Apolyton Archive  |  Preserved copy of the Apolyton Civilization Site and its forums as they stood in September 2005. Read-only; nothing here can be posted to or replied to.  |  Forum index |  About this archive |  The 1998–2001 UBB forums
Today on Apolyton WARDELL INTERVIEW PROMO A.C.S. HISTORY CHAPTER 4 GET CIV4 /w FREE PLUS! A.C.S. PHOTO GALLERY GET A.O.M. V1.1
Apolyton Civilization Forums
main| civ2| civ3| civ4| smac| ctp2| ron| moo3| galciv| galciv2| alt| about|
ApolytonPLUS | register | search | faq | new posts | pm (-/-) | upload | members
hall of fame new! | civgroups | civgroups news | interviews | the column | radio | chat | directory | news | store | PLUS
Apolyton Civilization Forums : Powered by vBulletin version 2.0.3 Apolyton Civilization Forums > Miscellaneous > Archive > Off-Topic-Archive > Officially Christmas time.
Show a Printable Version | Email This Page to Someone! | Receive updates to this thread | Report this to Apolyton news!

bottom of page
  
Author
Thread   
Pages (3): [ 1   2   3   ]
< Last Thread     Next Thread > Post New Thread     Post A Reply
Skywise is offline Skywise
Prince
Samara's best friend
Jan 2002
time: 05:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:16
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#31 Report this post to a moderator
Tired of ads?

quote:
Originally posted by Chemical Ollie


I had one on in my living room (aquired before it was banned), until my 2 year old daughter smashed it against the floor. Well, it's easy to forgive your kids, but it surely was a waste...


I'm glad it's destroyed.

quote:


My shoes and gloves are made from genuine lether

I am all for that. If you kill a cow for the meat, use it fully for every thing else. Skinned seals are only used for clothes. Just like buffalos when the english killed them all, only for the fur and not the meat.

quote:

Why would a woman need an animal fur, when she has her own?

I agree.


Spec.

Chemical Ollie is offline Chemical Ollie
Prince
Bored of this board
Jan 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:17
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#32 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote:
Originally posted by Spec

Because they dont give a shlt and they dont have guns.



They have guns, but shooting the seal cubs would destroy the fur.

(It's true)

Skywise is offline Skywise
Prince
Samara's best friend
Jan 2002
time: 05:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:18
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#33 Report this post to a moderator
Put an end to popups!

quote:
Originally posted by Chemical Ollie


They have guns, but shooting the seal cubs would destroy the fur.

(It's true)


Yea...maybe with a shotgun....but not with a 22 calier rifle threw the head.

Spec.

Gangerolf is offline Gangerolf
Prince
huuhh
May 2001
time: 06:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:18
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#34 Report this post to a moderator
Increase the size of your Attachments

You guys are lucky I'm here to educate you!


Seals and Seal-hunting - The facts and the myths - courtesy of the Norwegian Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

quote:
Norwegian seal-hunting - sound resource management

In order to maintain seal populations at a reasonable level they must be culled. This is why Norway permits seal hunting. The daily energy requirement of a seal is 2.5-3 kilos of herring or capelin. The huge seal populations are making major inroads into fish stocks, including those that provide food for humans. In the North-East Atlantic, the harp seal alone eats as much herring as is caught by Norwegian fishermen.




quote:

"Luxury hunting"

Seals have traditionally been hunted for their blubber and fur. Most of the skins are used for common leather products such as shoes, gloves and clothes. Norway does not permit the hunting of whitecoats and suckling bluebacks, whose fur is the most sought after.

Parts of the meat and blubber are used for food in the same way as meat from other game or farm animals. The blubber is rich in omega-3 fatty acids which, as modern research has indicated, can play a significant role in preventing the most common cardio-vascular diseases.

"Primitive methods of hunting"

The only tools of slaughter Norwegian seal-hunters are permitted to use are the rifle and the "hakapik" (corresponds roughly to the Newfoundland gaff). Adult seals are shot with a rifle, while young seals are put to death with a "hakapik" or rifle. As a method of destruction, the killing of young seals by rifle has proven to be just as effective as the use of the "hakapik". The "hakapik" is also used on seals which have been shot in order to make sure they are dead. The "hakapik" may look primitive, but it is a simple and effective tool which ensures immediate loss of consciousness and rapid death.

According to a 1993 report from the Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe, "clubbing", if correctly carried out, is as good as the usual methods of slaughter, causing the animal to die in the course of a few seconds.

Norwegian hunters are required to take courses and shooting tests before the sealing season starts.

"The seal is flayed while it is still alive"

Films have been shown of seals which appear to be "alive" even after death. Spasms in the body of a dead seal are a natural phenomenon. The seal spends a great deal of time under water and its blood is therefore capable of storing large amounts of oxygen. In addition, a seal's muscles can function for a while without a supply of oxygen. Consequently, the seal's body can display powerful spasms for a long time after its death.


"The seal cries"

The fluid in a seal's eye protects the cornea and has nothing to do with weeping. This fluid runs out of the eye because a seal's tear ducts are different from those of other animals.

Chemical Ollie is offline Chemical Ollie
Prince
Bored of this board
Jan 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:20
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#35 Report this post to a moderator
Enter the AD-FREE zone

What about that TV photographer you expelled to Sweden for being "unpatriotic" on the seal hunting?

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:21
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#36 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Redirecting the thread back on to the topic. Even Santa gets cold sometimes.

Attachment: abr0022l.jpg
This has been downloaded 58 time(s).

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:22
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#37 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

...

Attachment: abr0338l.jpg
This has been downloaded 58 time(s).

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:23
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#38 Report this post to a moderator
Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

.

Attachment: abr0603l.jpg
This has been downloaded 58 time(s).

Flubber is offline Flubber
Emperor
With a view of the Rockies
Aug 2000
time: 22:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:24
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#39 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton

quote:
Originally posted by Spec
Life feeds on life. But superficial stuff made out of animals is INHUMAN imo. They dont eat those seals you know, they only take the skin to make coats and they have to club the seals so that it doesn't die so the skin stays soft by the time they skin it off.

Spec.


Learn what you are talking about. You are spouting the stuff the animal rights groups use for propoganda.

The Fogo Fisherman's co-operative sold every part of the seal they could. My father and grandfather would be shocked to hear that no one eats seal since they ate it reasonably frequently and " flipper pie" is a traditional recipe. I believe the bones are ground and used for something as well and seal oils has a number of uses.

In fact, finding alternate uses caused trouble as well. When fisherman found a market for seal penises . . (some Asian countries grind up the penis and use it as an aphrodesiac) there was a hue and cry over that as well as they were accused of killing seals only for the penis.

I'm not sure but I believe that shooting was looked at as an alternative and found to be ineffective for some reason

Skywise is offline Skywise
Prince
Samara's best friend
Jan 2002
time: 05:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:28
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#40 Report this post to a moderator
Increase the size of your Attachments

Flubber, not everyone does not eat seal. If you read all the posts you will find out that when men with sticks hit the seal to render them unconcious it is not to eat them but to skin them only.
Seal is a meal, and I am all for hunting them if the population is controled and the WHOLE body is used.

Killing an animal for it's skin or horns only is pure animal CRUALTY.

Period.

Spec.

Gangerolf is offline Gangerolf
Prince
huuhh
May 2001
time: 06:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:30
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#41 Report this post to a moderator
Got spare money?

quote:
Originally posted by Chemical Ollie
What about that TV photographer you expelled to Sweden for being "unpatriotic" on the seal hunting?


I don't remember much about that... Do you? I think he felt threatened by the sealhunters or something. Anyway, you can't be expelled for being unpatriotic

General Ludd is offline General Ludd
Emperor
Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:32
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#42 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote:
Originally posted by Flubber

However I know of no evidence that clubbing is any more or less humane than the method used to slaughter cows, pigs, chickens, sheep . . ..


I had no idea it was that inhumane.

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:33
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#43 Report this post to a moderator
Increase Your PM Length

It's not a joke but dancing Santas certainly fit the Xmas theme (unlike the debate about seal beating).

Attachment: dancing santa.gif
This has been downloaded 57 time(s).

Flubber is offline Flubber
Emperor
With a view of the Rockies
Aug 2000
time: 22:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:34
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#44 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

quote:
Originally posted by Spec

Wrong. They dont eat all the fish, we do. They re-authorized seal hunting to reduce their fish consomation so that we would have more. They are just twisting the facts around so that it seems alright to kill seals.


Spec.



The thousands of displaced fishermen who have lost their livlihood with the closure of the east coast cod fishery will be happy to know that you support the seals right to eat the fish.

Nobody is stupid enough to say that humans don't eat fish. . . Of course we do. To me its simple

1. Humans fish-- its food and its good economically for the fisherman.

2. Seals eat fish--seals are also a source of food, oils, furs, aphrodesiacs etc and there is a market for these products

3. Killing seals creates a marketable product and helps reduce the number of predators killing the various fish stocks, hopefully reducing the time until Canadaian fishermen can begin a fuller harvest.


Any films showing animals skinned alive are either old footage, the exception ( there are bad practices in every industry) or staged propoganda ( don't laugh-- the seal hunt is a big money maker for some animal rights groups)


I believe that humans use animals. I believe it should be done without cruelty and the most humane method possible used.

Gangerolf is offline Gangerolf
Prince
huuhh
May 2001
time: 06:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:36
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#45 Report this post to a moderator
Remove this text

Films have been shown of seals which appear to be "alive" even after death. Spasms in the body of a dead seal are a natural phenomenon. The seal spends a great deal of time under water and its blood is therefore capable of storing large amounts of oxygen. In addition, a seal's muscles can function for a while without a supply of oxygen. Consequently, the seal's body can display powerful spasms for a long time after its death.

Chemical Ollie is offline Chemical Ollie
Prince
Bored of this board
Jan 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:36
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#46 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

I think you get the message, even if the text is in Swedish...

Attachment: juljävlar.jpg
This has been downloaded 56 time(s).

Flubber is offline Flubber
Emperor
With a view of the Rockies
Aug 2000
time: 22:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:40
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#47 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote:
Originally posted by Spec
you will find out that when men with sticks hit the seal to render them unconcious it is not to eat them but to skin them only.

Spec.


Wrong--

it is the traditional method and for years it is true that a skin was taken and the carcass remained behind.

But the more recent seal hunt still uses the gaff as a method. Sealers are trained and a single blow will kill a seal if applied correctly. The entire carcass is used to the extent they have markets for them.

Chemical Ollie is offline Chemical Ollie
Prince
Bored of this board
Jan 2002
time: 06:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 06:48
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#48 Report this post to a moderator
Browse Apolyton AD-FREE

quote:
Originally posted by Gangerolf


I don't remember much about that... Do you? I think he felt threatened by the sealhunters or something. Anyway, you can't be expelled for being unpatriotic


Odd Lindberg was his name. There was so much critisism and unjust harrassment against him and his family that he eventually decided to move to Sweden. People called him a Quissling and a traitor - allmost like Michael Moore in America.

http://odin.dep.no/archive/attachme...04/NOU19028.pdf

Urban Ranger is offline Urban Ranger
Apolyton Duke of Off-Topic

Donate to the Red Cross
The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
May 1999
time: 13:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 09:34
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#49 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote:
Originally posted by Flubber
The thousands of displaced fishermen who have lost their livlihood with the closure of the east coast cod fishery will be happy to know that you support the seals right to eat the fish.


I don't see how these fishermen have more rights over the fishes than the seals.

quote:
Originally posted by Flubber
3. Killing seals creates a marketable product and helps reduce the number of predators killing the various fish stocks, hopefully reducing the time until Canadaian fishermen can begin a fuller harvest.


Again, the fishery wasn't and isn't depleted by seals eating the fishes, it's by overfishing by the fishermen. If they don't stop doing that, they can kill of all the seals, and the fisheries will still be all gone. Now not only you don't have any more fishes, you don't have any more seals, either. Good job.

MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:32
  Old Post 29-11-2003 23:57 Visit MrFun's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#50 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

Yeah -- those evil seals wanting to survive by eating!!


EVIL, EVIL I tell ya!

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 00:02
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#51 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Mr Fun: Are you just against the method used to harvest the seals or are you against all harvesting of seals? Also how is harvesting seals different from harvesting fish or wild birds?

Combat Ingrid is offline Combat Ingrid
Chieftain
Satan's Majestic Empire
Nov 2001
time: 06:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 00:41
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#52 Report this post to a moderator
Increase the size of your Attachments

quote:
Originally posted by Chemical Ollie
I think you get the message, even if the text is in Swedish...


MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 02:54 Visit MrFun's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#53 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

quote:
Originally posted by Oerdin
Mr Fun: Are you just against the method used to harvest the seals or are you against all harvesting of seals? Also how is harvesting seals different from harvesting fish or wild birds?



If the seals being harvested are not in danger of extinction, and the harvesting is done faithfully within the spirit of regulations to preserve their natural population, I suppose there is no serious harm.


I sure do not have any problems with leather for instance, obtained from cattle -- I have an authentic leather jacket myself.

Oerdin is offline Oerdin
King
of Internet Music.
Sep 2001
time: 21:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 03:45
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#54 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

How is leather different from fur? I mean in your earlier post you said you disliked fur but now you say you like leather. How is the distinction made from one animal hide compared to another?

MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 05:52 Visit MrFun's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#55 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Are cattle an endangered species??

General Ludd is offline General Ludd
Emperor
Minion of the Dominion
Aug 2001
time: 05:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 05:57
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#56 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote:
Originally posted by MrFun
Are cattle an endangered species??


No, they're just a slave species.

mrmitchell is offline mrmitchell
King

Donate to the Red Cross

Sep 2002
time: 23:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 07:27
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#57 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

We got to the top of the evolutionary chain, and by God we're going to abuse our position

Sava is offline Sava
King
GO GO GO!
Mar 2001
time: 23:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 07:35
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#58 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

does anyone else see the irony in a christian holiday using a pagan symbol (santa claus)??

mrmitchell is offline mrmitchell
King

Donate to the Red Cross

Sep 2002
time: 23:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 10:36
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#59 Report this post to a moderator
Inflate your Upload Space

Well if you want to get *****y about it, I'm sure everything in modern society dates to some pagan *******.

It's not the Christian holiday, Sava. It's the Commercial holiday.

David Floyd is offline David Floyd
King
The bottom of a large bottle of beer
Jan 1970
time: 05:32
  Old Post 30-11-2003 11:18 Visit David Floyd's homepage!
Edit/Delete Message Reply w/Quote
#60 Report this post to a moderator
Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

quote:
I don't see how these fishermen have more rights over the fishes than the seals.




OK, so then, you are saying that WRT fishing, fisherMEN and seals have equal rights. That implies either that the fishermen have no right to fish, or that seals have rights. Both of those statements are fairly ludicrous, so which one do you want to agree to?

 
Pages (3): [ 1   2   3   ]
< Last Thread     Next Thread > Post New Thread     Post A Reply
All times are GMT. The time now is 05:32.
Apolyton Time is 00:32.
    top of page
Rate This Thread:
archivepost
Forum Jump:
Forum Rules:
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
HTML code is ON
vB code is ON
Smilies are ON
[IMG] code is ON
 




Contact Us - Apolyton Civilization Site - Support Us!

Building a better Apolyton through better information. Click here and take our poll!
Non-US visitors, click here!

Powered by: vBulletin Version 2.0.3
Copyright ©2000, 2001, Jelsoft Enterprises Limited.

Page generated in 0.0551 seconds (92.79% PHP - 7.21% MySQL) with 31 queries
Page Loading Time:

Support Apolyton: Amazon USA | Amazon UK | Amazon DE | Amazon FR |
Support Apolyton and get FREE PLUS, Buy from Chips&Bits: Galactic Civilizations | Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition | Call to Power 2 | Civilization: The Boardgame | GURPS/ Alpha Centauri | Alpha Centauri | Civilization IV | Civilization III: Complete |


Front Page | Civilization IV | Civilization III | Civilization II | Call to Power II | Alpha Centauri | Master of Orion III
Rise of Nations | Galactic Civilizations | Galactic Civilizations II | Misc
Alt.Civs | Civ I | C:CtP I | About | News | Directory | Apolyton Store | Forums | Chat | Columns | Interviews | Newsletter
Scenario League | CSC | Clash of Civs | Spanish Site | CtP Maps | Cradle of Civ | WesW's Ctp1/2 Site | Civ3 Haven

apolyton.net | apolyton.com | civilization2.net | civilization3.net | civilization4.net | civilizationiv.info | calltopower.net | galciv.net | galciv2.net | moo3.net