05-12-2003 09:41									#1
	What is the best MBT? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Havn't seen this one in a while. LOL. Sorry, that I had to be the one to bring it back. Let the debate commence!

	05-12-2003 09:44									#2
	Increase Your PM Length

No!!!

* Urban Ranger gets trigger happy

	05-12-2003 10:05									#3
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

M1A2.

	05-12-2003 10:07									#4
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

T-34

JOn Miller

	05-12-2003 10:21									#5
	Re: What is the best MBT? Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

quote: Originally posted by connorkimbro Havn't seen this one in a while. LOL. Sorry, that I had to be the one to bring it back. Let the debate commence!

Yeah, best thread idea ever. We can´t have enough of the "my **** is the biggest" stuff

	05-12-2003 10:37									#6
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Clearly, you meant "my duck is the biggeest"

	05-12-2003 10:39									#7
	Got spare money?

LOL of course.

But we shouldn´t spam down this important thread

Leopard!

	05-12-2003 10:42									#8
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MERKAVA!!!

	05-12-2003 10:43									#9
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

The abrams rangefinder, for a weapon effective to a around 4 klicks, is calibrated to milimeters. So exactly where do you want the 120 milimeter round, Saddam.

	05-12-2003 10:52									#10
	Put an end to popups!

T-34 is not the best MBT, it is one of the most successful tanks.

Leopard II A6, Leclerc, and Merkava all look great on papers and training grounds, but none of them have ever been in a real tank battle.

	05-12-2003 10:57									#11
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quote: Leopard II A6, Leclerc, and Merkava all look great on papers and training grounds, but none of them have ever been in a real tank battle.

the europeans had their chance... if it wasnt for that whole not supporting the war in iraq thing...

	05-12-2003 11:34									#12
	Re: What is the best MBT? Get a bigger avatar today!

Brilliant idea. It's been far too long as it is.

quote: Originally posted by Bebro But we shouldn´t spam down this important thread

Heathen! How dare thy spam the holy of holies.


[Edit: Damn. Now those santa hats make that look silly. ]

	05-12-2003 11:56									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Lefty Scaevola The abrams rangefinder, for a weapon effective to a around 4 klicks, is calibrated to milimeters.

That seems like the epitome of stupidity. The changing conditions on the battlefield alone will preclude this sort of unrealistic precision.

	05-12-2003 12:31									#14
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger That seems like the epitome of stupidity. The changing conditions on the battlefield alone will preclude this sort of unrealistic precision.

At 4km you're probably right.
At 1-1.5km though it could be very useful to be able to put a sabot round in the space between the turret and the chassis.

Tanks without turrets aren't so much tanks as, ... well they aren't quite as effective as tanks with turrets anyway.

	05-12-2003 12:44									#15
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All we know now is that the Abrams is the most successful tank in history. Name one that has a more dominant record?

	05-12-2003 12:54									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Ned All we know now is that the Abrams is the most successful tank in history. Name one that has a more dominant record?

Dominant? Not like it saw major engagements like the tanks in WWII.

	05-12-2003 13:02									#17
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What tank has a better kill ratio in combat with other tanks?

	05-12-2003 13:05									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Ned What tank has a better kill ratio in combat with other tanks?

Kill ratio is meaningless without context. Was it 50 or 500 of your tanks did the job? What are those other tanks? Etc. Etc.

	05-12-2003 13:09									#19
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Well, I will leave the stats to others. But, until Iraq II, not a single Abrams was lost in battle. Not one. Yet it wiped out whole armored divisions in Gulf I, and defeated all opposition in Iraq II. The only losses are to RPG and hand-held anti-tank missiles.

So, its record against opposing tanks is perfect.

	05-12-2003 13:31									#20
	The Best M.B.T. Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Mozza, bacon & tomato ?

2 slices rye bread toasted
5 slices smokey side bacon
2-3 thick slices beefsteak tomato
2 slices real mozza (melt on bread before adding other stuff)
2-3 bib lettuce leaves
a touch of russian dressing

mmmm

	05-12-2003 14:49									#21
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Leo IIs have been in battle against Kurds.

	05-12-2003 15:36									#22
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quote: Originally posted by Lord Merciless Leopard II A6, Leclerc, and Merkava all look great on papers and training grounds, but none of them have ever been in a real tank battle.

Danish Leo I (let´s assume the LeoII is no step back ) tanks saw limited action in Bosnia around Tuzla since late 1993, came under fire several times, lost none of them, and attacked successfully several ari sites, bunkers, missile launchers and infantry. Ok, that were no tank vs. tank battles, but OTOH in those fights Abrams tanks were used the US usually was vastly superior too, because it did not face comparable modern equipment, so we still lack a good comparison IMO.

	05-12-2003 15:39									#23
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actually, the Merkava Mk 1 does have some armored battle experience against the Syrians in Lebanon.

	05-12-2003 15:39									#24
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Bernd, tell them the Turks use our tanks against the Kurds.

	05-12-2003 15:40									#25
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....and, of course, those Turks use(d?) Leos against the Kurds.

	05-12-2003 16:04									#26
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PzKfw-VI, with Michael Wittman or Otto Carius or Oberst Hyazinth Graf Strachwitz von Gross-Zauche und Camminetz

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	05-12-2003 16:54									#27
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When it comes to Majorly Boring Threads, the tank discussions are clearly the best option.

	05-12-2003 16:58									#28
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Clearly there should be much more discussion about skiing infantry.

	05-12-2003 17:01									#29
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Well?

Stefu? Pekka?

	05-12-2003 17:03									#30
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

And the BEST.TANK.EVER. is of course this one:

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