10-12-2003 11:24									#1
	Bush kicked Chen in the balls Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

The Globe and Mail

quote: "The comments and actions made by the leader of Taiwan indicate that he may be willing to make decisions unilaterally, to change the status quo, which we oppose," Mr. Bush said in the Oval Office. "We oppose any unilateral decision by either China or Taiwan to change the status quo." Mr. Chen's plan for a "defensive referendum" to coincide with the presidential election in Taiwan on March 20 is regarded as provocative by Beijing, which sees it as the thin edge of an independence wedge. Meanwhile, Mr. Bush's administration is actively seeking closer co-operation with Beijing, especially on defusing the risks of a confrontation with nuclear-armed North Korea. Although Mr. Bush and senior U.S. officials insisted that the tough talk on Taiwan signals no shift in policy, the President's change in tone was undoubtedly warmly welcomed in Beijing.

So long Mr Chen, the exit is to the left.

	10-12-2003 11:28									#2
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Well, did you think any American politician in any significant position would have the principles to not kiss PRC ass, considering how much the US is a Chinese trade-*****?

Like the ol' RCA dog, ol' George heard His Masters Voice.

	10-12-2003 11:32									#3
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Even though Bush says this, Chen can probably go ahead with the referendum anyway. Bush has a lot of influence in Taiwan, but he doesn't run the place.

	10-12-2003 11:33									#4
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I am begining to wonder if George has a plan.

	10-12-2003 11:37									#5
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A cunning plan?

	10-12-2003 11:40									#6
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I'd much prefer to see the US adopt a Two China Policy - the PRC is a legitimate nation, as is the ROC.

	10-12-2003 11:40									#7
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I would settle for just regular toilet trips at this point.

	10-12-2003 11:46									#8
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is it true you work for the chinese?

	10-12-2003 11:52									#9
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just chuckling to myself at what David Floyd's definition of a legitimate nation might be....

	10-12-2003 12:11									#10
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**shrug** Just another example of realpolitik at work. Taiwan is a puny little spit of land claimed by a an up-and-coming power, and it looks like they're just going to have to live (or die) with it.

Gatekeeper

	10-12-2003 12:44									#11
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I agree with Floyd in that both Taiwan and China are legitimate nations...but I feel that persuing a two-China policy in the White House would be disasterous. I support holding the status quo. It's a thin line to balance on, but I think it can be done. I think what Bush said is good because it shows China that we're not just out to get them - we have a policy and we're sticking to it.

	10-12-2003 12:59									#12
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quote: I agree with Floyd in that both Taiwan and China are legitimate nations

Taiwan may be a de facto state, but as to now they've never asked to be considered a seperate state from mainland China (they claim soveriegnty over the mainland, officially, as the mainland claims soveriegnty over the island). Even if they declared statehood, I bet there wouldn't be many that would recognize it, meaning it wouldn't matter... well except to the Chinese who would try to squash it like a bug.

	10-12-2003 13:08									#13
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Taiwan has been recognized as a legitimate state before by some other nations, hasn't it?

	10-12-2003 13:11									#14
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quote: Taiwan has been recognized as a legitimate state before by some other nations, hasn't it?

I don't think so. Simply allowing the President to visit doesn't confer formal recognition of statehood .

	10-12-2003 13:30									#15
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No, not just that...I thought some nations actually recognized Taiwan as an independent nation and gave it full diplomatic status. Hmmm...

	10-12-2003 13:33									#16
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Nope. It's also be inconsistant with Taiwan not declaring itself as a soveriegn state. That's gotta happen first before any formal recognition of statehood.

	10-12-2003 15:36									#17
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Some small countries do have formal diplomatic relations with Taiwan. However I am not sure if they treat Taiwan as a soveriegn nation or not.

	10-12-2003 15:40									#18
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The ROC held China's seat in the UN for quite a while - I believe until the Nixon administration.

	10-12-2003 15:41									#19
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This is one position that Bush has taken that even Dean will support I predict.

	10-12-2003 16:39									#20
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Chen to Bush, Go f*ck yourself!

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/asiap...hina/index.html

	10-12-2003 17:08									#21
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He actually kicked a guy in the nuts? Geez, all his dad ever did in Asia was throw up on somebody.

	10-12-2003 17:10									#22
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further proof that the notion of "spreading democracy" is merely conditional.

	10-12-2003 17:19									#23
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oop, wrong thread.

	10-12-2003 19:04									#24
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger Some small countries do have formal diplomatic relations with Taiwan. However I am not sure if they treat Taiwan as a soveriegn nation or not.

Thank you. I thought this was the case.

	10-12-2003 19:07									#25
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quote: Chen to Bush, Go f*ck yourself!

bush for doing this


yes, i know geopolitics is a bigger issue than this. but i like taiwan. i don't really like red china.

but it says something sad when most of the people at asean held more respect for hu when hu discussed a lot more issues at the last conference. bush went there on a one-track mind. terrorism. nothing else.

	10-12-2003 20:11									#26
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The CIA world fact book list Taiwan as the last choice on the list, after Z. Hmmph... But it doesn't tell which countries have diplo relations with them, only that US doesn't.

	10-12-2003 20:14									#27
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BUSH, THANK YOU!

I mean we already have 99.9% of the world pissed at us, lets piss off one of the last nations that still like us! Especially when we have supported them officially/unofficially for decades....

	11-12-2003 00:20									#28
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quote: Originally posted by Q Cubed further proof that the notion of "spreading democracy" is merely conditional.

[dopey fox news watcher who shops at walmart (china's *****) voice]
we went to iraq for liberation!~

now I'll buy another american flag for my suv at walmart.

SUPPORT THE TROOPS, LISTEN TO RUSH!
[/dopey fox news watcher who shops at walmart (china's *****) voice]

we really should invent nerve stapling!

	11-12-2003 00:32									#29
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

Why? It's not like there's a shortage of stupid people.

	11-12-2003 00:35									#30
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quote: Originally posted by MichaeltheGreat Why? It's not like there's a shortage of stupid people.

yeah but we need to take away their ability to actively make the world a worse place...