08-12-2003 03:57									#1
	Advice for my game... Got spare money?

I am using the apolyton pack. I will give as much info as I can. My gov is Republic. I created four new settlers as i have only 11 cities right now and wanted to get up faster (am I wrong?) by faster I mean a larger prodution and such civilization. I have cease fire treaties with england and america (there are three other civs out there but cant see em yet) I have gunpowder units ( infantryman and cannons). I was going to build invading armies and attack england (whos civ is larger than me by having 14 cities..) No other civs have gunpowder yet. My real question is should I wait for more modern units OR attack now. AND.. what should my attaking/invading forces be made up of. I have seen posts about early attack forces but nothing about infantryman and knights or such. Please help. I am wondering if I should make stacks of say 4 infantryman 4 samurai and 4 knights but I am not sure. and another stack of just cannon for softening up the cities. England currently has three 12 stack units hanging around my borders and I feel I may need to deal with em first. Sorry for such a long post. Please advise as you can, if you need more info please tell me and Ill get it.....

Lars.

	08-12-2003 04:21									#2
	Support Apolyton

Go Fascism then Cavalry Tactics and destroy them with Cavalry.

edit/ i would also get more cities, maybe 25/30 and build mines on hills and mountains to support your Cavalry hordes.

	08-12-2003 04:23									#3
	Ah ok..but... Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Ok go fascism and get cavalry. Um do you have advice for attack stacks? I have seen some posts as to 2 knights 4 infantry and 6 cannons. Do you like this stack? By the way would building Pikemen be better than samurai, or neither and stick to knights/infantry and cannons? Thanks Maq....

Lars

	08-12-2003 04:44									#4
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Okay if you want to go without Cavalry,

To attack you might use 6 Knight and 6 Mounted Archer or 8:4, this maybe outdated but it moves fast and causes trouble in unguarded cities, of course 12 Cavalry is preferred. Try to keep fast moving units together and slow together.

Pikemen are better than Samurai because they have lower support cost (4 pikemen/5 samurai) Pikemen also have shorter build time and Samurai will get killed fast in big fights. Samurai move 2 but Knights move 4, so Samurai are Ancient age unit.

	08-12-2003 04:49									#5
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hey Maq..um what do I use infantryman for and/or when. Do I use em to attack. For example I know where the capital is and you are planning to attack it. You know that the enemy has units (4catapults 4pikemen and maybe knights or samurai) in there. What would you bring to the party? I have cannons and infantry but was on the fence on when/how to use em. You say ideally I want all cavalry?...hmm

	08-12-2003 04:58									#6
	Put an end to popups!

Infantryman is a tricky unit rarely used for me because gap of research between Gunpowder (Infantryman) and Fascism (Fascists) is very short because i go into Fascism gov so i build Fascists instead and then Cavalry when i get it, but if youre stuck you could go 6 Infantry 6 Cannons with another 12 stack of Cannons nearby and bombard, throw some Knights in there to keep them confused and pillage logistic roads.

	08-12-2003 05:05									#7
	Thanks Maq... Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

I am currently researching 'banking'? Should I change and try to rush to fasiasm and get the fasciast. By the way is the fasciast an offensive ranged unit? So to recap you would rather forgo infantry and head right to another tech and get cavarly asap..correct?

Thanks again

Lars

	08-12-2003 05:14									#8
	Enter the AD-FREE zone

Make Fascism your research "goal" then go Cavalry Tactics.

Fascists are a defensive unit, think of them as an Infantryman with slightly better ranged ability, which means they can attack from back row in 12 stacks, but they are weak at back so use Cannon. Only build Fascists if you need units fast, otherwise Cavalry.

	08-12-2003 05:19									#9
	Why fasism.... Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Why fascism.. is it good ..um what are the bennies for getting it. Or is it just to get cavalry faster?

Lars

	08-12-2003 05:29									#10
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

Fascism is much better than any previous gov, much better production is the main improvement, which means you can support more troops, make more public works and build things faster. When you discover Fascism go to compare government feature in "Empire Manager" and compare it to Republic.

	08-12-2003 18:04									#11
	Put an end to popups!

Well you should also ask yourself if you want to be in control of a fascist state?

I find i like to stay with monarchy(to get on the road to knights), untill i've got republic or communism. It may mean i get less of a technical advantage, but it sits better with me

	09-12-2003 02:22									#12
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and i bet you never once used a slaver either right

	09-12-2003 15:45									#13
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well i try to avoid the temptation of course(which means i have) - i dont use them in my armies(too powerful an option IMHO), just as standalone units and if the AI doesn't start a slave war on me first i dont slave back. If i have been slaved against, then the gloves are off, although i see it as freeing my caught slaves - i go for the cities with the slave symbol over them

So i would often get my a*se kicked in MP if playing someone less scrupelous than myself(unless i hosted the game and used the 'exclude' options)

	12-12-2003 03:41									#14
	Remove this text

Of what use are slavers? Please elaborate. Why is it something that is overpowered? I have never used slaves nor slavers in any game. What am I missing?

Lars

	12-12-2003 04:15									#15
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You can stack Slavers with an army and if that army wins any battle a slave will go to your closest city. Or you can just use Slavers on their own to "Slave Raid" cities, but this isnt as good because it can fail if the city has a city wall especially and the slaver will die.

	12-12-2003 18:21									#16
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization III: Complete

quote: Originally posted by Maquiladora You can stack Slavers with an army and if that army wins any battle a slave will go to your closest city. Or you can just use Slavers on their own to "Slave Raid" cities, but this isnt as good because it can fail if the city has a city wall especially and the slaver will die.

one slaver in an army ensures that one your cities will increase in population every time you win a battle. In some mods you have to have slavemasters though.

Some people like to have a couple of small armies designed specifically to go after barbs and incrrease popultion quickly. It is also useful to have slavers in border cities so that you can see when other slavers are coming to attack you, 'cos they can see all units. Slavers are also good to use as sentries watching for attack.

	12-12-2003 20:43									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

Slaving = big time cheese tactic.

	12-12-2003 21:46									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Boney Some people like to have a couple of small armies designed specifically to go after barbs and incrrease popultion quickly. It is also useful to have slaves in border cities so that you can see when other slaves are coming to attack you, 'cos they can see all units. Slaves are also good to use as sentries watching for attack.

I hope you mean slavers and not slaves Boney, or do you consider slaves as a plague who are spreading around and around like zombies?

-Martin

	12-12-2003 22:00									#19
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

* MrBaggins laughs, and almost falls off his chair

	13-12-2003 01:03									#20
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

double postage.

	13-12-2003 01:04									#21
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quote: Originally posted by MrBaggins Slaving = big time cheese tactic.

so true....

In MP i saw someone once let one of their own cities get captured by barbs and they then sat 3 stacks with a slaver in each around the barb city and killed a barb every couple of turns that barb city produced a warrior. I wont play with slavers in MP anymore.

	13-12-2003 02:03									#22
	Full PM-box? Change here!

quote: Originally posted by Maquiladora so true.... In MP i saw someone once let one of their own cities get captured by barbs and they then sat 3 stacks with a slaver in each around the barb city and killed a barb every couple of turns that barb city produced a warrior. I wont play with slavers in MP anymore.

That is just sooooo evil

	13-12-2003 02:56									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

I actually considered suggesting that slaving be reduced two ways...

First by removing all barbarian slaving. Its cheesy. (basis: they always fight to the death)

Second by instituting a (hidden to the player) points system for slavery... I.E. if you capture a one stack.. you get one "slave point"... a 12-stack, 12 "slave points"

Maybe allow razing of cities, and the city size goes to points.

Then, have a (modifiable.. by government perhaps) value required to gain a slave... like... say.. 6 points. Every 6 "slave points" you get... a slave is generated in your empire.