of us, I would like to have Muskets though on it [16:23] [MasterZen] this is actually not so bad an idea..., say 2 muskets and 3-4 pikes, and our riders there [16:26] [Zayxus] ...if you can... [16:27] [MasterZen] we'll see what Aggie thinks [16:28] [Zayxus] There seems to be a trend to put many units in cities (or on mountains) with defense factor 2 , waiting for something to happen... [16:29] [Zayxus] Only catapults seem to be able to break that. Catapults could be more succesful... [16:29] [Zayxus] ...or build we need to build more of catapults [16:31] [MasterZen] yes, although the problem with catapults is their lack of mobility [16:31] [Zayxus] ... somewhere (at civfanatics forum ?) I read about a strategy report of using a lot of catapults... [16:32] [MasterZen] we could definiteyl use many cats in the south [16:35] [Zayxus] Would you build more catapults in Alamo? [16:35] [MasterZen] I don't think Alamo is much of a productive powerhouse... [16:35] [Zayxus] sure. [16:35] [MasterZen] although if we capture Pamplona, that's 10 free catapults [16:38] [Zayxus] Could GOW build another stack of Riders for Pamplona? Or is GS in the north more important as place for Riders? [16:39] [MasterZen] I think all our new riders will be going to the south [16:40] [MasterZen] and we'll be upgrading quite a few of them in the next turns I think [16:40] [Zayxus] ... but how would ND ever get that city, if GS is with 12 Knights in the mountains? [16:40] [MasterZen] what city? [16:41] [MasterZen] Pamplona? [16:41] [Zayxus] What about to attack or threaten another city north of Pamplona? [16:41] [Zayxus] ...yes P. [16:41] [MasterZen] well, if we were to attack Pamplona at this moment, those 12 knights can't do anything [16:42] * MasterZen would support razing Pamplona just for the fun of it [16:42] [Zayxus] If ND attacks first, GOW would do the rest and occupy Pamoplona, defending it... [16:42] [MasterZen] while the other moves east [16:42] [MasterZen] one team should keep defending the area while the other goes and takes their other cities in a fast assault [16:43] [Zayxus] sure. [16:43] [Zayxus] what is your assumption, how many units are in Pamplona? [16:43] [MasterZen] we have pics, not many [16:44] [Zayxus] 15? [16:44] [MasterZen] more or less, I think less actually [16:44] [Zayxus] 15 * defensiv point 3? [16:44] [MasterZen] there's like 10 pike and 3 knights, something like that.... [16:44] [MasterZen] let me find the pic [16:44] [Zayxus] ... and 8 catapults [16:46] [Zayxus] 2*14 defenders -] 28 offensive units at least and some more just in case ...needed. [16:48] [MasterZen] yeah, 30 units would suffice [16:48] [MasterZen] although if I recall they were rather weak, maybe less than 10 pikes [16:49] [Zayxus] ... 3 Knights count as 3 pikes for me [16:50] [Zayxus] 8 Catapults like 1 pike [16:51] [Zayxus] defense of Pamplona: +0,5 by city size, +0.25 by fortified: +75% [16:52] [Zayxus] 3 * 1.75 -] 4.25 [16:52] [Zayxus] chance about 1:1 each [16:52] [MasterZen] could be worse, could be on a hill [16:52] [Zayxus] please , check it, if possible anytime [16:54] [MasterZen] we need to devise a plan by which we can safely attack Pamplona and not worry about GS trying to drive west somehow [16:55] [Zayxus] sure. [16:57] [Zayxus] could we continnue by emails? I need some sleep. [16:57] [MasterZen] yes no problem [16:57] [vondrack] I will go, too.. [16:57] [MasterZen] ok, take care guys [16:57] [vondrack] see you in a week [16:58] [vondrack] take care, both of you [16:58] [Zayxus] yes [16:58] [vondrack] cheers [16:58] [MasterZen] sorry for not having the rest of the team here [16:58] [vondrack] no prob [16:58] [vondrack] bye [16:58] * vondrack has left #gow_cofa [16:58] [MasterZen] cya [16:58] [Zayxus] bye [16:58] [MasterZen] take care [16:58] [Zayxus] you too [16:58] * Zayxus has left #gow_cofa End of #gow_cofa buffer Thu Nov 27 17:00:01 2003

	28-11-2003 06:07									#3
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Quick Note :

Just jotting this down as I read the chat.

Down South... Can GS group their knights into 1 stack
Then attack Pampalona, and take over the city.
Fortify their 20 or so knights in pampalona.

	28-11-2003 08:16									#4
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Sorry I wasn't there, it's Thanksgiving here and had other obligations.

Gs could group their knights into a stack, but they would have to do it, on the forest. Any other location would take 2 turns. If they did that I'd recommend an immediate attack on that force. ND says they have 25 ansars and if we took out that force we wouldn't have to worry about defending alamo.

Also I have written a PM to GS telling them that we have come to the decision to take reject their offer and pursue other avenues of victory.

Aggie

	28-11-2003 09:07									#5
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EDIT: read panzer's post below...

Last edited by Master Zen on 28-11-2003 at 13:14

	28-11-2003 10:53									#6
	Inflate your Upload Space

MZ look over your posts we have 1 2/3 of one log here

Not much I care to comment on here otherwise.

	28-11-2003 23:19									#7
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quote: Originally posted by Hot_Enamel Quick Note : Just jotting this down as I read the chat. Down South... Can GS group their knights into 1 stack Then attack Pampalona, and take over the city. Fortify their 20 or so knights in pampalona.

Their 12 Knight stack cant reach Pampalona in one turn, thus they can move 1n to the mountain just south of Pampalona. Their other stack is locked and can't really move anywhere but into Pampalona, so yes i'd say. This is really what i've been worrying about. This could slow down our progress in the south.. =(