20-12-2003 19:06									#1
	Mass Upgrade, exploit or game mechanism Got spare money?

Mass Upgrading has been around from the time of one of the earliest patches of the Original Civ3 to today in C3C. It allows you to upgrade all of your Units, of a particular type, that are able to upgrade (i.e. in barracks cities, have proper resources and enough money) them all at once.

But, if a unit moves to a Barracks city and has NO movement left when it arrives, should it be allowed to be upgrade via Mass upgrade??

The reason is that this had came up last night, during chat, because we could have Upgraded 2 Knights instead of 1 with using the Mass Upgrade feature. We didn't, because *shudder* it could be used as an exploit. Personally, I've never considered it as being an exploit, especially because it's been in the fame from almost the very beginning (IIRC, one of the game playability fixes that they had place into the game).

So people, last night wasn't a real problem, because of only not having 1 knight upgraded. It's not going to kill us. BUT, will there be a time that we want to do that?? Would we need to do that??

What say you??

E_T

	20-12-2003 22:27									#2
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Well, mass upgrading only works for units in Baracks and only then if you have enough cash for it [which can be a very large some indeed], so I don't think of it as an exploit.

	20-12-2003 22:37									#3
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It is an exploit; unfortunately Firaxis has never remedied the situation.

	20-12-2003 23:02									#4
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I've never really thought about it before, but considering the vitriol surrounding units getting an extra move (i.e. fortifying before they shouldn't) with the fort-all command, I'd say that any of our units getting an extra move with the upgrade all is along the same lines. Let's just avoid using it.

	20-12-2003 23:18									#5
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exploit. It would be harder to catch someone doing this than the move-fort all trick.

note: upgrading also heals to full, a nifty little thing that's helped me out occassionally

	20-12-2003 23:54									#6
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

It's considered an exploit because there's a trade-off to upgrading: losing a turn. By doing the mass upgrade, basically you ignore that tradeoff since the unit can move next turn. At least that what the people argue.

However, we don't know if this was intentional by Firaxis. If it is, then it is not an exploit.

	21-12-2003 02:48									#7
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exploit, as you're gaining a turn of movement..

	21-12-2003 03:20									#8
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Exploit

	21-12-2003 05:00									#9
	Remove this text

What Rhoth said.

Should I put a or after that?

	21-12-2003 05:17									#10
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I, too, agree it would be better to avoid it... units are apparently meant to be upgradable only with some movement points left (otherwise, one could individually upgrade even units that used all of their mps).

Though, I would consider this more of a thing to agree upon - if everybody (all teams) agree it's ok, I wouldn't mind, since everybody can do that, nobody is disadvantaged (unlike with the fortify all trick).

	21-12-2003 19:53									#11
	Got spare money?

Why not bring it up at the UN? Personally I have no problem with this, as long as all the teams know about it.


Dominae

	21-12-2003 20:24									#12
	Remove this text

I would consider it a Cat II "exploit" as described in this thread.

	22-12-2003 10:54									#13
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ok, so everyone who made fun of me during the turnchat for not upgrading that horseman, eat my shorts!

	23-12-2003 02:10									#14
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Upgrade a horse? We have Chiv? Where is that damn lexicon thread!!!!!!

	23-12-2003 04:49									#15
	Remove this text

In my Conquests game, I found that any unit could move and upgrade the in the same turn as long as it had any movement points remaining indivdually and also that units upgraded using upgrade all can't move afterwards until next turn .

So the upgrade all feature/exploit seems to only affect units that have already moved their full movement.

In which case, as long as we issue an upgrade all before moving any units, it's 100% fine for speeding up order execution. (Athough sometimes not the wisest money decision)

	23-12-2003 04:50									#16
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deleted

Don't know how this happened

Last edited by joncnunn on 24-12-2003 at 05:41

	23-12-2003 06:27									#17
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?

	23-12-2003 07:00									#18
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quote: Originally posted by Master Zen ok, so everyone who made fun of me during the turnchat for not upgrading that horseman, eat my shorts!

* E_T could think of several things to say to that comment, but he won't....

E_T

	23-12-2003 23:32									#19
	Put an end to popups!

As per Rhoth's post, avoid it.

	24-12-2003 04:15									#20
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

As per E_T's post, avoid it.

	24-12-2003 12:58									#21
	Support Apolyton

As per Beta's and Trip's posts, agree.