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Solver
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Apolyton Duke Of Something
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Latvia, Riga
Sep 2000
time: 07:32
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I'm interested in opinions, especially those who have been playing Civ 3 for a long time, of how well does Conquests go to fix certain problems in the game.
- Naval dominance. From what I heard, navies are made important in C3C - well, this sounds good. Is that true?
- The modern age. One of the biggest problems I saw... in the Modern Age, the spaceship came very early on the tech tree, and if you wanted, you could launch 3-4 turns after getting Synthetic Fibers. Most modern games ended very early in the modern age. Has the tech tree been reworked, or anything?
- Useless units. Marines seem to be good now, but how about Partroopers and Helicopters? Do they have their role in the game?
- Buying techs. Another big issue I think there was in Civ 3, that you had to research techs AI doesn't, and generally just buy techs from it for gold - or the rare tech you have. This approach provided better results at Regent, and at Monarch and above, you absolutely had to use it. Does it now make any sense to do your own research on Regent/Monarch?
- The tedium. Some might argue that there was none, but I believe that at a certain point in the Industrial Age, the game became tedious. The problem was, you pretty much had all the strategic resources, probably, and there was no real reason to fight a war - those were to expensive anyway. So, you just sit there, colonizing nothing, not fighting, and merely moving your workers around.
- Diplomatic agreements. Does your Foreign Advisor still always know whether the other side will accept the deal, making it feel like it's the advisor you're bargaining with, not the AI?
Please respond on the points above... I'll be getting C3C regardless, just because I want to own everything Civ, and I still believe Civ 3 has the most challenging AI (which, I hear, got improved again), but the points above are what make me annoyed by Civ 3 at times.
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Aramis
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Not where I was tomorrow, nor will be yesterday.
Dec 2002
time: 23:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Solver
- The tedium. Some might argue that there was none, but I believe that at a certain point in the Industrial Age, the game became tedious. The problem was, you pretty much had all the strategic resources, probably, and there was no real reason to fight a war - those were to expensive anyway. So, you just sit there, colonizing nothing, not fighting, and merely moving your workers around.
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No change there. But I consider tedium now a justifiable reason to go to war, and hang the expense
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CerberusIV
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Helicopters are more useful because of TOW infantry. You now have a unit that can be dropped on a key tile in enemy territory and can possibly last more than one turn. So these two units complement each other.
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vmxa1
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Oviedo, Fl
Nov 2001
time: 21:32
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Originally posted by Solver
"- Naval dominance. From what I heard, navies are made important in C3C - well, this sounds good. Is that true?"
Yes more important, but not important.
"- The modern age. One of the biggest problems I saw... in the Modern Age, the spaceship came very early on the tech tree, and if you wanted, you could launch 3-4 turns after getting Synthetic Fibers. Most modern games ended very early in the modern age. Has the tech tree been reworked, or anything?"
Not really, few minor tweaks.
"- Useless units. Marines seem to be good now, but how about Partroopers and Helicopters? Do they have their role in the game?"
No, only if you want to fool around with them.
"- Buying techs. Another big issue I think there was in Civ 3, that you had to research techs AI doesn't, and generally just buy techs from it for gold - or the rare tech you have. This approach provided better results at Regent, and at Monarch and above, you absolutely had to use it. Does it now make any sense to do your own research on Regent/Monarch?"
Yes, because you have a chance to get an SGL and if you get Philosphy first, you get a free tech.
It is required at Sid as you will not be able to trade for any after the first contact or two.
"- The tedium. Some might argue that there was none, but I believe that at a certain point in the Industrial Age, the game became tedious. The problem was, you pretty much had all the strategic resources, probably, and there was no real reason to fight a war - those were to expensive anyway. So, you just sit there, colonizing nothing, not fighting, and merely moving your workers around."
For those that see it that way, it has not chanced.
"- Diplomatic agreements. Does your Foreign Advisor still always know whether the other side will accept the deal, making it feel like it's the advisor you're bargaining with, not the AI?"
Yup
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notyoueither
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of naught
Aug 2001
time: 22:32
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quote:
Originally posted by Solver
I'm interested in opinions, especially those who have been playing Civ 3 for a long time, of how well does Conquests go to fix certain problems in the game.
- Naval dominance. From what I heard, navies are made important in C3C - well, this sounds good. Is that true? |
Yes, they are more important due to the better AI use of ships and escorts. Not as important as in CTP though with defined trade routes that can be disrupted.
quote:
- The modern age. One of the biggest problems I saw... in the Modern Age, the spaceship came very early on the tech tree, and if you wanted, you could launch 3-4 turns after getting Synthetic Fibers. Most modern games ended very early in the modern age. Has the tech tree been reworked, or anything? |
Unfortunately, not changed significantly.
quote:
- Useless units. Marines seem to be good now, but how about Partroopers and Helicopters? Do they have their role in the game? |
They always did depending on play style and what you expect out of them. There is a new improved para that toughens them up some in the modern era.
quote:
- Buying techs. Another big issue I think there was in Civ 3, that you had to research techs AI doesn't, and generally just buy techs from it for gold - or the rare tech you have. This approach provided better results at Regent, and at Monarch and above, you absolutely had to use it. Does it now make any sense to do your own research on Regent/Monarch? |
Definitely if you want to get Sci Gr Leaders you need to be the first to discover techs. They are the only way to rush Great Wonders. Also, costs of buying techs were adjusted back during PTW patches to reduce the effectiveness of the 'follow the leader' strategy.
quote:
- The tedium. Some might argue that there was none, but I believe that at a certain point in the Industrial Age, the game became tedious. The problem was, you pretty much had all the strategic resources, probably, and there was no real reason to fight a war - those were to expensive anyway. So, you just sit there, colonizing nothing, not fighting, and merely moving your workers around. |
Addressed to an extent. With the new resourse distribution, there is no way to know if you are going to have aluminum and or uranium. I would not stop grabbing outposts if I were anyone.
btw, aren't all Civ games effected by this? You get to a size that you can sit back and build the peaceful victory conditions?
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- Diplomatic agreements. Does your Foreign Advisor still always know whether the other side will accept the deal, making it feel like it's the advisor you're bargaining with, not the AI? |
Well... you could cover that part of the screen and just lob deals over til they accept or not, but that would be tedious from my POV.
However, I have heard of some situations where the advisor will tell you that it won't be accepted, but if you actually make an offer it will be accepted.
quote:
Please respond on the points above... I'll be getting C3C regardless, just because I want to own everything Civ, and I still believe Civ 3 has the most challenging AI (which, I hear, got improved again), but the points above are what make me annoyed by Civ 3 at times. |
I hope you enjoy it. It is improved in many ways, but it is still Civ3 at its core.
Last edited by notyoueither on 06-12-2003 at 05:00
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Dominae
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quote:
Originally posted by Solver
- Naval dominance. From what I heard, navies are made important in C3C - well, this sounds good. Is that true?
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Not really. Playing with the ADM values of ships does not make the naval aspect of Civ3 more important. I rarely built ships in Play the World and I'm not seeing anything in the AI that compels me to build them in Conquests.
quote:
- The modern age. One of the biggest problems I saw... in the Modern Age, the spaceship came very early on the tech tree, and if you wanted, you could launch 3-4 turns after getting Synthetic Fibers. Most modern games ended very early in the modern age. Has the tech tree been reworked, or anything?
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The Modern era should be slighly better, if you get there. No matter how much they play with it, the Modern era will always suffer from the same problem: it comes too late in the game. This is not a complaint, as I imagine it is more or less unavoidable in a game of this kind.
quote:
- Useless units. Marines seem to be good now, but how about Partroopers and Helicopters? Do they have their role in the game?
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They have a role if you get around to building them. The units you mention come around the late-Industrial, which is basically the Modern age. But yes, in those games where I had the chance to reach the games later stages, the new and altered units were definitely a fine addition.
quote:
- Buying techs. Another big issue I think there was in Civ 3, that you had to research techs AI doesn't, and generally just buy techs from it for gold - or the rare tech you have. This approach provided better results at Regent, and at Monarch and above, you absolutely had to use it. Does it now make any sense to do your own research on Regent/Monarch?
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Still true, I'm sad to say. On Monarch you can get away with doing your own research, and it's profitable to do so because of SGLs. On Emperor it's more profitable not to research and tech trade instead (using Gold for upgrades). On Deity and Sid, there's no chance of keeping up in research anyway, so saving up cash is the only option. In this sense, SGLs (the new reason to research your own techs) make the easier difficulties easier and the harder difficulties harder.
quote:
- The tedium. Some might argue that there was none, but I believe that at a certain point in the Industrial Age, the game became tedious. The problem was, you pretty much had all the strategic resources, probably, and there was no real reason to fight a war - those were to expensive anyway. So, you just sit there, colonizing nothing, not fighting, and merely moving your workers around.
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Well, if you're playing to win, just sitting there will not cut it. Once you reach the Industrial era and all your cities are connected by Railroads, you can more or less automate them all after that. The only tedium after that is tech trading...and figuring out who your first target will be with Tanks!
quote:
- Diplomatic agreements. Does your Foreign Advisor still always know whether the other side will accept the deal, making it feel like it's the advisor you're bargaining with, not the AI?
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Yes. Between this and the color-coded scheme of GalCiv, I have no preference. I've become quite fond of the Foreign Advisor.
quote:
Please respond on the points above... I'll be getting C3C regardless, just because I want to own everything Civ, and I still believe Civ 3 has the most challenging AI (which, I hear, got improved again), but the points above are what make me annoyed by Civ 3 at times. |
As you can see, most of the annoying things in the game (for you) are still in the game. C3C is not an overhaul of Civ3, it's an expansion. Expect same Civ3 experience, only with more "stuff". Whether or not this is worth your money is up to you.
Dominae
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05-12-2003 18:42
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? I remembre you as having quite some interesting posts about the game...
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