13-12-2003 11:09									#1
	Econ: Please explain why the feared outcome of this concept is flawed and simplistic Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

I'm sorry, but I might as well be asked to build a nuclear reactor before explaining even pseudo economics to morons. Here's a post from a person in another forum who pisses me off; and the post istelf pisses me off as well and I don't know why.

quote: Who here from the U.S. supported both the Iraq War, AND the huge tax cuts? Quite a few of you, I'm guessing... You realize what a glaring contradiction this is, don't you? Even under the rosiest forecasts of economic rebound, the huge tax cuts are going to cost more than a trillion dollars in revenue. And, at the same time, we're spending hundreds of billions (and who knows how much more) on increased military spending and reconstruction.... How in God's name can you support BOTH??? You all do realize that you are mortgaging your future away, don't you? You do realize that having a crushing debt load will itself inhibit economic growth, right? You know, interest rates... Are you all the same kind of folks that run up $50,000 in debt on your credit cards at 15% interest or something? Have you ever heard of fiscal responsibility? Did it occur to you that these policies are the most irresponsible fiscal policies of any president in modern history? I REALLY REALLY want you all to explain this....

What answer would you give to this, in a polite manner. As well - what is the leading accepted train of thought regarding; both by field & institution?

Thank ya

	13-12-2003 12:48									#2
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is this related to the coconut headed guy in some way?

	13-12-2003 13:17									#3
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* Urban Ranger waits for Kid to arrive

	13-12-2003 14:01									#4
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Economics is the college boy's Astrology.

	13-12-2003 14:28									#5
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger * Urban Ranger waits for Kid to arrive

Oh we see how you are -- you no longer have any respect for Adam Smith on Apolyton, do you?

	13-12-2003 21:24									#6
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Zylka -- The post pisses you off because (a) you don't agree with it and (b) he's right.

	13-12-2003 22:09									#8
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun Oh we see how you are -- you no longer have any respect for Adam Smith on Apolyton, do you?

Pah, I see your troll and raise you one

	13-12-2003 22:30									#9
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*enters cynic suit*

I would reply him that pre-war projections by major banks have indicated that the benefit of oil harvesting from Iraq will totally cover the cost of war within a decade whereas the oil harvesting will continue beyond the 10 year limit.
And then I'd advice him to start seeing further than his nose into the financial future.

	13-12-2003 22:34									#10
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(of course I would be lying, or rather not telling the whole truth 'cause unpredictability in how Iraq goes or the whole region or future events can very well change all that - besides Iraq now looks like scenario #3 which was the worse case scenario)

	13-12-2003 23:19									#11
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quote: Originally posted by Zkribbler Zylka -- The post pisses you off because (a) you don't agree with it and (b) he's right.

In other words, you don't know in depth econ either. Great, next

	14-12-2003 00:37									#12
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quote: Originally posted by Urban Ranger * Urban Ranger waits for Kid to arrive

Isn't there another thread just like this right now?

Zylka,

What exactly pisses you off?

	14-12-2003 00:43									#13
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quote: Originally posted by MrFun Oh we see how you are -- you no longer have any respect for Adam Smith on Apolyton, do you?

I've never seen him comment on this topic.

	14-12-2003 02:08									#14
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Then he doesn't deserve the username Adam Smith!!

	14-12-2003 03:11									#15
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considering the US economy is starting to pick up, I am willing to give Bush a chance, and tell mr thingy that he's being silly and a tad rash.

	14-12-2003 04:49									#16
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quote: Originally posted by Zylka In other words, you don't know in depth econ either. Great, next

It doesn't take a genius. Let me explain it to you:

Usually, borrowing is a bad idea. You borrow a dollar from me and have to pay back two. Are you better off or worse off? Worse off--because you're down a dollar.

Sometimes, borrowing can be good. You borrow a dollar from be, invest it, get back the original dollar plus two more, pay me my two dollars and keep the third dollar for yourself. Are you better off or worse off? Better off--because you're up a dollar.

What has Bush done? He's borrowed more money than any other President in history. Has he invested it? No.

He's given most to the richest Americans, hoping they'd let money trickle down into the rest of America. They haven't. We're three million jobs down and after three years the economy is starting to slog its way back to where Bush took over. Bush squandered the rest of the borrowed money on Iraq. No return on investment there.

So all Bush's borrowing has done it to put the U.S. in the biggest financial hole in the history of humanity.

	14-12-2003 05:26									#17
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Oh, what love I have for Zylka's posts.

EDIT: Too bad they disappear.

	14-12-2003 05:27									#18
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You know, Z, in retrospect, FDR should not raised tax rates the way he did during WWII. He should have financed the whole war through deficit spending. We had suffered for years with deflation until WWII. The deficit spending erased all that and really got the economy booming.

A booming economy means jobs, prosperity and growth.

It is really hard to justify a budget surplus when you come to think about it. So long as the growth rate equals or exceeds the growth of the national debt as a percentage of GNP budget deficits seem to be good as they spur economic growth.

	14-12-2003 05:27									#19
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Uh oh, looks like Zylka's banned again.

	14-12-2003 05:34									#20
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hi ho the kween?

	14-12-2003 09:28									#21
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Ned,

Are you a Keynesian?

	14-12-2003 10:02									#22
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Zylka:

You may not like the tone of the post, but he's right. The US is borrowing money to pay for current consumption. That means we have less money available to replace our current capital that wears out, or buy new capital we need. Governments should only do this sort of thing to finance a really big war (WWII, not this Gulf stuff) or fight off a big recession (1930's, 1970's). Otherwise governments should be able to balance their spending over the business cycle. What we are doing is breaking open our piggybank to buy candy. Another reason I'm really pissed off at Bush.

Mr. Fun:

I am honored.


Laz:

Your just jealous because we get all the wimmens.