06-01-2004 22:13									#1
	City on one-square island Support Apolyton

In my current game, I have had a city on a one-square island, which is quite common as such an island makes a good city site. I left a rifleman there to defend it, but later I figured I could have quite safely left it undefended, as nobody has Amphibious Warfare (and only a land unit can capture a city, and only a marine has amphibious capability) and my government is Democracy (so can't be bribed). Is that correct?

	06-01-2004 22:26									#2
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

You can't leave it undefended completely. If shield support is the problem use a dip or camel. But don't leave it empty. Any mil-unit, explorer, or even a settler can walk off a boat into an empty city and take it.

Monk

	06-01-2004 23:05									#3
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

FWIW, a paratrooper could take it as well, but that's post-marines anyway.

Definitely leave a dip/spy in the house.

	07-01-2004 01:53									#4
	Full PM-box? Change here!

Some other city can provide the shield support for a military unit -- your camel/dip is at risk should a wandering boat choose to bombard, thus emptying out the city. I haven't seen the one-two punch, but then again, I usually don't leave these prizes empty too long.

	07-01-2004 04:01									#5
	Remove this text

And remember not to defend it with a early ship. The city itself doesn't count as a land square so your ship may sink since it didn't end it's turn next to a land square.

	07-01-2004 11:21									#6
	Tired of ads?

Whoa, I'd never heard that one. I suppose that any time I may have left a Trireme touching no land tiles except a city I got lucky?

	07-01-2004 11:33									#7
	Lose 30 kilos (of popups)

A city counts as a land tile. If you're next to it, you're fine. But being IN a one-tile island city, you're not NEXT TO land, and you sink. Stupid bug, one must suppose.

	07-01-2004 13:24									#8
	Help yourself to an AD-FREE life

Yup - the Sinking Trireme Syndrome - one of the more endearing 'features' of the game

	07-01-2004 18:06									#9
	Support Apolyton or Terrorists Win

quote: Originally posted by debeest A city counts as a land tile. If you're next to it, you're fine. But being IN a one-tile island city, you're not NEXT TO land, and you sink. Stupid bug, one must suppose.

Thanks for saying it more clearly. This is what I meant.

	07-01-2004 18:25									#10
	Get a bigger avatar today!

That's a new one on me... Pretty funny, actually.

	07-01-2004 20:46									#11
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Another "issue" with one-tile island cities: when you want to build a wonder in one using caravans you have built in the city, you need to load them into a boat and make them "arrive" again so you get the "use for Wonder" box. They have to exit and re-enter the city.

	07-01-2004 21:28									#12
	Support Apolyton, buy Alpha Centauri

Isn't that the case with all cities though? Or have I not noticed the ability to just convert camels stationed in the city into wonder shields and spent years moving them in and out?

	07-01-2004 21:42									#13
	Increase Your PM Length

Yes, but with one-tile islands you need a boat to let them exit and re-enter the city.

	08-01-2004 13:59									#14
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I know, I was just pointing out that that was a bit obvious, given that you can't move the camels to any other square before feeding them back in. Well, unless you build roads on the sea squares, à la Civ 1.

	08-01-2004 21:02									#15
	Support Apolyton, buy GURPS/ Alpha Centauri

I think Ellie made a worthwhile point. Nothing is obvious about this game. There are no multicolored flashing banners (in the game anyway). You have to think and plan ahead for almost everything.

And for a series of contributions to someone who might not have done something before this boat idea is a good idea.

Here is an extention of that idea to demonstrate a way that scenario might be worth doing. It is late in the game and you are researching Genetic Engineering with the idea of building the Cure. If you build CfC in one of your newer cities, its effects will take place for all the later cities in the list THIS turn...a very good result. If that city is going to be this one tile island, you better have a boat handy.

But if you have never done this sort of thing before, duke, I don't think needing a boat would be obvious.

Monk

	08-01-2004 21:11									#16
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

I'd have thought that if you were aware that you could contribute camels to a building project, then it'd be pretty obviouswhat would be required, even though the city is on it's own. The clever thing here is to ensure that you have the boat in the city at the start of the turn, and the camels asleep. This way you can move one square out of the city, and then wake the camels to reenter it. If you move onto a boat then it costs all of your movement points so you'd use two turns moving the camels out onto a waiting boat and then back into the wonder.

	08-01-2004 21:27									#17
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

duke,

That's helpful; and a good point. See how much better that feels.

Monk

	09-01-2004 09:12									#18
	Avatar Enlargement: We've got the solution

My point was prompted by a memorable experience trying to do an OCC on a great 4xWhale single tile island site. I'm sorry if it might have seemed obvious to others; it was just a "trick" of the game I had not realized before.

	09-01-2004 20:47									#19
	Support Apolyton, buy Call to Power 2

Early on you may need more that one ship.
Moving 6 or 8 caravans out to come back with one ship that only carries 2-3, doesn't cut it.

	09-01-2004 21:03									#20
	Support Apolyton, pre-order Civilization IV

OCC on a single tile island sounds a pretty serious challenge for the very reason that rah has pointed out. With the fact that you have to keep your triremes outside of the city in case they sink, then it would be very tough to build a wonder in one turn.

	09-01-2004 23:33									#21
	Get a bigger avatar today!

Like I said, it was "memorable"...

I took a risk on the first Wonder, moving the trireme into the city at the end of the turn before the build, so I could go out with two, deliver them, go back in and reload, and go out again. The second time I tried that I lost the trireme at the end of the turn. Took me several turns to rebuild the trireme.

	10-01-2004 02:55									#22
	Support Apolyton buy from Amazon

Elephant - If your boat starts adjacent to the city, it can move in with its first move, load the camels, move out, unload the camels, go back to sleep. No risk of sinking is necessary.

By the way, I have long been fascinated by 1-city islands. Once I created an Easter Island game using the Pacific Ocean map. Of course, there were no nearby specials, just a 1-square hill in the middle of nowhere in the ocean. It was really hard do figure out how to make progress because the maximum production is 1 shield per turn until offshore platforms and food is scarce for a long time. By the time I had a caravel to get to Hawai'i, it was like 1300AD. I couldn't think of too many ways to play differently. One time I tried building Lighthouse right away, but it expired by the time I built it.

Perhaps when the Succession gamers are looking for the ultimate challenge they can dust it off.

	11-01-2004 22:24									#23
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Start mining the hill before you found - sounds fairly essential to me...

	12-01-2004 01:09									#24
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization 2

Grigor: I was trying to get all 4 camels in the same turn...

	12-01-2004 13:24									#25
	Get a bigger avatar today!

... yes move -1 walk two camels onto ship adjacent to city, turn 0 walk camels into city - move ship into city slep two more camels, move ship out of city, walk camels back in...

There is a problem?

Stu

	12-01-2004 14:52									#26
	Support Apolyton, buy Civilization: The Boardgame

Elephant - Ah, I see. Your choices for triremes seem to be restricted to: (1) Use 2 turns (as per SG1), (2) Use 2 boats, (3) risk sinking by parking the trireme in the city overnight, (4) wait till Nuclear Powered triremes and load 'em up twice...

	13-01-2004 20:36									#27
	Support Apolyton, buy Galactic Civilizations: Deluxe Edition

quote: Originally posted by Grigor By the way, I have long been fascinated by 1-city islands. Once I created an Easter Island game using the Pacific Ocean map. Of course, there were no nearby specials, just a 1-square hill in the middle of nowhere in the ocean. It was really hard do figure out how to make progress because the maximum production is 1 shield per turn until offshore platforms and food is scarce for a long time. By the time I had a caravel to get to Hawai'i, it was like 1300AD. I couldn't think of too many ways to play differently. One time I tried building Lighthouse right away, but it expired by the time I built it. Perhaps when the Succession gamers are looking for the ultimate challenge they can dust it off.

We already played something like that and it was real fun, starting in a pacific Island (samoa I believe) and using one of my gigaworld map. By the time we reached america, Mongols had mobile warfare and we had to fight about 200 armors in south Mexico.
The name of the succession game was : "The truest gift of the Gods", as we were given intellinge but no land !
You should be able to find it in the forum, it was, I believe in 2002.

One could imagine starting another one, especially if I manage to finish another gigaworld map