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Pekka
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em seu burro dos pais!
Feb 2002
time: 07:32
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Absolutely! We the people are against this.. but nothing changes.. ministers of justice, they all say we must punish harder (meaning judges should use more the upper scale of the sentences, NOT more years to the scale!), but nothing happens. I'm not kidding when I say rapists, stabbers, drunk drivers who have accidentally killed people etc walk FREE. I'm not kidding when I say life is 12 years. I'm not kidding when I say you get half off of sentences. And that you get vacations etc etc.
It's a joke and everyone knows it. Unfortunately criminals knows this also.
It's like this. People think it's all good, and that we don't have crime. But they don't consider beatings etc crimes. If 5 men attacks 1 man and beats the living crap out of him for no reason, it's not a crime. It's a fight. Things like this.. Not to mention, almost the only way you do get punished is when you defend yourself... that's when you cross the line. It is frequent, that when someone attacks someone, the one who was attacked gets bigger punishment, just because he used bigger force aka was able to beat the attacked  NO KIDDING!
For example there was this man who owned a gas station, and few guys broke in at night and started looting the place. The owner had a gun and shouted 'get out or I'll shoot!' .. not 'to the ground now, I'll arrest you' but 'go away!'. But Noooo the guy had to be macho about it and walk towards the owner. Pretty scary situation don't you think for the owner? Well, the owner warned the guy about million times, and then he shot the attacker IN his own gas station at night to the LEG.
Pretty good aim at the dark, and in scary situation. I would have put it in the chest personally.
Anyway, the guys who robbed the place and attacked the owner, didn't go to jail. They did get sentenced for robbing the place, but the owner got sentenced for taking it too far of defending himself, and got bigger punishment.
The point is, you can't defend yourself. Because, you don't know if the other person would have really done that, what he was threatning about and waving the gun at your face. You couldn't KNOW! You can always talk! You can alwyas RUN. ALWAYS! No matter what the situation is.
I'm sick of it, it makes my physically sick. Nothing happens, nothing changes. Crimes do get more hard though, but nothing changes as for better justice system.
And these are individual cases, but these are those everyday cases. It is more rare, that sentence is different from these, and that's what is scary.
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Pekka
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em seu burro dos pais!
Feb 2002
time: 07:32
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shawnmmcc, well no matter what I think of our system, most people agree with me (finns) that the justice system is jsut horrible. It's not corrupted, but it's horrible.
Another example since you brought out child molestors. We just release our most famous child molestor, after serving that famous life setnence. He actually served it fully. But then again, he did kidnap two young children, put them into small dungeon he built, raped them multiple times and held them prisoners, strangled and killed them, burned their bodies and was caught in his car with the bones in his trunk. Life sentence = FINALLY! Oh wait.. what was that in our standards??? 
The mother of these children made an outcry, that don't let this man out, because of what he did, and that he don't deserve to get free this soon. Well he did his maximum time. Too bad.
And I'm not just bringing up the worst cases I've heard of. ****, I bet I can find some cases from todays papers, and many more that aren't written about if I go through the effort. It's not like saying 'Bush almost choked on a pretzel - He has EATING DISORDERS!'. This is monday-sunday everyday normal stuff.
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Pekka
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em seu burro dos pais!
Feb 2002
time: 07:32
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This is also one of the problems in violent crimes, vigilantism. People are not very fast to take justice in their own hands here, so don't get me wrong. But in the case of beatings, stabbings etc.. no good to go to police, it's not like the attacker gets anything. So what you do is hit back. You don't need to be in a gang to do it, ordinary guys do this all the time. One reason is because it is seen as the only way to set the record straight. Because no one gets anything for it. And you have to get back, don't you? You can't let it go. And it always gets out of the hand at some point people going back and forth.. it's when someone dies, that's when someone goes to jail for few years.
The reason I hate these young punks also. They KNOW no one can touch them in the justice system. Meaning they won't do time whatever they do. The piss off people, beat up people, so I hate them. And they are super arrogant about it too, like John Cena in WWE 'YOU CAN'T SEE ME!'. Imagine 10 fo those punks coming to your way and knowing they can do what ever the **** they want. That's when you need SUPERCITIZENS to kick their tiny little asses back to where it belongs, to hosptail and to mommas little sagging titties. It's time to draw the blood then, no need to hold back.
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HershOstropoler
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quote:
Originally posted by DinoDoc
You're not really telling me anything. How is it a silly, utterly useless practice? I'm not interested in advocating for it. I'm only interested in trying to better understand your position on the matter.
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Just at the practical level: What's the point of it? If you have working parole boards and parole standards, it's pointless. And it is silly as in effect, a judge or jury is supposed to decide a parole issue that is 20 or 30 or even 50 years down the road, and taking away any incentive from the convict to behave.
"I find this curious. Is there any reason why a person wouldn't be sentenced for each time the committed a crime?"
Each time, probably yes. But it was one act of being an accessory to what would likely have to be seen as one criminal act. On two separate acts of murder, he could get 2 times 15 years, and I think under german law he would have to serve both even if it is one trial, but I'm not fully sure on that last point.
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HershOstropoler
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quote:
Originally posted by shawnmmcc
what is the situation with rapists and child molestors? The reason I ask is those are two groups of criminals who go out to re-committ the crime very often (recidivsim). Do you get press coverage of these monsters who get a short sentence and reoffend, or do the new EU privacy laws protect them? Better yet, do any of you have any hard figures on the reoffend rates after they get out?
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Privacy laws (and EU privacy law is just covering a part of that area, mostly data protection law) don't stop the press from covering the cases, just from identifying individuals, in most cases at least. As for criminal pedophiles, often a case for Psychiatry. More difficult with rapists, especially first time rapists. We had problems with early pardons/releases a few years ago, the standards have been tiightened since.
"Our problems are in the opposite direction."
Not really. A wrongful conviction does not only mean an innocent person in prison, it also means one criminal on the streets.
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11-12-2003 13:43
) what is the situation with rapists and child molestors? The reason I ask is those are two groups of criminals who go out to re-committ the crime very often (recidivsim). Do you get press coverage of these monsters who get a short sentence and reoffend, or do the new EU privacy laws protect them? Better yet, do any of you have any hard figures on the reoffend rates after they get out?
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