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Ned is offline Ned
Prince
of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 04:12
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quote:
Originally posted by KrazyHorse


Don't you spend that on your military every year?


No doubt. But before we can judge whether a full coverage package as advocated by the Dems is something we should consider we should have an idea about what such a plan would cost.

It is also strange that the Dems would want to spend more that Bush at a time when they are complaining about the deficit.

Patroklos is offline Patroklos
Warlord
Back home in good ole Norfolk VA
Dec 2001
time: 05:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 04:15
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I am confused,

Why should the rich get less, when they pay more. We are not socialist, even though I know alot of you are, so why would you expect such a thing to happen. I hate the bill, but would even more if they included that.

It is not the burden of the rich to support the poor, because I know none of you believe it is the burden of the poor to support the rich.

I personally think we should invest the 400 billion on curing cancer or aids, rather than artifuicially extending the life span of the baby boomers 20 years. Talk about irresposibility, creating a program that was proven to collapse at a certain time but will survive long enough benifit them at the cost of robbing their own children, all because they don't want to face mortality

Then again, talk to me in 40 years and I may think different.

-Pat

Ned is offline Ned
Prince
of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 04:18
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quote:
Originally posted by Ramo

Congress shall have the power ... to promote the Progress of Science and Useful Arts, by securing for limited Times to Authors and Inventors the exclusive Right to their Respective Writings and Discoveries



Do you see anything in this clause that grants Congress the power to grant non exclusive rights to inventors?

Ramo is offline Ramo
King
Austin, Texas, USA
Oct 1999
time: 23:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 04:20 Visit Ramo's homepage!
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They can grant exclusive rights to multiple organizations.

Imran Siddiqui is offline Imran Siddiqui

Deity
The Potterverse
Jan 1970
time: 00:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 04:22
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quote:
the much larger entitlement program for powerful biotech corporations called intellectual property.


Yep, intellectual property IS more important than this perscription drug plan, I agree .

BustaMike is offline BustaMike
King
You think you're better than me? You've been handling my ass pennies!!!
Nov 1999
time: 21:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 04:59 Visit BustaMike's homepage!
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quote:
Don't you spend that on your military every year?


That's my point. It's outrageous.

Patroklos is offline Patroklos
Warlord
Back home in good ole Norfolk VA
Dec 2001
time: 05:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 05:10
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Hey,

I have an idea, lets not make perscription drugs profitable, that way nobody will make them. Despite the pessemistic views most of you seem to harbor about these companies, I am sure there are a few researchers and stock holdres that like helping people. Drugs are expensive because as time goes on they accomplish more and more amazing things. Sure the companies make profits, so what. I honestly believe that money would be better spent curing diseases that effect the entire population, rather than squandering the money on perscrition drugs which are targeted more and more to only benefit the aged. If they invent a way for a person to live forever in a formaldihide jar a la Futurama I am sure the greying majority will vote to strip the countrry's resources for that. I would probobly be more sympathetic if the money I pay in taxes would someday help me, but their is no way this ridiculous system will survive twenty years, let alone unitl I could use it.

By the way the benefit to being rich, or just having marginaly more money, is you can buy more. Moan all you want, but monetary achievement is the basic rating for success worldwide. If their was no reward to earning money, well, look what happened to some of those experments. I am all about changing that standard, but untill then, "get back to work, you not bieng paid to believe in the power of your dreams."

-Pat

Ned is offline Ned
Prince
of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 05:51
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quote:
Originally posted by Ramo
They can grant exclusive rights to multiple organizations.


No they cannot.

Berzerker is offline Berzerker
Emperor
topeka, kansas,USA
May 1999
time: 23:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 06:05
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One feature of this "reform" is that taxpayers will be forced to subsidise businesses that offered employees prescription benefits. Oh great, General Motors (e.g.) offers employees a prescription drug plan and now US taxpayers get stuck with the bill?

Ned is offline Ned
Prince
of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 06:16
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Unfortunately for the communist party/aka Democrats, the constitution prevents them from killing patent rights.

Go f*ck yourself Democrats.

Kidicious is offline Kidicious
Settler
Diety of Kidiverse
Mar 2003
time: 21:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 06:17 Visit Kidicious's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Ned
Unfortunately for the communist party/aka Democrats, the constitution prevents them from killing patent rights.

Go f*ck yourself Democrats.


KrazyHorse is offline KrazyHorse
King
Macedonia
May 2001
time: 00:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 06:19 Visit KrazyHorse's homepage!
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Isn't he precious?

Kidicious is offline Kidicious
Settler
Diety of Kidiverse
Mar 2003
time: 21:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 06:21 Visit Kidicious's homepage!
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#43 Report this post to a moderator
Get a bigger avatar today!

We laugh until he becomes a senator.

Berzerker is offline Berzerker
Emperor
topeka, kansas,USA
May 1999
time: 23:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 06:22
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quote:
Unfortunately for the communist party/aka Democrats, the constitution prevents them from killing patent rights.


The Constitution authorises Medicare?

Ramo is offline Ramo
King
Austin, Texas, USA
Oct 1999
time: 23:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 07:09 Visit Ramo's homepage!
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quote:
No they cannot.


What a substantive response!

quote:
the constitution prevents them from killing patent rights.


Patents are specifically considered privileges from the state. The authority to enforce patents are powers of the state, not the right of individuals/businesses. If Congress doesn't want to enforce a business' monopoly over a technology, it can do that. That's what the Constitution says. See Article 1, Section 8, Clause 8 again.

quote:
Unfortunately for the communist party/aka Democrats,


And note, that intellectual property is opposed to the free market. Intellectual property means that the state can tell people what they can or cannot buy and produce. Really, it's like a command economy - like the Soviet Union. So it's not the Dems that are terrorist commies, but you and your fellow Republicans!

St Leo is offline St Leo
King of Scenario League
Member of the Apolyton Social Democratic Party
Jul 2005
time: 00:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 07:16 Visit St Leo<br><img src=/forums/images/staff-icon.gif>'s homepage!
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Down with the Republican and Democratic commies. Long live the capitalist saviours that are the Greens.

Ramo is offline Ramo
King
Austin, Texas, USA
Oct 1999
time: 23:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 07:19 Visit Ramo's homepage!
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MrFun is offline MrFun
King
of Iowa
Nov 2000
time: 23:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 07:22 Visit MrFun's homepage!
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I actually laughed out loud when I saw that hippie smilie with the Santa cap.


My how the Santa cap can change some of the emoticons.

Urban Ranger is offline Urban Ranger
Apolyton Duke of Off-Topic

Donate to the Red Cross
The City State of Noosphere, CPA special envoy
May 1999
time: 13:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 13:30
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#49 Report this post to a moderator
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quote:
Originally posted by Imran Siddiqui
quote:
Why do you say it's the Left who is complaining?


Because the biggest complainers about this bill are those running in the Democratic primary.


Someone's confusing the Dems with the left?

Comrade Tassadar is offline Comrade Tassadar
Settler

Aug 2005
time: 05:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 14:27 Visit Comrade Tassadar's homepage!
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I must admit I know next to nothing about this bill. Educate me.

Though Ned doesn't need to even try. I only read him for entertainment

axi is offline axi
Prince
Athens Greece
Sep 1999
time: 07:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 15:15
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quote:
By the way the benefit to being rich, or just having marginaly more money, is you can buy more. Moan all you want, but monetary achievement is the basic rating for success worldwide. If their was no reward to earning money, well, look what happened to some of those experments. I am all about changing that standard, but untill then, "get back to work, you not bieng paid to believe in the power of your dreams."


There is an old saying in Greece:
"A little money you can make by toiling,
a lot of money you can only make by cheating."

The monetary incentive works only for productive inividuals who are rewarded with a proportionate part of their own productivity. For individuals who have found some cash cow (be it property or administrative rights, or a patent, or a business scheme) and they are milking it for all they can, their motive will not be diminished if alot of that money is appropriated by the state.

rah is offline rah
Apolyton Prince of Moderators, Master of Reason
Lord of the Ferrets
Jan 1970
time: 23:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 18:53
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It's not about the people, it's about the politicians and who can get the most benefit from giving away money.
(SOP)

After the Dems whined about how expensive the new plan is and how it will increase the deficit, they are concerned that only the REPs will get credit with the voters, so THEY"VE CHANGED THEIR Tune. LET"S GIVE AWAY MORE MONEY.


****************************************
Medicare drug plan signed but not sealed
Democrats seek to reopen battle, increase benefits

By William Neikirk, Tribune senior correspondent. Tribune staff writer Christopher Steiner in Chicago contributed to this report
Published December 9, 2003

WASHINGTON -- The Medicare prescription drug bill that President Bush signed Monday gives him a re-election boost, but it also presages huge battles over how generous to make the new benefit and how much of a private flavor to give the entire program.

In other words, the Medicare wars appear to be a long way from over.

Even as the president hailed the measure as the first major expansion of Medicare since it was approved in 1965, Democrats countered by labeling the new benefit inadequate and serving notice that they will try to broaden it when Congress returns to action in an election year.

Senate Minority Leader Tom Daschle (D-S.D.) called the measure "a lemon," and Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-Mass.) promised an effort to repeal the legislation and replace it with a costlier, more generous drug benefit. "We're going to take back our Medicare," Kennedy said.
****************************************

If this wasn't so sad, it would be funny.

chegitz guevara is offline chegitz guevara
King
Ft. Lauderdale, FL Communist Party of Apolyton
Jun 2000
time: 00:32
  Old Post 09-12-2003 20:16 Visit chegitz guevara's homepage!
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quote:
Originally posted by Patroklos
Hey,

I have an idea, lets not make perscription drugs profitable, that way nobody will make them.


Given that most perscription drugs are made with public money and researched in major universities, I don't think we have to worry.

Ned is offline Ned
Prince
of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:32
  Old Post 10-12-2003 03:57
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quote:
Originally posted by Comrade Tassadar
I must admit I know next to nothing about this bill. Educate me.

Though Ned doesn't need to even try. I only read him for entertainment


Why Commie Tassador, touche!

Ned is offline Ned
Prince
of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:32
  Old Post 10-12-2003 04:00
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quote:
Originally posted by chegitz guevara


Given that most perscription drugs are made with public money and researched in major universities, I don't think we have to worry.


Che, this really flies in the face of conventional wisdom. Therefor, I assume you said this because it was true and not just propaganda, right?

BTW, where did you get your "facts.?

Kuciwalker is offline Kuciwalker
Emperor
of Schmooism
Feb 2001
time: 00:32
  Old Post 10-12-2003 04:06
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quote:
Given that most perscription drugs are made with public money and researched in major universities, I don't think we have to worry.


I don't think I EVERY recall any of the new drugs that Scientific American keeps harping on being developed by anything OTHER than a corporation.

GePap is offline GePap
King
of the Big Apple
Nov 2001
time: 23:32
  Old Post 10-12-2003 04:51
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Drug companies are the most profitable companies in the US- and some of their biggest costs are not research but marketing (all those endless drug commercials cost money, you know), which brings up an interesting point-why advertise prescription drugs directly to consumers?

And to respond to The Diplomats sad little troll- no, the "left" does not like the bill, anymore than they like the 4 trillion over 10 years Military spending plan either.

Drake Tungsten is offline Drake Tungsten
Prince
Knee deep in alien womyn...
Oct 2001
time: 14:32
  Old Post 10-12-2003 05:17
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Dear god, please let the Democrats kill this shitty prescription drug plan before I have to start paying taxes again.

Ned is offline Ned
Prince
of Aptos, CA
Oct 1999
time: 21:32
  Old Post 10-12-2003 10:28
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quote:
Originally posted by Drake Tungsten
Dear god, please let the Democrats kill this shitty prescription drug plan before I have to start paying taxes again.


HUH? Haven't you been LISTENING. The DEMS want to spend more. A LOT more.

If you are concerned about your taxes, you should never consider voting for a Democrat.

Drake Tungsten is offline Drake Tungsten
Prince
Knee deep in alien womyn...
Oct 2001
time: 14:32
  Old Post 10-12-2003 11:14
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I want the Dems to kill this plan and then fail in instituting their even bigger plan, thereby saving us all from the fiscal stone around the neck that is expanded Medicare. Not likely, I know, but a man can dream, can't he?

 
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