02-01-2004 23:00									#1
	Not so Industrious in C3C Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

While reading through the fora, I keep seeing several posts saying that the Industrial trait has been nerfed in C3C.

Granted, I've only played a few epic games (and only 1 as Industrious--Maya), but I've failed to see this 'nerfing'.

Two reasons come to mind:
1. It's really not that bad.
2. (more likely) My inattentiveness has kept me from seeing it.

So, I ask those whom may know (or just think they know),

How has the Industrial trait been toned-down in C3C, exactly?

Thanks,

Steven

	02-01-2004 23:29									#2
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The bonus to workers was toned down from 100% to 50%. Example: Say it would take a non-industrious worker 4 turns to complete a job. In PTW, it would have taken an industrious worker 2 turns to complete that job, while in Conquests it takes an industrious worker 3 turns to complete the same job.

	02-01-2004 23:49									#3
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Aahh. OK, come to think of it, it did seem that roads were taking a bit longer than I thought they should've. However, it was harder to tell because of all the Slaves that I got as the Maya. I just blamed it on Slaves/Government.

Thank you Rothaerill.

So, I guess that makes Democracy and Fascism even more desireable. (Along w/ Replaceable Parts)

Steven

	03-01-2004 01:37									#4
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also, slave workers don't recieve a bonus any more for industrious civs.

	03-01-2004 03:13									#5
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And they pain of non industrious civs tring to RR is so great. Especially with lots of slaves in ratio to native workers.
You keep adding another and another worker to get the job done. You find yourself wonder if it will ever be done. Thanks so much for replacement parts to give us some help. I haved actually move it up on my research list from the old days so ease my grief.

	03-01-2004 13:39									#6
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Always hated using those lazy slaves. Anyway to improve their speed?

	03-01-2004 13:48									#7
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nope. nothing other than standard worker improvements.

	03-01-2004 13:51									#8
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You're not paying for them, don't complain

Actually...
You are probably ticking a civ off
(a good thing however )

	03-01-2004 13:52									#9
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quote: Originally posted by Vince278 Always hated using those lazy slaves. Anyway to improve their speed?

Excuse me if this is too obvious... but personally I take the slaves to increase the pop of a city with at least 10 shields, and I build a 'true' worker to replace it.

	03-01-2004 13:59									#10
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The thought had occurred to me, but the idea of a unit with no maintenance is TOO good for me to pass up

	03-01-2004 14:05									#11
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quote: Originally posted by Oncle Boris Excuse me if this is too obvious... but personally I take the slaves to increase the pop of a city with at least 10 shields, and I build a 'true' worker to replace it.

Slave-laundering? I like it!

	03-01-2004 16:38									#12
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It's a good change too.........the trait is no longer imbalanced with the others.

	03-01-2004 20:44									#13
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quote: Originally posted by Oncle Boris Excuse me if this is too obvious... but personally I take the slaves to increase the pop of a city with at least 10 shields, and I build a 'true' worker to replace it.

True, but one of the negative aspects is a greater war weariness factor in those cities if you happen to fight their mother country (not if its already 'disappeared' of course).

AJ

	04-01-2004 00:05									#14
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I always use the slaves, never add them to cities. They are free maitenance and war weariness is a pain when you fight their mother country as stated, especially on Emperor level.

	04-01-2004 10:16									#15
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This brings up a question. Foreign nations assimilate at the end of each era, right?

	04-01-2004 10:40									#16
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i usually have 3-5 native workers that i pay for, and the rest (15-20) are slaves that don't cost squat. Love it!

I often find myself starting wars, just because i see undefended workers that i can snatch real quick to boost my 'force'! Though thats just real early in the game, when other civs are easy to make peace with. Though all those slaves still have their uses up till the modern age!

	04-01-2004 12:17									#17
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

In my current game I really miss the old industrious trait and the half speed for slaves. As a non industrious civ I had (after rep parts) 8 natives and 20 slaves to get one pollution tile on a mountain cleared. That is painful.

	04-01-2004 16:42									#18
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Hehe they work for free..........stop whining.

	04-01-2004 19:51									#19
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quote: Originally posted by jimmytrick This brings up a question. Foreign nations assimilate at the end of each era, right?

It's not at the end of each era.

There is an editor field called "Assimilation Chance" (Gov tab), which ranges from 1% to 4% - not sure if there is anything else affecting the assimilation speed, but this suggests it's at least partially random with a probability tied to the government type.

	05-01-2004 22:49									#20
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Is that chance for each foreign citizen, or for each city with them?

	06-01-2004 07:30									#21
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each citizen
Slave workers.Free=Good

	07-01-2004 05:42									#22
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Industrious is still terrific.

One just needs more slaves.

	07-01-2004 09:33									#23
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I don't know about terrific, but not being industrious is painful.

	07-01-2004 11:35									#24
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From you, vmxa1, that is high praise.

'Nuff said.

	07-01-2004 13:44									#25
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quote: Originally posted by vondrack It's not at the end of each era. There is an editor field called "Assimilation Chance" (Gov tab), which ranges from 1% to 4% - not sure if there is anything else affecting the assimilation speed, but this suggests it's at least partially random with a probability tied to the government type.

I thought I had read somewhere it was related to the culture in that city, or the culture per turn. Sort of the same idea as in flipping.

Am I crazy, or have others got this info stuck in their brain as well?

	07-01-2004 15:52									#26
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quote: Originally posted by vmxa1 I don't know about terrific, but not being industrious is painful.

I myself never played industrious civs to that extent that I miss the trait when I donīt have it so when I do get around playing an industrious civ it all feels like a big bonus

edit: for me itīs painful not beeing religious

	07-01-2004 18:42									#27
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Industrious is balanced now; it's nice, just not the ubertrait like before. When you played a non-industrious Civ before it was awful in comparison.

	07-01-2004 20:40									#28
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afaik assimilation is part total culture and new city culture per turn and new civ gov type vs old civ's gov type. i think the we love the * day has an effect too.

	08-01-2004 09:04									#29
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quote: Originally posted by smellymummy afaik assimilation is part total culture and new city culture per turn and new civ gov type vs old civ's gov type. i think the we love the * day has an effect too.

Can you, unlike me, remember from whence this info came?

	08-01-2004 09:59									#30
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Off topic a bit - I always thought it a bit odd that I could have slave workers, even when in a democracy. Good thing there aren't any Abolutionists around .